General Discussion, Feedback, Suggestions & FAQ

[Clenvey]

thought of another idea for beorn. He could be the faction leader of a city/state that is controlled by the ai, his unit is him, horses and dogs. But there are also a few other units of shape shifting [either large people or bears] beornings, they are neutral faction that is closer to alliances with the "Good" nations and can be convinced to be client or allied state.

Too sad it is not possible to give them the function to change the shape or the function (from "war dog" to soldier") during the battle.

[Devils_Advocate]

As Orphet said, I offer myself to translate from English to Spanish. If you need me please count on me, I'll be glad to help on this mod.

This is great! Please visit this site and write me a PM so I can fully integrate you.

Language translation, yet? Srsly?

[Vikus van de Merwe]

No, not yet. This would be a little bit to early. Right now it's better to help with research, discussing and db-tables if someone can't help with modelling and texturing.

Maybe I put it the wrong way.

"Please visit the site and send me a PM so I can maybe integrate you."

[Mythotheboss]

Why don't you combine this modding team with the one doing Total War Middle Earth? Is there something I am missing to understand this situation?

[Vikus van de Merwe]

Please read this to understand our decision: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...47229-A-Merger

[Mythotheboss]

Thanks for the information! Keep working as well as you are doing, and making this awesome mod to the joy of all TW/LOTR fans, we all should be very grateful with you and your team

[Fallen Gladiator]

I think both mods will be very awesome and I can't wait to play first battles!

[dantaeuk]

will beorn be in the game in some way?. I was thinking maybe as a hired mercenary you could persuade to come to fight for your cause. It would also be cool if his unit was horses and dogs fighting in his unit, assuming he would be a one unit general.


will the eagles be in? can you import them from other mods in any way? flying units like eagles?.

this is an interesting trail of thought

[Wayne'sLegion]

Don't criticize me too harshly, this is my first time posting. It might be a crazy idea, and might not even work, but I was reading about what people were saying about the Army of the Dead. I think it would be incredibly cool to see them, and use them against the computer. What I was thinking, was that could they possibly be a mercenary unit? With an almost 0 recruitment cost, but give it an obscenely high up-keep. That way, even if you are making a bunch of money, keeping the Army of the Dead around for an extended period will wreck your economy. Also maybe their recruitment could be tied to a specific trait: like maybe the general Aragorn has the trait Anduril, Flame of the West and among the other bonuses it confers it allows him to hire the Army of the Dead? This would be lore friendly, and keep the Army of the Dead from fighting for Sauron or the Elves.
Really excited for this mod, love the LotR universe, and I can't wait to see more and play this mod!

[dantaeuk]

Don't criticize me too harshly, this is my first time posting. It might be a crazy idea, and might not even work, but I was reading about what people were saying about the Army of the Dead. I think it would be incredibly cool to see them, and use them against the computer. What I was thinking, was that could they possibly be a mercenary unit? With an almost 0 recruitment cost, but give it an obscenely high up-keep. That way, even if you are making a bunch of money, keeping the Army of the Dead around for an extended period will wreck your economy. Also maybe their recruitment could be tied to a specific trait: like maybe the general Aragorn has the trait Anduril, Flame of the West and among the other bonuses it confers it allows him to hire the Army of the Dead? This would be lore friendly, and keep the Army of the Dead from fighting for Sauron or the Elves.
Really excited for this mod, love the LotR universe, and I can't wait to see more and play this mod!

There are a lot of ways to do it and i think most people agree on the same key factors. the biggest decision will more or less come down too - is it worth the time to create this unit for it to get used once during a campaign? in my opinion probably not, theirs not much cause for anyone to use them in custom games either as they would just be invincible.

what i would say is more plausible is having them appear on the campaign map and be available to use as an auto win auto resolve battle option. once all the pre requisites have been achieved.

[Nstopp42]

How close will this mod be to TATW? For instance, will we be able to reunite the kingdoms again? Also, special bonuses to Rohan's cavalry, but im assuming its already thought of. Maybe try and incorporate a type of racial bonus like there are in MMOs. Elves could get bonuses to marching without roads? Also, incorporation of the rangers into it!!! i think that would be awesome. Also, general and unit skills could have a high emphasis!!!

