Warhammer will be next but what then?

**Prof** · September 12, 2015, 09:06 PM

As some of you might have noticed, I am not even slightly interested in Total War: Warhammer, since I play this series for its historical settings and Warhammer has never managed to spark my interest.

So, now that Total War: Warhammer has been announced and we have seen some footage, another question rises for me.
When they first announced the game, many players, like myself, who are not interested in that scenario at all asked about whether or not the new game means that this is the end for TW games with historical settings and the answer was that there would be no ressources taken away from the development of "classic TW titles" and that the Warhammer game was being developed by an entirely new team.

So following their regular release cycle, shouldn't there be an announcement for the next Total War game with a historical setting for next year?
Are there any rumours about a Medieval III, Empire 2, or any other TW game based in the real world, or do we really have to wait one or two years after Warhammer until we might get a new game in a historical setting? Or will they actually be able to take their time developing a new title with Warhammer serving as a filler until the next title is actually finished. (unlike several other games were at their release...)

And will the second team continue developing fantasy games after Warhammer?

**Jac_PS** · September 15, 2015, 02:46 AM

I hope that they'll make a game set in the renaisance, to fill a gap between Medieval II and Empire, but with proper mechanics, like pike and shot units, and formations, etc...
We begin with late medieval armor, knights, and slowly advance to gunpowder weapons and different army formations.
They could easily go for a Discovery Age expansion and integrate two maps ( America and Europe ) withone another.
The gameplay is already there, i mean, first nation that came into Americas found settlements and allies itself or fight with the natives ( some kind of Attila in reverse ). To even think of sailing to the west requires a far amount of technologies researched and agents ( to represent the pilots of the ships )...
I could go on and on and on....
So, this will be a very nice TW game, it's just that i feel your fear... I smell Warhammer only for a very long time and, if they produce a brand new historical TW, that will take a long time.
Sorry for my English ( I'm from Brazil ).

**kerrfox** · September 17, 2015, 03:17 PM

I feel the same way about historical TW games. However when I search for news all I get are speculative threads such as this. I guess we'll have to be patient; however for those of us who have no interest in fantasy TW games it would be nice if they at least let us know what the next historical game will be.

**Ultra123** · September 24, 2015, 06:52 PM

Im absolutely mad about Warhammer since i play the TT game, but i really do hope CA continue with the historical, even though they fluffed rome 2 which was my greatest dream. Would love to see a Med3 or perhaps Victorian era setting, or even the already suggested pike and shot.

**Heathen Hammer** · September 29, 2015, 09:39 PM

Medieval 3, most likely. Especially since next November it will be 10 years since Medieval II came out.

**Kraut** · September 30, 2015, 03:48 AM

I also think the next will be Medieval 3, although I still hope for a Victorian Setting.
However, the next historical TW might take a Little more time than usual - I can hardly imagine a Major Project like Warhammer TW will go without ANY repercussions to the historical game schedule.

**Frunk** · October 06, 2015, 06:47 AM

Like I've said elsewhere, it will probably be rubbish no matter what time period it is.

**L337 NUB** · October 09, 2015, 07:36 PM

M3 for God's sake. It is time!!! Really hopeful for that. I have no interest in Total Warhammer nor in most of the gunpowder age. I am sure the fantasy game will be fun for many (I hope so), but personally will not use purchasing power on it. Historical TW is my druthers, as it were. M3, PLEASE!!!!

**Akarios** · October 13, 2015, 09:20 PM

Frankly, it would be nice if they'd just finish the scope they started with Empire. There was so much promise in there, and CA just dropped the proverbial ball. Even THEY understood that when they released a basically very cut down NTW.

**wangrin** · October 14, 2015, 02:37 AM

As a personal thought, the most important is not the period of the future game, but new game engines.
TW3 game engines (used since ETW) are 32 bit architecture wich limit the use of memory.
Moreover, actual game engines are not "optimize" for multithreading.
So, the first task should be to create game engines based on 64 bit architecture.

