""Why do we need to create an opposition?"

[removeduser_487563287433]

I'm sorry, but if you were very close to being shipped off to Chechnya then you have precisely **** all experience with Chechnya making our personal experience with the place exactly the same.

[Panzerbear]

of course, my level of knowledge of my own country pales in comparison to a random kid off the American video game forums, whose universe revolves around British mass media. thank you very much for opening my blind eyes!!! of course we are all crawling *****es and you are the d'Artagnan!

[removeduser_487563287433]

of course, my level of knowledge of my own country pales in comparison to a random kid off the American video game forums, whose universe revolves around British mass media. thank you very much for opening my blind eyes!!! of course we are all crawling *****es and you are the d'Artagnan!

I am not spawned from these (British) video game forums like some electronic sepharim, Czar.

Here Czar has attempted less common tactic - less common perhaps because he knows how pathetic it sounds. Inventing something his opponant has said.

[Panzerbear]

OK I am through with you, Ferret. you are wasting my time. PM me if you have anything to say that is actually worth my attention.

[Carach]

Ferrets, you seem to be taking a huge ego trip by bashing Czar.

Regardless of his position you seem to pander to the community here that is vehemently against him. The guy has a right to his opinions. This is a discussion forum, not an avenue for castration via verbal argument. Let him be, or atleast refrain from referring to him in the third person. If you're arguing with him you should address him directly or not at all.

And czar's statement that Russia doesn't care about when the Chechens do as long as the region is stable is totally accurate. All Chechnya is to Russia is an oil-producing region with uppity Islamic residents who continually want to cause trouble.

Are you honestly surprised that the Russians have a puppet government that refuses the creation of an opposition? Are you serious?

I certainly hope not, because in the historical context of Russia, they have always dealt with puppets/proxies. Frankly, it appears Russia cares not about what these proxies do so long as they pay their taxes/don't interfere with Russian objectives.

Just leave the guy alone. A great number of you goad him into a debate and then go into a phase of 'rofl czar is the dumbzorz!!!11!one!1'. Chill out.

I'm tired of seeing this on the forums. Its unpleasant for debate and it does little to foment civil dialogs.

Maybe he should show respect to the other members of the forum who he constantly condemns as anti russian/western brainwashed populists? Why should we give him respect when he openly states that we are all wrong and he is right?

we have a saying here that goes along the lines of "give a little get a little"

dont give anything, dont get anything back.

Congratulations at beating him at his own game, ferrets. His passive trolling was no match for your Documentary series on this most fascinating (and irritating at the same time) species.


------------------

Now more seriously, if i dare relate this to the northern ireland situation of the past, we managed to get peace without 1) seperation (kind of heh) and 2) dictatorship. What makes its impossible for this diplomacy to work in Chechnya? (question may already be answered by the ruthlessness of both sides in the not too distant past, but then again n.i had some hateful stuff going on too)

[removeduser_487563287433]

OK I am through with you, Ferret. you are wasting my time. PM me if you have anything to say that is actually worth my attention.

Well cows can't go down stairs. I mean, that might be worth your attention. I am not sure how much you value your attention.

[Kiljan Arslan]

By stable do we mean keeping them in fear for their lives?

[Carach]

Under the boot of mr Putin.

[Panzerbear]

Now more seriously, if i dare relate this to the northern ireland situation of the past, we managed to get peace without 1) seperation (kind of heh) and 2) dictatorship. What makes its impossible for this diplomacy to work in Chechnya? (question may already be answered by the ruthlessness of both sides in the not too distant past, but then again n.i had some hateful stuff going on too)

your fundamental flaw in this case is that you are comparing Irish to Chechens.

the first ones are more or less Europeans with same values. the other ones are semi-tribal society of caucasian highlanders, who value force as ultimate decision-maker. and it also doesnt help that there are a lot of muslim extremism going on among the youth.

and because Chechen terrorists have world-wide support.
http://www.kavkazcenter.com/russ/photo/sham_protest/

[Kiljan Arslan]

I wonder why they may value force Czar mabey becuase the CSOviet uniuon at one point deported them from their homelands? Mabey because Russia won't let them peacefully leave?