[Nstopp42]

also, why not separate into two elven factions like in TATW, Elves in Rhovanion for one and elves in eregion for another. Also, what about other factions like Haradrim

[Mr.Jox]

1. It is not TATW but it will be close to the films and books as much as possible;
2. It's very early to talk about unique unit tactics and abilities;
3. As you may know Rome II has large amount of factions so we have to make more factions than in TATW or DaC submod for it.

[Miner400]

This is my first time to post on this website but I've thought very hard about a few if these ideas.
1) The Army of the Dead

For this to be used in game more than one time but still fair maybe it could be activated in game as a generals ability ? More specifically. An ability only usable by a general with Andruil Flame of the West that is also a general of a certain ranking. The ability could only last 20 seconds for example. Long enough for a charge or just long enough to turn the tide of battle. And instead of summoning another unit to the field it could just buff the generals unit an insane amount and make him invincible while active and only be usable once per battle. Maybe there's a way to make unit models appear around the generals unit while the ability is activated. That's a lot of maybe and I'm not sure if it's even possible but I honestly think it's a decent idea that someone could go off of and make even better but still usable.

2) Concerning Wonders on the World Map

There's no question that wonders and ancients sites or even certain cities and places of power need to have special buffs. There should be many of them I believe. That incorporates more of the lore in my opinion. And everyone loves that. Certain wonders though such as arkenstone could have a bonus to anyone who owns Erabor and that bonus be only on Erabor. However, if the dwarves own have the arkenstone then it could be a faction wide bonus? Same could be said for the white tree of Gondor. If Gondor has it under their control then it could be a faction wide bonus. If for some reason Rohan had Minas Tirith under their control it could be a bonus to just that settlement. BUT to make things real interesting (but probably not possible, I'm not a modder idk what is and what isn't possible honestly) if an evil faction taken control of Minas Tirith they wouldn't receive any bonus what so ever. Similar to how The Eye Of Souron could be a wonder in Baradur and if owned by an evil faction it could be a bonus to that one settlement but if owned by Sourons faction it would be a faction wide bonus. Also, (not sure if possible but who knows) you could make the beacons of Gonder multiple smaller wonders. Like for example the beacon of Amon Dín, the Beacon of Eilenach, and so on, and if you and an allied nation own all between the two of you that'd be a faction wide bonus. And if you owned all yourself it could be a better bonus. (Again idk if that'd be possible.)
In the overall you could classify the wonders in three ways. One, being the smaller Enders that benefit everyone. Two, the bonuses that only benefit one certain race, alignment, or faction. And thirdly, the wonders that give higher bonuses if owned by a certain faction or race. The difference from the second and third types being for example; the white tree of Gondor could give all good factions a bonus But Gondor gets a larger bonus. And evil alignment factions would receive no bonus. I strongly believe this would be a much better game if you included many different wonders and more fanatics would like it as well.

3) Special Units

Certain factions have the ability to utilize birds and what not as scouts in the lore. So why not make then the scout agent? Make the Crebeins* for Isengard and for the Dwarves the Thrush(I forget what bird was the scout and messenger for the dwarves) and make them their Spy Agents. You would have to change the model on the map and give the a lot more move action points but that's definitely a way to utilize the lore and incorporate it into the game I think ? But again I'm not a modder. These are just ideas I've thought of today and am submitting via iPhone at work lol.
And for the Ents they could be given random settlements here or there on the world map or could be randomly roaming armies that do not take attrition or upkeep that only attack evil alignment factions unless provoked. Give them an extreme weakness to fire but strong everything else. You could make Ents a special unit obtained for good alignment factions through missions but only one unit when the mission is completed. Give it a normal upkeep just make the missions chance of happening smaller.
The Hourons could be randomly roaming armies that are hostile to any army passing by but never attack settlements. Make them not as strong as Ents but the same weakness but their armies would also have more troops in them than their Ent counterparts. Also they would not be recruit able units in the campaign.