Then, if CA create a new engine, I hope they will "think" moddability as a lot of features are actually deeply linked to AI and cannot be modded (Campaign map, unit formations, etc.).

I suppose that, if CA continue to use the "old" architecture, a Total War Medieval 3 fit well with actual game engines because needing few evolutions.

On the other hand, CA organize work having 2 teams. One is working on "n" TW game and the other is working on the "n+1" TW game.
Moreover, the team working on TW Warhammer is different from teams working on "historical" TW.
And, if we consider that CA add a 3rd dimension in the Warhammer game (air, after land and sea), they covert a large scale of periods.
So, "all options are on the table".

**Akarios** · October 14, 2015, 12:42 PM

Why not just create a TW engine game that provides simply the moddable base, leaving it to the player base to create their own? That would give the best of both worlds. Income by sales of the base engine, and free labor to create new games effectively. The TW modding community is very experience, capable, and passionate about what they do. We players too would have the best of both worlds, in that we could continue to get updates from CA as the engine is updated, but could then fixate on our particular historical (or fantasy as is the case with Warhammer) obsessions.

**PikeStance** · November 11, 2015, 11:28 PM

Speculative here.
When CA hired .Mitch they made a point o mentioned that he created tanks. The Warhammer supposedly has air units. It is possible that they may create a WWI- WWII era type game.
On another note such a game would be on a technical level would be similar to Empire; a little ahead of what they can do well.

**wangrin** · November 12, 2015, 01:41 AM

At least, I hope CA will keep the new features from Warhamer Total War in the future historical Total War.
We would have Land / Sea / Air.
And if CA provide a complete set of modding tool (especially the campaign map tool), a true WWI mod would be possible.

I remember CA telling that they will not work on XXth century warfare title.
But only fools never change their minds...

Moreover, this is the right period for a WWI title.

But I really hope they will port game engines to 64 bits architecture. This is the most important.

**HigoChumbo** · November 12, 2015, 11:10 AM

Well, I don't know if this is my guess or rather just my hope... but I think we might see a Pike&Shot game, ideally covering the Rennaissance and Baroque periods (1450 to 1715 would be epic, right before the Fall of Constantinople and the end of the Hundred Years War and with the muslims still present in Spain, to end with the Treaty of Utretch and the death of Louis XIV).

I seem to recall that CA said they would not be making a 3d sequel anytime soon, so that pretty much rules out Rome, Shogun and Medieval. Therefore it would be either Empire 2 (which I find unlikely) or a new game set in a yet unexplored period. So there is a good chance that we could be seeing a Pike&Shot game in the near future. I don't think they can pull off the complex military tactics of the 16th. and 17th. centuries warfare with the current state of the engine, but given that they are going to have plenty of time to develop it all while they are still busy with Warhammer (taking into account that the second and third installments of the trilogy are not going to draw nearly as many resources as the first one), I could see the next historical game being a completelly new thing with a "new" engine. So why not. And what better "new thing" than those two awesome centuries, after all, the other options are too similar to what we have already seen (Victoria would be pretty much like Napoleon/Empire, an Charlemagne is essentially a late Attila, and apparently already in the making as an expansion, so...).

That is, unless they delve into 20th. century warfare, which I personally would not like at all for TW. It just does not fit WW2, and while WWI could work (they could be using Warhammer as training ground to test flying units, and they might use the centenary as a marketing hook), I'd find outrageous to see a WWI game before Pike&Shot, to be honest.

**PontusTookEgypt** · February 05, 2016, 10:22 AM

Originally Posted by HigoChumbo

Well, I don't know if this is my guess or rather just my hope... but I think we might see a Pike&Shot game, ideally covering the Rennaissance and Baroque periods (1450 to 1715 would be epic, right before the Fall of Constantinople and the end of the Hundred Years War and with the muslims still present in Spain, to end with the Treaty of Utretch and the death of Louis XIV).