[Panzerbear]

I suggest you dig deeper and actually learn about history and mentality of peoples in Northern Caucasus and Central Asia.

and yes, we did let them peacefully live. in 1996 we gave them money, freedom and ability to govern themselves. three years later they attacked neighboring Russian province of Dagestan with beefed up terrorists squads and blew a couple of buildings in Moscow and Volgodonsk. god forbid you have such a "peaceful" and "adequate" neighbor as Chechens.

furthermore, Chechens seem to fight NATO troops in Afghanistan as well. and no, I do not think one can logically reason why are they so peaceful and freedom loving, when they fight hundreds of miles away from home .
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/s...8-052b75b4c2da

let me put it this way: Chechens are by far not the easiest crowd to deal with (and Stalin's deportations have very little to do with it). if anyone can possibly restrain them - he is our best friend. and Kadyrov is just such an individual and all power to him!

[Kiljan Arslan]

Never ever said they were freedom lovers I know that when they were in power they were controlled by a salafist Goverment that had a hardline interpertation of Shariah law.

[Khan Kong]

Indeed, why do Chechens need many parties when they don't respect the state's laws but only the laws of their tribes. The latter laws are supreme to them. They need only one respectful leader to unite (almost) all the tribes to keep peace in the region, and Kadyrov does it well.
Besides, he is a member of the United Russia. Chechens won't vote for the other parties because they are either pro-western or communists, both of which Chechens hate. So don't blame Kadyrov, he just said the truth without political correctness and hypocricy.

(But I suppose that western media as always took his words out of context and made it as his main clue)

Here Czar pretends he is a grizzled veteran of some mountain war and knows better than me.

Yeah, of course from Britain one can see things better than from here

[RusskiSoldat]

Chechen society is still highly traditional, and the law of the mountain tribesmen take precedence over whatever token notions of western style democracy a few Chechens might have. They have been, in effect, governed by tribalism for centuries, if neither the Czars nor Stalin could remake them, I doubt the present government is up to the task. Kadyrov can't remake them but he can restrain them. He's as brutal a thug as any other terrorist there, but due to his power as a warlord he wields great respect and can effectively command over most of the republic.

[Ragabash]

Lets keep the discussion civil, on-topic and try to restrain from posting personal grievances.

[removeduser_487563287433]

Yeah, of course from Britain one can see things better than from here

The distance between Czar's hometown of St. Petersburg and Chechnya and my hometown of Gravesend and Chechnya is not especially different. And I have the benefit of a free press.

[Pavlik the Rus]

of course we are all crawling *****es and you are the d'Artagnan!

:laughing: Interesting, is this an international joke or our exclusive?

Well, it is much better to everyone to keep that semi-feudal order in Chechen republic (at least for now) because people simply unprepared to any different thing. We have allready 'leave them alone' in early 90-s. And so? Over 100 thousands of etnical Russians and other non-Chechens disapered, killed, slaved. Damn Eltsin. After the end of first war, they have all chances to build their country. And? Kidnapping, drugs, slavery, banditizm.... and finnaly invasion to Dagestan in attempt to create a new fire of war at Nortern Caucasus entirely.
Allmost all educated and intelegent Chechen population leave Chechya before the first war to other parts of RF.ANd i highly dobt that they will return there soon.
My opinion that within 15-20 years chechen problemm will be resolved, as soon that region will be rebuilded, people will never go after new avanturists and islamic fanatics again.

My imo about Kadyrov personnaly, well, he is not a good leader, he is a more looks like a bandit, like any feudal warlord, i don't want him as my president...
but i have a respect to him. Name at least one politic in the world who have the same fairness, he telling only what he thinking. "I am a dumb boxer, nothing more, don't expect from me somekind of miracles" (or something very similar, i don't remeber exactly, but words about dumb boxer was for sure) it is his words.

[removeduser_487563287433]

You can't handle your own freedom!

[Carach]

Yeah, of course from Britain one can see things better than from here

he's living in america, khan. how can he possibly see things better. if anything we should see things better because we are closer zomg.

[Farnan]

Stop lying about where .Czar lives, you can clearly see from this map he lives in Russia...

And thus has infinite more knowledge about Chechya...