3.4: A new XAI version starting in PDER!

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MadMardigan

Here's looking at you, kid!
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Re: A new XAI is on it's way!!

Hello,

I asked Xerxy if I could write about what we're doing here in the beta testing and he asked me to write up a review. So since I'm quite new around the forums Xerxy thought it would be a good idea to introduce myself. I'll get into some very exciting details on the AI and how it's coming along. This will be the First of several reviews and I'll focus on the battle AI for now.

Introduction:

So who is Madmardigan? Well I'm a modder much like a quite a few of you around here. I started modding on Ghost Recon and did the typical modder-thing by tinkering with the game files. That was my introduction into scripting and I had a blast. The next game I modded was Operation Flash Point and in that game I really began to dive into every modding aspect imaginable. Scripting, AI development, 3D Modeling, Texturing, Sound Editing, Video Editing... you name it, I probably did it. I'm very passionate about video games, and much like everyone else I have my own ideas on how things should be lol. That's most likely the reason I began modding in the first place. I've overloaded my HD with editing programs for pretty much every possible avenue necessary to mod a game. I've left very little room for anything else but I leave aside room for my favorite video games and Medieval Total War II Kingdoms is no exception!

I originally came to these forums to update my MTWIIK game, I dug through and picked different mods that suited me. I've been playing the game off and on since the initial release so I know the community has been through the hoops on several situations. I ran across a post that mentioned XAI and had a link here. I happily jumped in and snagged up the latest XAI (3.2) to use in my game. I've used a couple in the past but this seemed like a great step in the right direction. I dug further in the forums here to find that these guys have a continued effort in developing XAI. That was something I was very happy to hear about. I'm an impatient person that just happens to be a "modder", I decided I wanted to help out the team and speed up the process of getting the new XAI out the door so I offered to pick up some of the smaller, tedious tasks like testing and creating a self install package for the mod.

Now mind you I'm in the beginning stages of a mod in a completely different game. I've now put all that on hold since I've tested the new XAI 3.4, the results absolutely speak for themselves! Most of you are like me and probably are tired of hearing... "THE AI IS COMPLETELY FIXED!!!!" As a community this statement has been made off quite a few of the official patch's. So when someone tells me how good the AI is I tend to have a little voice deep in the back of my head. That little voice tells me, "there will be something wrong, there will be an exploit..." and it assures me that time will reveal these faults. Another side of that is full of hope. Up until now the little voice has been correct and with every patch, statement and failed attempt, that little voice grew...until XAI 3.4...

The testing platform we're using is XAI 3.4 geared for PDER 1.0a. I've never played PDER but I'm going to tell you, they complement each other like spaghetti and meatballs! We've had some small issues but let me tell you, this has been a blast. The working elements of the XAI 3.4 blew my mind. I honestly couldn't believe what I was seeing! For those of you who didn't know, XAI is featured in quite a few mods and they have plans for updating many more. If you have a mod, make sure you check this out on the release date, I'm absolutely sure you will want this running in your mod!

I felt as though the original lackluster AI was horrible, it wasn't tough enough, smart enough and it just wasn't working. I got to beta test this new version of XAI 3.4 and what I found (and I know you will too) is that all those issues are no longer an issue! It goes beyond that though, the experience I am having with XIA 3.4 is what I should have had with MTWII from day one!

I promise you, in terms of difficulty this is dead on target. It's not cheap either, there are logical reasons behind the AI's movement not just in the Campaign AI but also in the Battle AI and Diplomacy! It's not predictable, there are no catch's, exploits or just plain BS! They fixed the bugs and glitches that CA so kindly left for us... I am not over exaggerating! Even with a few things out of place, I would rather have this beta version than any other AI currently out!

I'm seeing the XAI maneuver intelligently and methodically on the battlefield! I'm seeing the XAI use diplomacy as it should have done from the release! I'm experiencing an AI that operates on causality! XAI 3.4 has made playing MTWIIK fun again!

During beta testing I began to feel irritated, none of my usually strategies were working. I started to think the AI was too overbearing but then I realized what had happened. I've been playing a video game that shipped with broken AI and I roamed around freely with very little consequence to my actions. I wanted a settlement... it was mine. I had become, to some degree oblivious to the faults of the AI and it had impacted me beyond a level that I was unaware of. Now with XAI you can't just do what you want, you have to plan strategically and balance a fine line between loss and victory. There is a very real feeling of freedom in that! No more weak victories... when you win against the XAI you will actually feel accomplished no matter how small the victory is! You will know and understand what defeat is, and it won't come in a cheap way!

From what I gather about the XAI team, these guys are passionate about their mod, they've put in countless hours over many years to bring you this and it shows. I feel extremely lucky to be just a small part on the trailing end. So when the AI whoops your butt, make sure you rep the team and thank them!

In the next few posts I'll dissect some engagements with video and pics. I'll also show you some of the tactics the XAI has in store for you! It's OK to be excited about this guys, from one modder to another this is a very sure thing and it will deliver!
 
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Re: A new XAI is on it's way!!

