Hates the games/races trait out of control.

[Silius Saurus]

Seems even if my gov's are building field of martial games or related buildings, the trait is spiralling out of control in my current game. Almost half hate the games, and making it impossible to keep my people happy.

Any thoughts?

Have tried modding the traits and export_dcr traits but do I need to start a new game?

This sort of thing really effing annoys me.

[Genghis Skahn]

Yes you'd need to start a new game.

There are only two triggers each which award the traits in existence. It's only awarded when you have > L2 gym/game field, and moreover, the last level of the trait gives you 1 piety besides the 3 unrest.

;------------------------------------------
Trigger SelfperpetuatingRacesHaterRomanVice
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

Condition Trait RacesHaterRomanVice > 0

Affects RacesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 2

;------------------------------------------
Trigger RacesHaterRomanViceFromAmphitheater
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEndInSettlement

Condition FactionType f_rome
and not SettlementBuildingExists > small_gymnasium

Affects RacesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 2

;------------------------------------------
Trigger SelfperpetuatingGamesHaterRomanVice
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

Condition Trait GamesHaterRomanVice > 0

Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 3

;------------------------------------------
Trigger GamesHaterRomanViceFromAmphitheater
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEndInSettlement

Condition FactionType f_rome
and not SettlementBuildingExists > small_gymnasium

Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 2

I think the real problem is that the self-perpetuating triggers are actually missing a RandomPercent condition. Without that RandomPercent condition, once the character gets the trait, the trigger fires every single turn, causing them to spiral out of control. Well, I've just fixed that issue along with a bunch of other selfperpetuating triggers who were missing that condition.

[Silius Saurus]

Excellent, thank you for the reply.

I see you have two entries for the export_dcr files. Should I copy and paste the second one?

[Genghis Skahn]

You shouldn't copy and paste either of them, since neither fix the problem. You should consider adding a "and RandomPercent < X"(where X is any number you want from 1-100) condition to the 4 triggers posted above which can be found in your EDCT. That should fix the problem; you can copy and paste a pre-existing RandomPercent condition line from the EDCT(ctrl+f RandomPercent) to make things easier for you. The bug will be fixed in the next release, but that is still a bit further off.

[melvidh]

In the meantime as a "temporal" solution without needing to restart your campaign you could use the remove_trait command if you dont feel like it is "teasing"
Target the FM or general outside a settlement alone ( or in command of the stack) in the campaign map and in the console command type:
remove_trait this RacesHaterRomanVice
You may need to do this more than once with same character since it doesnt guarantee he wont get it again. Only removes the acquired one.

Regards:
melvidh

[Silius Saurus]

You shouldn't copy and paste either of them, since neither fix the problem. You should consider adding a "and RandomPercent < X"(where X is any number you want from 1-100) condition to the 4 triggers posted above which can be found in your EDCT. That should fix the problem; you can copy and paste a pre-existing RandomPercent condition line from the EDCT(ctrl+f RandomPercent) to make things easier for you. The bug will be fixed in the next release, but that is still a bit further off.

I think I understand. Where do I add the bit "and RandomPercent < X" in the text?

Thanks very much, BTW.

[Genghis Skahn]

Condition FactionType f_rome
and not SettlementBuildingExists > small_gymnasium

Paste the "and RandomPercent..." line below the "and" line here. "and X..." lines always go in the Condition section of the trigger

Condition Trait RacesHaterRomanVice > 0

So you need to add an "and X..." underneath this line as well.

BTW a trigger can have a max of 12 conditions.

[Silius Saurus]

OK. I'm new to this so bear with me.

I go into export_dscr_character_traits.txt and found this:

Trigger SelfperpetuatingGamesHaterRomanVice
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

Condition Trait GamesHaterRomanVice > 0

Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 3

What do I add and where?

Thanks for your input, Genghis.

[Genghis Skahn]

Trigger SelfperpetuatingGamesHaterRomanVice
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

Condition Trait GamesHaterRomanVice > 0

Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 3

I mentioned this above, the "and X" lines I posted above will go directly underneath the "Condition Trait..." line. Please see other triggers in the EDCT for the correct formatting of where that new "and..." line should be under the condition line.

These changes also aren't savegame compatible by the way. If you want to keep your save, then follow melvidh's advice.

[Nad]

Just change the “Chance 3” to “Chance 1” for starters. Those are percentages so it is currently 3% chance each turn to advance hatred. Reducing it to 1 would be a threefold decrease in advancement of that trait.

