Concilium Domorum (Discussion)

[Lifthrasir]

I'm noticing that you didn't reply that way to Aikanár when he basically said the same as me. You didn't say he was parroting.
But yes you're right. I'm wasting my time here.So no worries, I won't interfere anymore in your "kindergarten".
Have fun

[Commissar Caligula_]

Damn, just chill. Either ignore each other, or respond civilly. Pretty much every thread lately has devolved into this

[PikeStance]

I'm noticing that you didn't reply that way to Aikanár when he basically said the same as me. You didn't say he was parroting.
But yes you're right. I'm wasting my time here.So no worries, I won't interfere anymore in your "kindergarten".
Have fun

I didn't respond to Aikanar at all. There were 10 posts by the time I was able to respond, so I was selective to my responses.
You are welcome to participate, but if you are fundamentally opposed to making the house system more appealing, then I am not sure you will offer much which is the impression I was given in your response.
BTW, since you are comparing yourself to Aikanar, I actually responded to you and I more or less repeated what I had already written. if you do not want to play in the sandbox, then that's fine too. Just do not get upset If I don't let you play with my dump truck.
Again, I honestly do not have an issue with you. there was no intention to slight you.

[Halie Satanus]

This is a discussion thread. Nope is not a discussion point.

I see no need to repeat points already made and I dislike circular arguments. My comment is succinct yet as salient as any in the thread. Perhaps you shouldn't presume to tell me, or anyone, how to post.

[PikeStance]

I see no need to repeat points already made and I dislike circular arguments. My comment is succinct yet as salient as any in the thread. Perhaps you shouldn't presume to tell me, or anyone, how to post.

Sure, I will ignore the parroting for now on. Good advice!

----
Back on topic

We love to hear any other thoughts on the matter.
If not in a political capacity how can the House system be best used? Competition seems only useful if there is already broad base appeal. So how do we do that?
More importantly, can the house system be used to appeal to more citizens to participate more? The corollary issue is site activity? Is it better to first concentrate there first and then increase the appeal of citizenship?

[Iskar]

Consider that not everyone is equally interested in this whole house/patron-client relationship/genealogy thing. I like Aik, Frunk, Abdül, and Cyclops because they are awesome people, not because they are my patron/clients/whatnot. So whatever you want to do with the houses, do it in a way that doesn't force those not interested in it to participate. (Giving them political power by making them a second tier of Curial procedures was the worst instance of that, so I'm glad we seem to have abandoned that one.)

[PikeStance]

Consider that not everyone is equally interested in this whole house/patron-client relationship/genealogy thing. I like Aik, Frunk, Abdül, and Cyclops because they are awesome people, not because they are my patron/clients/whatnot. So whatever you want to do with the houses, do it in a way that doesn't force those not interested in it to participate. (Giving them political power by making them a second tier of Curial procedures was the worst instance of that, so I'm glad we seem to have abandoned that one.)

Iskar, the suggestion in the Op was designed to start a discussion. I am not set in any way at all.

[Pontifex Maximus]

I think it promotes a sense of belonging and origin at best. At worst it leads to factionalism and cronyism. Given our current lineup of citizens I highly doubt the latter would come to pass. Few of my clients are active these days unfortunately (in fact none of them I think) but when they were I had significant differences of opinion with at least a third of them. We felt no sense of loyalty to one another which would trump our sense of duty in sticking to our guns in what we consider to be best policy for the site/curia etc.

[Gaius Baltar]

Well, I had an inquiry asking for a link to some of the older material related to House competition. Here is one presented by the then named PowerWizard.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ses-Tournament

This would have been a series of contests between the great houses with points awarded for first place, second place, etc.

I don't think we need to try all of these at once, maybe choose something interesting and work at it over the course of a month or two. Maybe the banner competition would be a good place to start.

[Poach]

Been tried more than once, with what Baltar said above plus at least this time that I know of. What little remains of the Curia is actively hostile to any change and will never agree to anything like this, as this thread is once again testament to. I tried to talk Hex into just deleting the forum and starting from scratch but they weren't up for it. I also suggested moving it into the forum RPG section where, really, it now rightfully belongs: it's a bunch of people RPing a moribund government, but they didn't agree to that either.

Best to just let the few people left in here have their RP.

[Iskar]

Yes, a blatantly prejudiced view on the Curia as a homogeneous collective ignoring the variety of people active here and their very different outlooks is certainly the most comfortable way to convince oneself of one's superior maturity and intellect.

[Halie Satanus]

Best to just let the few people left in here have their RP.

The curia presides over and votes on awards, citizenship and large awards. Which is still an important task. I'd agree citizenship has lost many of it's defining qualities and what remains is a shadow of it's former responsibilities. I'd agree changes in attitude and application were needed long ago but opportunities were missed which left a clash of cultures, the archaic, the old and the new-ish. But calling it an RPG now, is just a lazy criticism, because a lot has changed and still can.

[PikeStance]

Been tried more than once, with what Baltar said above plus at least this time that I know of. What little remains of the Curia is actively hostile to any change and will never agree to anything like this, as this thread is once again testament to. I tried to talk Hex into just deleting the forum and starting from scratch but they weren't up for it. I also suggested moving it into the forum RPG section where, really, it now rightfully belongs: it's a bunch of people RPing a moribund government, but they didn't agree to that either.

Best to just let the few people left in here have their RP.