I seem to recall that CA said they would not be making a 3d sequel anytime soon, so that pretty much rules out Rome, Shogun and Medieval. Therefore it would be either Empire 2 (which I find unlikely) or a new game set in a yet unexplored period. So there is a good chance that we could be seeing a Pike&Shot game in the near future. I don't think they can pull off the complex military tactics of the 16th. and 17th. centuries warfare with the current state of the engine, but given that they are going to have plenty of time to develop it all while they are still busy with Warhammer (taking into account that the second and third installments of the trilogy are not going to draw nearly as many resources as the first one), I could see the next historical game being a completelly new thing with a "new" engine. So why not. And what better "new thing" than those two awesome centuries, after all, the other options are too similar to what we have already seen (Victoria would be pretty much like Napoleon/Empire, an Charlemagne is essentially a late Attila, and apparently already in the making as an expansion, so...).

That is, unless they delve into 20th. century warfare, which I personally would not like at all for TW. It just does not fit WW2, and while WWI could work (they could be using Warhammer as training ground to test flying units, and they might use the centenary as a marketing hook), I'd find outrageous to see a WWI game before Pike&Shot, to be honest.

I was actually thinking something like this, but with a slightly different time frame and bigger scope.

Discovery: Total War (as in the age of discovery… the title needs work)

Start in 1510 (finish in 1700) and essentially have the entire world to explore/conquer. I think what would make this time period interesting is the ability to completely alter the way history went. This has always been a factor in Total War, but I think this one could have an increased emphasis on societies adopting ore advanced technologies and then expanding their territory in crazy ways, like having the Inca adopt guns and galleons and then invading Europe, or having the Kingdom of Kongo rise from Africa and conquer China, or having Portugal conquering the Ottomans.

Playable Factions (? means possible)

Americas:
Inca Empire
Aztec Empire
Natchez People
Apachean Tribes? Some sort of selection on Western North American tribes, one or two at most.
Tarasccan? (N. Mexico)

Africa:
Mamluk Sultanate
Kingdom of Kongo
Kingdom of Mutapa
Ethiopian Empire
Songhai Empire
Moroco?
Kingdom of Maravi? (Malawi)

Europe:
Portugal
Spain
France
England
Norway-Denmark
Holy Roman Empire
Muscovy
Ottoman Empire
Poland-Lithuania
Hungary?
Sweden?

Asia:
Ming Dynasty
Safavid Dynasty (Persia)
Mughal Empire (North Pakistan)
Kazakh Khanate
Northern Yuan
Joseon? (Korea)
Vijayanagara Empire? (s. India)
Tibet?
Moghulistan? (Central Asia)
Bukhara? (Central Asia)
Taungoo Dynasty? (Burma) Ideally somewhere in South East Asia should be a faction.
Tu'i Tonga Empire? (Polynesia).

**PontusTookEgypt** · February 05, 2016, 10:24 AM

Sorry, C+P off steam, formatted it weirdly with colours:
Discovery: Total War (as in the age of discovery… the title needs work)

Start in 1510 (finish in 1700) and essentially have the entire world to explore/conquer. I think what would make this time period interesting is the ability to completely alter the way history went. This has always been a factor in Total War, but I think this one could have an increased emphasis on societies adopting ore advanced technologies and then expanding their territory in crazy ways, like having the Inca adopt guns and galleons and then invading Europe, or having the Kingdom of Kongo rise from Africa and conquer China, or having Portugal conquering the Ottomans.

Playable Factions

Americas:
Inca Empire
Aztec Empire
Natchez People
Apachean Tribes? Some sort of selection on Western North American tribes, one or two at most.
Tarasccan? (N. Mexico)

Africa:
Mamluk Sultanate
Kingdom of Kongo
Kingdom of Mutapa
Ethiopian Empire
Songhai Empire
Moroco?
Kingdom of Maravi? (Malawi)

Europe:
Portugal
Spain
France
England
Norway-Denmark
Holy Roman Empire
Muscovy
Ottoman Empire
Poland-Lithuania
Hungary?
Sweden?