[Genghis Skahn]

However, even with a chance of 1 the trigger will still theoretically fire each turn. A RandomPercent condition will alter that by adding in an additional probability which must be included into the mix. I've tested this with the CeltiberianMerc traits...There was an issue where the CeltiberianMercSicily trait would ALWAYS trigger before the Iberian counterpart, which required leaving the city you were recruited in and spending time outside. The rough workaround for this was adding a RandomPercent condition. The trigger stopped firing every turn, and although not a fool proof solution, it by and large fixed the problem by allowing the player to choose where he would serve his merc term, as was intended. The downside to this was that getting recruited in Sicily usually took a bit longer because of the RandomPercent condition.

For example, all of our selfperpetuating triggers always have a RandomPercent condition, although all of them have a Chance of 2--this condition is used to stop the trigger from firing every round.

[Silius Saurus]

I see. So it could look like this:

Trigger SelfperpetuatingGamesHaterRomanVice
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

Condition Trait GamesHaterRomanVice > 0
and RandomPercent < 2
Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 3

[Genghis Skahn]

RandomPercent < 2 AFAIK, will make the trigger essentially NEVER fire(I could be wrong--but raising the RandomPercent # in the EDA seemed to increase the probability of an ancillary occurring). You don't want the trait to be that low or rare IMO. Just go with < 50--the trigger is supposed to affect Roman characters reasonably often, just not every turn.

and no--the syntax is wrong:

;------------------------------------------
Trigger PontosSinopeCap
  WhenToTest GeneralCaptureSettlement

  Condition SettlementName sett_105
        and FactionType f_pontos
        and Trait PontosSinope < 1
        and Trait ClientRuler < 1

  Affects PontosSinope  1  Chance  100    

;------------------------------------------

See the spacing underneath the Condition line? Every "and..." line needs to be in that format.

Likewise, the Affects line needs to be one line apart from the conditions line(s), as shown above.

[Silius Saurus]

Rare, but not common is fine with me. As to the syntax/spacing, I understand that's necessary for the text file.

Thanks, will give it a try.

[HarkonRules]

Why is the trait supposed to affect Roman characters "fairly often"? Was it really a thing that so many Roman oligarchs hated the Games? Sounds weird to me.

[Genghis Skahn]

Why is the trait supposed to affect Roman characters "fairly often"? Was it really a thing that so many Roman oligarchs hated the Games? Sounds weird to me.

You're taking those words too literally. I didn't design these triggers, but someone else did and, whether intentionally or not, made them fire every round. From what I can gleam, they didn't want the traits to be too rare. A RandomPercent < 50 condition is fine. We have oodles of selfperpetuating triggers which behave in the same fashion, and we don't see the traits associated with those steamrolling out of control. There's really nothing to be protesting here...

[HarkonRules]

Was just curious hah. I would indeed prefer this to be fixed of course, as the unrest can get annoying.

[Silius Saurus]

;------------------------------------------
Trigger SelfperpetuatingGamesHaterRomanVice
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

Condition Trait GamesHaterRomanVice > 0
and FactionType f_rome
and RandomPercent < 10

Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 2

;------------------------------------------

How does that look? I have the indentations on the text set up as they're supposed to be, but the post doesn't reflect that.

[Genghis Skahn]

You can preserve syntax by using the code function in the advanced posting options. It looks fine, RandomPercent < 10 is still very very rare, if that's what you desire. I don't have any issue with people modding their own EDCTs for their own purposes, but for the next release it will be RandomPercent < 50, for the rest of you schlubs out there

[Nad]

However, even with a chance of 1 the trigger will still theoretically fire each turn. A RandomPercent condition will alter that by adding in an additional probability which must be included into the mix. I've tested this with the CeltiberianMerc traits...There was an issue where the CeltiberianMercSicily trait would ALWAYS trigger before the Iberian counterpart, which required leaving the city you were recruited in and spending time outside. The rough workaround for this was adding a RandomPercent condition. The trigger stopped firing every turn, and although not a fool proof solution, it by and large fixed the problem by allowing the player to choose where he would serve his merc term, as was intended. The downside to this was that getting recruited in Sicily usually took a bit longer because of the RandomPercent condition.

For example, all of our selfperpetuating triggers always have a RandomPercent condition, although all of them have a Chance of 2--this condition is used to stop the trigger from firing every round.

I don't understand what you mean or what the problem is with the trigger firing each turn, if the chance of the affect is so low.

For example, the following will lead to the same outcome in my mind. Do you agree or have I misunderstood something?

Condition Trait GamesHaterRomanVice > 0
and RandomPercent < 51

Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 2



Condition Trait GamesHaterRomanVice > 0

Affects GamesHaterRomanVice 1 Chance 1