Well, members are certainly coming out of the woodwork these days. Before I respond, can I enjoy the irony by pointing out that the former Gaming Hex hostility to role-playing? It is cute and certainly not without merit. However,...
A forgotten aspect of this site is its "role-playing" atmosphere. You could say this place was at its best when the role-playing (Roman titles, expressions and the like) was at its peak. The less role-play the pretentious it became and the less inviting it was. The Curia and the site has, over time, became less interesting and less active.

Personally, I think one of the biggest mistakes it made was changing the name of the document that defines the site as a "Constitution." in the first place. It is too stale and misleading. This isn't a government. The site is not pseudo government at all. Citizenship is an advisory group, but a legislature. The fact that it votes on items is a matter of convenience. Is there a better method? It obviously makes sense that citizens approve others for membership. The large awards is a means to encourage continued contribution. The Curia functions as an extension of the administration not separate from. It awards citizenship, site awards and acts as an advisory board. it is really the second aspect that has rather foolishly marginalized over the years. The Curia over the years has lost its way. What you are seeing now is the Curia trying to find its way. Pessimistically, it has yet to rock bottom yet. Perhaps when it does, it will redefine itself to what it was. it could happen sooner rather than later. However, just because it has not found its way, does not justify its removal in the least.

Thank you for sharing your point of view.

[Poach]

If you'd care to visit the play by post RPG section of the board I think you'll find that I don't hold any hostility to RPing. It's the only forum I'm still active in, and I was active there while in Hex.

I'm also fully behind your idea, I just have no faith that the curial clique will let you change their game.

Sent from my SM-A310F using Tapatalk

[Iskar]

You will have to acknowledge the fact that a number of people involved in the Curia, including me, neither treat nor perceive their involvement here as roleplaying. As far as I am concerned roleplay should be kept to the RPG section.

[PikeStance]

If you'd care to visit the play by post RPG section of the board I think you'll find that I don't hold any hostility to RPing. It's the only forum I'm still active in, and I was active there while in Hex.
I'm also fully behind your idea, I just have no faith that the curial clique will let you change their game.

I caught that in your initial post. I agree; many fail to see what this is and what made it special.

You will have to acknowledge the fact that a number of people involved in the Curia, including me, neither treat nor perceive their involvement here as roleplaying. As far as I am concerned roleplay should be kept to the RPG section.

It doesn't matter what term you use, it is the same thing. This is a virtual community. Anything you do is playing a role in the maintenance of the community. Ponti is a professor here, in real life he is a lawyer. In your case, you chose a role of a "judge," I am not sure what you do in real life, but I am sure it is not that. I am a teacher, but I do not choose the play the role of a teacher. I have chosen different roles to play within this virtual community. Whether you call it "role-playing" or something else, it is just what I just describe and nothing more.

[Iskar]

You mix up "fulfilling/playing a role" and "role-playing". It is a trivial point that everyone fulfills and even plays a number of different roles in different contexts (home, work, social life, relationships, parentage, etc.) This is not to be confused with actual role-playing. The distinction is whether the role is taken up genuinely by you as yourself, or just played by you consciously acting as a fictitious character.
Whether or not interaction takes place in persona or digitally doesn't make it less genuine and the application of the adjective "virtual" to distinguish digital and non-digital interactions is really no longer viable in our time. It probably never was and was just due to a false distinction by means (voice, written, digital) rather than by purpose of communication, borne from the transitions to the digital era.

I for myself am here for sincere interaction with real people, no matter what functions they fill in this community and whether or not their account names match their actual names - whether they act sincerely themselves is much more important than how they want to be called here, and not using your real name is mostly just a means to protect privacy, not to take on a different personality anyway.

[PikeStance]

You mix up "fulfilling/playing a role" and "role-playing". It is a trivial point that everyone fulfills and even plays a number of different roles in different contexts (home, work, social life, relationships, parentage, etc.) This is not to be confused with actual role-playing. The distinction is whether the role is taken up genuinely by you as yourself, or just played by you consciously acting as a fictitious character.
Whether or not interaction takes place in persona or digitally doesn't make it less genuine and the application of the adjective "virtual" to distinguish digital and non-digital interactions is really no longer viable in our time. It probably never was and was just due to a false distinction by means (voice, written, digital) rather than by purpose of communication, borne from the transitions to the digital era.

I for myself am here for sincere interaction with real people, no matter what functions they fill in this community and whether or not their account names match their actual names - whether they act sincerely themselves is much more important than how they want to be called here, and not using your real name is mostly just a means to protect privacy, not to take on a different personality anyway.

This is exactly my point, you use a different term for the exact same thing other people called role-playing. I would define just like this is role-playing.

[Iskar]

No, I use two different terms (roleplaying vs filling a role) to distinguish two distinct concepts that you are lumping together. Even Merriam Webster distinguishes "role" as in role of an actor (roleplaying) and role in a social or functional context (filling a role).

As long as you refuse to acknowledge that distinction your Curial endeavours will always suffer from the flaw of mixing vain roleplaying with taking vital roles for the site and community.

[PikeStance]

No, I am not mixing anything up. I am not obfuscating the issue because I am uncomfortable with the term "role-playing" as you are. The fact is, we all are playing a role here and it doesn't make it less genuine in the least.
You can do whatever you need to do to help you cope with it. I think your views have led to more stress than mine. The more people that think as you do, then the less interesting this place is. As soon as you come to terms with it, the sooner you will see the beauty of this place.