These are just some ideas I wanted to throw out there. I apologize for any typos or miss spellings of any kind. And if some of these ideas sound great but are impossible I apologize. I'm not a modder I simply wanted to get the idea out there for one of you modders to pick up and run with it. Thank you. Please feel free to criticize at will. I want to learn more about the cans and cants of the modding world. Thanks!!)

[cshewey]

Hi guys,
The mod looks great so far, i figured i would start a thread and find out what the community thinks the elves should be like. I posted this comment on the TWME thread but i think it is just as applicable here.

"Here Are my thoughts on the elves, as a past and current player of TATW with Mos, DaC, FRoGS ans someone who always plays as the elves.(And i am super excited for this mod, it has the potential to actually make R2 worth the $60 i wasted on the piece of trash)

The elves are leaving middle earth, why? Because there is no hope. However in theory if hope was restored the elves would not want to leave middle earth since they have such an immortal bond with it. So the elves can start off in steep decline where recruiting is nearly impossible and their numbers are few (but enough for a skilled player to hold off the tides of orcs for a while), but you could script in a starting mission like "the re-kindling of hope" which for Imladris would be to recapture Eregion, and hold Imladris from Angmar, Gundabad and OotMM. For Lorien it would be to secure the east side of Anduin, and to hold off the attacks from Moria, Dul Goldur and potentially Rhun. They could also be required to assist with either Imladris' recapture of Eregion or with Thranduil's recapture of Dul Guldor or both. Thranduil's Realm would be to restore Green Wood the Great, meaning the recapture of Dul Guldor and the surrounding smaller dwellings. Im not sure about Grey Havens, maybe they are a client state of Imladris, and perhaps occasionally they send warriors to aid Elrond (like Glorfindel)? Then their hope would rise and fall with Imladris.

Once this objective is complete elven recruitment will be plausible as more elves decide to stay or some elves (like Arwen) even return from their journeys in progress towards the Havens. After that you could make another mission like "bringing hope to men" where you may need to send troops to aid in the defence of a city or in the capture of an evil fortress. As you complete more missions and objectives hope increases and the glory of ages past begin to return.

This style keeps it lore-accurate (at least mostly), keeps it balanced, (as you take risks and expand you either fail (and loose) or you increase in power) provides a GREAT initial challenge (since it will be extremely difficult to send sufficient forces for the capturing and securing of Eregion as well as maintaining the defense of Imladris against droves of goblins), and makes you feel more immersed in your faction and in middle earth (since you must make the difficult choices that someone like Elrond would be making and you see the similar effects).

As far as culture goes for Imladris if they were to retake Eregion then some population would move their (from Havens or Imladris) and begin to repopulate Eregion and thus after a few years you would be able to recruit basic units, (like elven rangers or elven scout riders) and then after a longer period of time you would be able to recruit (slowly and expensivly) the freaking awesome orc killing machines like Eldar Swordsmen or Mithlond Nobles. Also Imladris often housed the Dunedain and so they may also be allowed to recruit a small number of Dunedain to supplement their army and likewise the elves may send some warriors to aid the Dunedain.

I also like the idea of 1 unit max hyper elite generals bodyguard units. These would provide most of the elves early game strength and would be retrainable but you could never recruit another unit of them for example: Imladris (Glorfindels Chosen or Reincarnate Knights of Gondolin (cavalry), Elronds Kin-Slayers (Swordsment) Elledan and Elrohir's rangers (Missle cavalry) Ciridan's Marines (Spearmen) Smiths of Eregion (only after Eregion os retaken) (War Hammers) and maybee Gildor's companions (Archers). Lorien (Celeborn's Twilight Guard (Halberds or Pikes) Haldir's chosen marchwardens (Archers) Galadriels Gaurds (Swordsmen) and a few elite Lorien ranger units) Thranduils Realm (Palace Gaurds (halberds), Thranduil's Chosen (Elite Palace Guards) Legolas' Chief Rangers (Archers) Sentenels of Amon Lanc (Archers) Chosen Wardens of the Green Wood (Only available after Dul Goldur is taken as well as the sentinels of Amon Lanc) (Swordsmen/Archers). Since the units are capped at 1 once the unit is destroyed it is gone forever, and so early game elves players will need to be very CAREFUL, also they are few enough in number as to not upset the endgame balance. Remember a perfect endgame would be to only have a few superpowers and their clients not 1 superpower and 30 little bumps to steam roll over, so having 3-5 factions controlling most of the map at endgame is not only normal but optimal.

