Thread: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

  1. #3401

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    Apparently the footage they showed was already edited to hide certain details that would give away that it was within US, so it was definitely not an accident.
    Actually Western propaganda "news" agencies, have quite an extensive history of using entirely irrelevant footage of something and claim it is footage of something else (it was either BBC or CNN that used footage of civilian bodies from American aggression against Iraq as proof of "Qaddafi's war crimes"), and then claim it was a "mistake" (if they get caught and called out that is). After all, agencies like ABC primary goal is to ... spread propaganda. In this case it is pro-war propaganda against Trump's decision to leave Syria.
    Cool story. Are you going to edit out Trump’s decision to send thousands to troops to Saudi Arabia (and now Iraq) in production, or are you just taking your conspiratorial bile straight to the silver screen as is? Where can I get tickets? Do I need to bring my own tin foil hat, or can I get those at the concession stand?

    Protecting the Kurds in Syria was one of the few US military objectives that enjoyed full bipartisan support from as far left as Noam Chomsky to as far right as John Bolton. Trump relocated those troops to Iraq in deference to his patron, Erdogan. Trump was rightly trashed for this in the press, and is anything but the peacenik his sycophants insist he is.
    Last edited by Lord Thesaurian; October 23, 2019 at 07:46 AM.
    Of these facts there cannot be any shadow of doubt: for instance, that civil society was renovated in every part by Christian institutions; that in the strength of that renewal the human race was lifted up to better things-nay, that it was brought back from death to life, and to so excellent a life that nothing more perfect had been known before, or will come to be known in the ages that have yet to be. - Pope Leo XIII

  2. #3402
    dogukan's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Looks like Kurds learned how to manipulate Trump as well

    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...44861725286400

    just freaking praise the guy and tell him he is doing great
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  3. #3403

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Yup, YPG got Trump to publicly praise a well-known terrorist. Note that.
    The Armenian Issue

  4. #3404
    dogukan's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    They got president of USA to praise a PYD(as my people say, PKK) leader while also admitting that Turkey was supporting jihadi-terrorists

    I think its wrong to think Trump is evil. The guy jsut wants love and recognition and doesn't really know what he is doing...
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  5. #3405
    Vanoi's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Well-known terrorist? What terrorist acts has that man committed?

  6. #3406

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanoi View Post
    Well-known terrorist? What terrorist acts has that man committed?
    Ever-closer ties between US and Kurds stoke Turkish border tensions
    As a senior leader of the Kurdish militant organisation the PKK, Abdi Ferhad Şahin, known as Şahin Cilo, has a $1.1m Turkish government bounty on his head. Cameras were present to record the moment, which amounted to Cilo’s remarkable transformation from hunted to courted.
    The Armenian Issue

  7. #3407

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    "Terrorism" What a convenient word. Turkey keeps making its own bed and then complains when they have to lay in it.

  8. #3408
    Vanoi's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    I asked what terrorist acts he committed. We already know Turkey doesn't like him.

  9. #3409

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanoi View Post
    I asked what terrorist acts he committed. We already know Turkey doesn't like him.
    Sigh... He might have held a gun directly or not. He is a senior PKK leader which means he had a hand in all PKK attacks, including a twin suicide bomb explosions near a stadium and park in Istabul in 2016 killing 38, or a suicide car bomb near a bus stop in Ankara the same year killing 37. Oh, that last one, where 37 people died, YPG had a poster of the woman, who blew herself up, next to Öcalan's image in YPG held Syrian territory to commemorate her...
    The Armenian Issue

  10. #3410
    Vanoi's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Sigh... He might have held a gun directly or not. He is a senior PKK leader which means he had a hand in all PKK attacks, including a twin suicide bomb explosions near a stadium and park in Istabul in 2016 killing 38, or a suicide car bomb near a bus stop in Ankara the same year killing 37. Oh, that last one, where 37 people died, YPG had a poster of the woman, who blew herself up, next to Öcalan's image in YPG held Syrian territory to commemorate her...
    You do realize he left the PKK in 2012? So how was he responsible for either of the incidents you referenced?

  11. #3411

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanoi View Post
    You do realize he left the PKK in 2012? So how was he responsible for either of the incidents you referenced?
    He left PKK? How? To form the Syrian branch? He is still a senior leader of PKK. Suicide bombers that took lives in Turkey still received training in Syria, likely under his direct command. There is no dimensional wall between Turkey and Syria when it comes to PKK. They always utilized fighters from both sides to rank up. Since you're making an issue out of 2012, does that mean he had responsibility of the attacks before 2012? In that case, what is the statue of limitation on terrorism charges?
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  12. #3412
    Vanoi's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    He left PKK? How? To form the Syrian branch? He is still a senior leader of PKK.
    To join the YPG. And if he left the PKK by definition he isn't a senior PKK leader anymore.