Here it IS
a video preview of the New XAI 3.4 in action!!

See it

HERE
 
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Re: A new XAI is on it's way!!

reserved for review 2
 
Re: A new XAI is on it's way!!

reserved for review 3
 
Re: A new XAI is on it's way!!

reserved for review 4
 
I moved the other posts out of this thread to the XAI 3.4 and beyond thread, please discuss ideas and such there. This is for the preview. This thread is now closed. Thank you ;)

Great Job on that Video!! Can you do more when you get some time! I think many people will really like to see what this next one can do. Proof is all in the Video. It's too bad you didn't get my settlement battle captured on video, because I lost, when I got overzealous.
 
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Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

Men this is a thrill - eat this all non believers! :cool: Congratz to xeryx and the team.
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

Nice. 5 stars from me.

And no, one could NEVER mistake that for a developer diary... there was actual concern about AI shown, and an actual understanding of the game shown... CA? No, sorry... I would NEVER confuse the two... ;) lol.
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

Thanks for the kind words! :thumbsup2

You guys have done such a great job on this mod! When I was recording the battle I was trying to keep good solid camera angles and shots. It was near impossible, I had to really fight with the AI to keep control so I was whipping that camera around lol.

In the footage the AI used a second line wave attack on me. They were making their way to my line and I heard the clock ticking. It was a huge amount of pressure I've not experienced with the AI before. That was an amazing battle! I honestly didn't know if I would win that, I was flip-flopping every 30 seconds lol.

The XAI uses his general as he should. He was displacing his general and using him very intelligently. I was trying to do the same but my general's unit ended up with only my general, one little guy lol. You can see him run around all alone on the battle field.

Something I didn't mention in the footage is that the AI used their archers to help in the battle as soon as they ran out of arrows. By that time our armies had been ground down to a fraction of the size. I also had to use my archers in hand to hand. It was amazing, I had to pull out every possible card to win!
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

I love this game so much more now after all our hard work. The AI and RPG elements and details... it's all coming together. We should have been the developers- with INSIDE knowledge we'd have been fast, efficient, and done within a few months I'd bet!

The CA programmers who make the systems do well, but the idiots who set up the scripts and databases (in other words the game designers) just plain suck.

We may not be the base programmers, but we know how to manipulate their f'ing code!
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

Really impressive demonstration of XBAI 3.4 guys! I hope to see another video or two of this in action :)

I wish you every success and look forward to trying this out with Kingdoms Grand Campaign Mod.

Dave
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

i watched it several times now, and i can't await the 3.4 XAI :( !

It really seems to ba a drastic change in Battle-Gameplay, just great ! :thumbsup2

- but what about the announced Beta-Test ???
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

New siege preview is just about ready guys, I apologize for the delay. I had some issues with my PC and RL was leaving me with little time. I finally captured some good video of the game play after fist fighting my rotten PC.

I must admit that I've not played the part of an attacker in sieges very often, the vanilla AI just didn't require that. I have become use to the idea of forcing the AI to sally forth onto my besieging army.

I don't want to let the cat out of the bag but there are some campaign game play changes that will entice you to be the attacker in sieges. If you choose to make the AI sally then you will pay a penalty. I won't get into details on this but as far as I'm concerned it's a much needed change to the game play mechanics and I find it implemented very well.

Perhaps if there is time before the release, I'll be able to give you guys a campaign preview. Now I need to scoot off and get this siege preview done, some of you may want to really start looking into strategies for attacking in a siege, it'll pay off lol.
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

New siege preview is just about ready guys, I apologize for the delay. I had some issues with my PC and RL was leaving me with little time. I finally captured some good video of the game play after fist fighting my rotten PC.

I must admit that I've not played the part of an attacker in sieges very often, the vanilla AI just didn't require that. I have become use to the idea of forcing the AI to sally forth onto my besieging army.

I don't want to let the cat out of the bag but there are some campaign game play changes that will entice you to be the attacker in sieges. If you choose to make the AI sally then you will pay a penalty. I won't get into details on this but as far as I'm concerned it's a much needed change to the game play mechanics and I find it implemented very well.

Perhaps if there is time before the release, I'll be able to give you guys a campaign preview. Now I need to scoot off and get this siege preview done, some of you may want to really start looking into strategies for attacking in a siege, it'll pay off lol.

That's a very interesting mechanic I'm looking forward too. A question, though - won't it handicap typical 'steppe' factions too much? Trying to siege a settlement in traditional way for the faction with weak infantry but good horse archers and lancers might be just as bad as they suffering a penalty for waiting the enemy to come out of town =)

I have faith in you guys, looking forward for next preview MadMardigan!
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

The penalty won't break your army, but it's enough to entice you to attack. I can't really comment on the emerging factions but from what I can tell it really seems to focus more so on the player.
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

That's a very interesting mechanic I'm looking forward too. A question, though - won't it handicap typical 'steppe' factions too much? Trying to siege a settlement in traditional way for the faction with weak infantry but good horse archers and lancers might be just as bad as they suffering a penalty for waiting the enemy to come out of town =)

I have faith in you guys, looking forward for next preview MadMardigan!