Asia:
Ming Dynasty
Safavid Dynasty (Persia)
Mughal Empire (North Pakistan)
Kazakh Khanate
Northern Yuan
Joseon? (Korea)
Vijayanagara Empire? (s. India)
Tibet?
Moghulistan? (Central Asia)
Bukhara? (Central Asia)
Taungoo Dynasty? (Burma) Ideally somewhere in South East Asia should be a faction.
Tu'i Tonga Empire? (Polynesia).

**Pinarius** · February 05, 2016, 08:25 PM

I'd prefer a game that focuses on a shorter time frame, like the 30 Years War. By focusing on less, things like correct formations, military kit, buildings, family trees etc. can be fleshed out better than if it's a much longer period:

playable factions should be:

Spain / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_III_of_Spain
Austria / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferdin..._Roman_Emperor
Catholic League / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximi...tor_of_Bavaria
Protestant Union / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freder...ector_Palatine
Saxony / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_G...ctor_of_Saxony
Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigismund_III_Vasa
Russia / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_I_of_Russia
Sweden / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gustav...phus_of_Sweden
Denmark / faction leader:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_IV_of_Denmark
France / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_XIII_of_France
England / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_VI_and_I
Dutch Republic / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurice,_Prince_of_Orange
Republic of Venice / faction leader:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonio_Priuli
Ottoman Empire / faction leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mustafa_I

list of wars in the 1600s:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...1799#1600-1699

list of naval battles in the 1600s:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...y_17th_century

contemporary images:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/C...astiaan_Vrancx
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/C...:Peter_Snayers

**IlluminatiRex** · February 15, 2016, 10:47 AM

It's an unannounced Historical Title. https://forums.totalwar.com/discussi...ams-working-on

Originally Posted by CA

Historical Team – Unannounced Total War Title
Game Director - Janos Gaspar
This team most recently released Total War: ATTILA in February 2015, which went on to become our best-selling ever follow-up title. Since that game was finalised for manufacture at the end of 2014, they’ve primarily been in the early pre-production stages of our next historically-based major release. That involves planning, scheduling and researching the period, art styles and technology we want to put into the game. They’ve recently started prototyping some feature ideas and that will be the next stage of development that will keep them busy for now. It will be some time before we reveal this title. It will be huge, it will be historic. It will not be soon. It is not worth asking any more questions about it

So "Huge". Wonder what period they're going for then. My hope is either 19th-Early 20th Cent. game, or the Renaissance.

**PikeStance** · February 15, 2016, 11:29 AM

Huge? Hyperbole.

Unless it is China, it will just be another title. Hardly huge, but nice hyperbole nonetheless.

**Abdülmecid I** · February 15, 2016, 12:16 PM

Pikestance is right, "huge" is a typical marketing work that sounds impressive and is unclear enough to allow you not to make any specific commitment. Regarding the next title, obviously it's not going to be anything earlier than Charlemagne, but neither is the modern era a very strong candidate, considering the difficulty of implementing modern military tactics and equipment and the fact that both the 19th and the 18th century have been featured relatively recently. Consequently, I'm pretty sure that the game will concern the chronologically next historical era, the Medieval Age. Medieval Europe is the most popular period of history, CA could use material from Warhammer and Attila and there hasn't been any similar Total War game, since 2007. I bet that the starting date will be a bit later than in Medieval II, sometime near the 3rd Crusade and not just before the 1st one. The game will also have a different title, being given CA's statement and more importantly the fact that Medieval is not very catchy. So, my guess is that, just like how Barbarian Invasion's sequel was renamed to Attila, the next game is going to be called Total War: Knights and will concern the period between 1187 (battle of Hattin) and 1453 (end of the 100 Hundred War and the Byzantine Empire).