    Suicide bombers that took lives in Turkey still received training in Syria, likely under his direct command
    Thats just a claim with zero evidence behind it. Not only that in both of the attacks you referenced it was the Kurdish Freedom Hawks who were blamed or claimed responsibility for the attacks. TAK split from the PKK. This makes your claim even more than it already is.

    There is no dimensional wall between Turkey and Syria when it comes to PKK. They always utilized fighters from both sides to rank up. Since you're making an issue out of 2012, does that mean he had responsibility of the attacks before 2012? In that case, what is the statue of limitation on terrorism charges?
    Which terrorist attacks did he commit again? I'm still waiting for that answer.

  13. #3413
    dogukan's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Dont bother.

    Trust me, I d be jailed in Turkey as a terrorist simply for what I write here.

    Our threshold for “terrorism” is quite low


    Enviado desde mi iPhone utilizando Tapatalk
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  14. #3414

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Legio_Italica View Post
    Cool story. Are you going to edit out Trump’s decision to send thousands to troops to Saudi Arabia (and now Iraq) in production, or are you just taking your conspiratorial bile straight to the silver screen as is? Where can I get tickets? Do I need to bring my own tin foil hat, or can I get those at the concession stand?

    Protecting the Kurds in Syria was one of the few US military objectives that enjoyed full bipartisan support from as far left as Noam Chomsky to as far right as John Bolton. Trump relocated those troops to Iraq in deference to his patron, Erdogan. Trump was rightly trashed for this in the press, and is anything but the peacenik his sycophants insist he is.
    Where did I say that sending troops to Saudi Arabia is a good idea?
    And source that occupation of Syria received bi-partisan support? Unless you mean just neoliberal and neocon warhawks, who foam out of their mouths in unison because Trump is ending pointless and costly involvement in a foreign war. And why should American taxpayer give two about some conflict on the other side of the world? If you really want to take a side in a conflict between commies and jihadists (both ideologies equally abhorrent), nobody really stops you from going there yourself or funding either side out of your personal wealth. Stop pretending that using US economy as piggie bank and US troops as cannon fodder for foreign interests (just like pretty much every war US was involved in since Cold War) is some kind of act of geopolitical altruism.
    Your argument makes just as much sense as mainstream media having a temper tantrum over anything that Trump does. If Trump tweets that Hitler was bad, we can only expect CNN journos zieg-heiling and calling for extermination of Jews, not that would be the first time Democrats did that lol. Maybe you should come up with a better arguments then "anything that contradicts MSM narrative is a conspiracy theory". You know, like making actual arguments on why you think illegal wars in Middle East are a good thing. We are all ears.

  15. #3415

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    Where did I say that sending troops to Saudi Arabia is a good idea?
    And source that occupation of Syria received bi-partisan support? Unless you mean just neoliberal and neocon warhawks, who foam out of their mouths in unison because Trump is ending pointless and costly involvement in a foreign war. And why should American taxpayer give two about some conflict on the other side of the world? If you really want to take a side in a conflict between commies and jihadists (both ideologies equally abhorrent), nobody really stops you from going there yourself or funding either side out of your personal wealth. Stop pretending that using US economy as piggie bank and US troops as cannon fodder for foreign interests (just like pretty much every war US was involved in since Cold War) is some kind of act of geopolitical altruism.
    Your argument makes just as much sense as mainstream media having a temper tantrum over anything that Trump does. If Trump tweets that Hitler was bad, we can only expect CNN journos zieg-heiling and calling for extermination of Jews, not that would be the first time Democrats did that lol. Maybe you should come up with a better arguments then "anything that contradicts MSM narrative is a conspiracy theory". You know, like making actual arguments on why you think illegal wars in Middle East are a good thing. We are all ears.
    You declined to address the content of my post, yet you demand I address your unrelated rambling in the same conspiratorial framing your worldview is based upon. You still haven’t even told me if I need to bring my own tin foil hat. The answer has a direct impact on whether I buy 1 ticket or 3-4. When will it be showing at a theater near me? And who is “we?” You’ve already got more people working on this besides you?

    Anyway, since you asked:

    Noam Chomsky says US should stay in Syria to protect the Kurds

    The US should stay in northern Syria to deter attacks against Syrian Kurds, well-known American linguist and political activist Noam Chomsky said in an interview with the Intercept last week.

    The other crucial question is the status of the Kurdish areas — Rojava. In my opinion, it makes sense for the United States to maintain a presence which would deter an attack on the Kurdish areas,” he said.