Your delving into the mod creators area. Remember the EDU and stuff, we only put in a few enhancements. We however try and stay true to the creators wishes. There are ALWAYS going to be issues, and it takes great effort to balance a mod. XAI or any AI is no golden cure for a mod. There are just too many variables that affect both the BAI and CAI.

Obviously the best way is to have 2 good products to start with, then balance them together.

Basically Achilla, that would fall under "beyond our NORMAL scope" of mod balancing.

I do however play around with some things PDER. Mikkl has some very good enhancements to KGCM. Naimad of course tweaks Darth Ages publicly.

The ONE thing we have learned, Balancing ALWAYS needs done..with each mod, usually it is minor. I definitely does, improve the performance.

Oh and let me stress this again..BUG FREE (the mod getting converted)!! as possible..because they do affect the BAI and CAI
 
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Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

Your delving into the mod creators area. Remember the EDU and stuff, we only put in a few enhancements. We however try and stay true to the creators wishes. There are ALWAYS going to be issues, and it takes great effort to balance a mod. XAI or any AI is no golden cure for a mod. There are just too many variables that affect both the BAI and CAI.

Obviously the best way is to have 2 good products to start with, then balance them together.

Basically Achilla, that would fall under "beyond our NORMAL scope" of mod balancing.

I do however play around with some things PDER. Mikkl has some very good enhancements to KGCM. Naimad of course tweaks Darth Ages publicly.

The ONE thing we have learned, Balancing ALWAYS needs done..with each mod, usually it is minor. I definitely does, improve the performance.

Oh and let me stress this again..BUG FREE (the mod getting converted)!! as possible..because they do affect the BAI and CAI

Once you guys put 3.4 up, I'm looking forward to my new PDER campaign (damn, long time it was since last one). Expect feedback when that happens of course. :thumbsup2
 
Re: Video preview: A new XAI starting in PDER!

I wanted to give you guys an update:

Things are going very well, with this. I have decided to do some more balancing of the game. One of my team mates is also out for a couple of days. I am unsure when he will be back at full capacity. We have been adding in many new and fun things!! I am going to extending the release on this, because I think in the end it will be worth it. Sorry.. but it is nice outside go enjoy the fresh air!!

You will have more features and surprises, and a better balanced game. it is playing pretty nicely though!! I may finally get to enjoy a full campaign of a game!!

I have gone through and balanced the cost of maintenance on most units. it was weird..hopefully the AI knows what it needs to build and not based it off of cost.

I have to do a long term test now, and look for any money issues. I have a feeling that I will find some problems there. That is the last thing I am touching.

Dearmad and Pnutmaster have added in somethings that are very special and unique to BBB4.0 and customized it to PDER. I cant believe how much it changes the game! Too fun!!

I have decided to rework the Vassals and Protectorate rules. So we will see soon, testing today and tomorrow.

EDIT: I had a CTD to track down..dang those family tree values. It took me all day to find. However the great news, is that I have really seen some amazing things going on. What you guys need to do to prepare for XAI3.4 is do a fresh clean install of PDER. It will make a ton of difference, I would recommend this step for anytime you update a mod with this Kingdoms. Sorry, I could be faster guys, but I want a high quality product that you guys can really appreciate!

The Good news is that the XAI portion of the mod is pretty much done, unless I see some adjustment I need to make. Other than that, is it mostly play testing and balancing a few things in PDER.

Testing has gone very well!! :D Now, all I need is my MadMardigan!!

OK Testing is just sweet! I am having fun!! I have put just a few finishing touches on. I have to update a couple of things, but this version is 99% final.

I am unable to find Mad Mardigan, so I will work on the installer..I know..I know it can't be that bad...we'll see.
 
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Click on my SIGNATURE to DOWNLOAD. PDER BETA (since we have new Vassalage system)

Lite is XAI only, the Final Full is the Stone forts, Xai, and BBB4.0 for PDER. I have run as many campaigns as I can. So, now I need your help for an open beta.


XAI 3.4 For PDER.

Use this installer, after you have verified a GOOD installation of PDER 1.0a
Don't forget to check you sound, if you have issues with that please fix first.

Point this installer at your med2/mods/pder1.0 directory. (YOU DIRECTORY IS PROBABLY DIFFERENT!)



HIGHLY RECOMMENDED! Downloads!
To keep the size of the installer down, and to help those with slower internet connections, I have Omited Real Horses Project, by Argent Usher. They can be Downloaded here ( http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=2040 ) I also highly recommend Agart's City Models located here ( http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=1993 )

Have fun, I will check back periodically. for any troubles. Hopefully, my team will be around to help!!
 
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Hi xeryx,

great news! I don't have much time on my hands the next few days but hopefully I can squeeze in a test game. So in case I get to it: I want to test XAI only so I have to unzip the "lite" zip and overwrite the existing files with it? Or what is in the installer?

Anyways - I'm looking forward to this. And of course I'll give you guys some beta feedback ;-)

Cheers
 
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