Finally the elves not only in the movies but also on the books were epic warriors, immortal and nearly unbeatable in battle especialy elven lords. So #1 elven generals need to be super powerful, both in special abilities and in combat and #2 even low tier elven units (IE bow Quendi, or Lorien spear men) should be roughly equivalent in melee as solid Gondorian infantry, and even tier 1 archers should be around the Dunedain Rangers in missile, slightly superior in stats while lower in number so overall equal to these) Elves should also have additional special abilities or "magic". And to balance all of this we have few in number, non expansionistic traits, and (until hope is restored) dwindling population and strength.

If i play as the elves i want to know that me units are in every way superior to all the other units, but also fewer in number and a target of all the shadows. I should be getting SWAMPED by goblins from goblin town near Imladris, or from Moria near Lorien, there should be serious hatred of the elves by the orcs and they will relentlessly attack us until we are wiped out. This combo forces me to think strategically- do i keep all my strength to defend Cerin Amroth and stay alive or take a risk and attempt to strike out against my foe and either increase my hope or be eventually overrun. "WE DO NOT NOW HAVE THE STRENGTH TO STAND AGAINST BOTH ISENGARD AND MORDOR" -Elrond. This should be my dilemma to stay and face long term extinction or to strike out against all hope in an attempt to restore hope.

DO WE LEAVE MIDDLE EARTH TO ITS FATE, DO WE LET THEM STAND ALONE?"

I would like to expand a little on some of those thoughts. The "magic" of the elves i think would be represented just fine as additional special abilities, like perhaps "elf eyes" could allow you to for a time overcome the fog of war and see units behind hills and also see any other hidden units. Maybe especially with the great generals like Elrond, Glorfindel, and Haldir, they would have a unique special ability besides their unique general traits. Maybe Elrond would have some form of lore-magic that brings up unit stats or something. Glorfindel with the Light of Elbereth that locks moral and scares evil enemies, and well you get the idea. The big thing with elves is that you need to rely so much on special characters and units because of how hopelessly outnumbered you are.

[Mr.Jox]

Well, your idea seems really cool however I hate elves But why not we can try this in future.
Thanks for the feedback and stay turned to this forum!

[cshewey]

Thanks, I have contacted some of the group about doing voice acting for the elves (i need to dust off my Quenya a little) and i may also be able to do high men. If i get anything done i will post it to this thread.

Also what are some other thoughts about the elves? I think it would be interesting to have the elves factions be primarily defensive (something never before seen in TW) with only the objectives of reclaiming their homelands (as stated above) and sending aid to their allies (like Elledan and Elrohir with the Grey Company).

As for the voice overs it would really help me if i had anything you guys had on the elves so i could get a feel for what they will look and act like. As of now im just kind of trying to go off of TATW. Also i would be happy to make an official trailer for the game or faction intro videos. I can do media things pretty well but i cant do much with modding tools.
But yeah what are other thoughts on how the elves should be?

[Mr.Jox]

Currently we dont disscuss gameplay with the team because 1. We don't have mapping tool->no custom ME map but vanilla Europe... 2. At current point of progress actual modding is modeling/creating the units, UI and sound modding; 3. Elven units at the moment not in the development. We have one guy who should start work on them soon(Mirkwood elves).
If you can give us some custom voices for Elves and Dunedain(High men) we will very appreciate it!

[King of Stormwind]

Mr. J! Is the mapping tool ever gonna be available? Any information yet?

[Mr.Jox]

There are no any info. People trust it'd be released after last DLC released for R2.