    Chomsky noted that the Kurds have “succeeded in sustaining a functioning society with many decent elements” in Syria’s north.
    “The idea that they should be subjected to an attack by their bitter enemies the Turks, or by the murderous Assad regime, I think is anything should be done to try to prevent that.”

    https://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/...6-d453a3261d8b
    Poll: Little backing for Trump's Syria withdrawal

    Only 37 percent of voters support Trump’s decision regarding Syria, the poll shows, less than the 43 percent who oppose it. But a sizable number, 20 percent, say they don’t have an opinion about Trump’s decision.

    Opinions of Trump’s decision fall mostly along party lines. Among Democratic voters, 20 percent support it, while 62 percent oppose it. Republicans are a mirror image: 61 percent support Trump’s decision and 22 percent oppose it. Among independents, just 30 percent back Trump’s decision, while 43 percent oppose it.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2019/1...al-poll-054957
    House Republicans joined Democrats in condemning Trump’s actions in Syria

    In a bipartisan rebuke to President Donald Trump, the US House of Representatives has overwhelmingly passed a resolution condemning his decision to pull United States troops out of Syria, abandoning US allies in the region as Turkish troops have moved in.

    The 354-60 vote on the resolution Wednesday was largely symbolic, but it signaled the widespread disapproval among lawmakers for Trump’s latest controversial foreign policy move. It came as fighting continued in northeastern Syria between Turkey and Kurdish fighters, who have been a key US ally in fighting the terror group ISIS.

    https://www.vox.com/2019/10/16/20917...ction-in-syria
    Last edited by Lord Thesaurian; October 23, 2019 at 08:14 PM.
    Of these facts there cannot be any shadow of doubt: for instance, that civil society was renovated in every part by Christian institutions; that in the strength of that renewal the human race was lifted up to better things-nay, that it was brought back from death to life, and to so excellent a life that nothing more perfect had been known before, or will come to be known in the ages that have yet to be. - Pope Leo XIII

  16. #3416
    dogukan's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Trump ends endless wars:
    By further isolating millions of kurds who has tasted freedom to hand their lands to jihadis.
    What could go wrong?

    If rojava ends 100%, the kurds will likely switch to largescale insurgency and terrorism out of their hopelessness.
    Turkey will become an unsafe dictatorial mess full of hatred. So will Syria.
    Meanwhile future jihadis will be bread under turkish protection.

    Not quite end of wars


    Enviado desde mi iPhone utilizando Tapatalk
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  17. #3417
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    in a foreign war. And why should American taxpayer give two about some conflict on the other side of the world?
    Yes why should America care about the other side of the world, i'm sure being absent from European politics was a good ideal circa 1938.

    Your argument makes just as much sense as mainstream media having a temper tantrum over anything that Trump does. If Trump tweets that Hitler was bad, we can only expect CNN journos zieg-heiling and calling for extermination of Jews, not that would be the first time Democrats did that lol. Maybe you should come up with a better arguments then "anything that contradicts MSM narrative is a conspiracy theory". You know, like making actual arguments on why you think illegal wars in Middle East are a good thing. We are all ears.
    Err a corrupt, grifter deserves constant media scrutiny.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

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    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  18. #3418

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanoi View Post
    You do realize he left the PKK in 2012? So how was he responsible for either of the incidents you referenced?
    Are you basically saying that you get stripped of your crimes when you decide to “leave” a terrorist organization? Could Baghdadi run for Iraqi presidency if he “left” the ISIS? If you don’t get caught by cameras while killing someone, are you considered innocent even if you willingly joined a terrorist organization and became a senior leader? Are you outside of your mind? I refuse to believe you are being serious. Ridiculuous part is you claim that it us who tries hard.

    Becoming a senior leader in a terror organization without committing any act after joining, that makes sense as well, he must have invited his manager to bbq at his home.

  19. #3419

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanoi View Post
    To join the YPG. And if he left the PKK by definition he isn't a senior PKK leader anymore.
    Thats just a claim with zero evidence behind it. Not only that in both of the attacks you referenced it was the Kurdish Freedom Hawks who were blamed or claimed responsibility for the attacks. TAK split from the PKK. This makes your claim even more than it already is.
    Which terrorist attacks did he commit again? I'm still waiting for that answer.
    Sigh... Clearly you see no problem in defending a terrorist. Good luck with that.


    Quote Originally Posted by dogukan View Post
    Dont bother.
    Trust me, I d be jailed in Turkey as a terrorist simply for what I write here.
    Our threshold for “terrorism” is quite low
    You're seriously equating yourself with Şahin Cilo?
    The Armenian Issue

  20. #3420

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Last night there was chatter that Turkey was airdropping special forces into Idlib area to target Al Qaeda pockets. This morning we hear that ISIL leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi was killed:

    Isis leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi believed dead in US raid
    The leader of the Islamic State terror group, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, is believed to have died in a US raid in north-western Syria overnight, intelligence officials have claimed.

    The raid followed a month long intelligence operation that had tracked Baghdadi to the region through a smuggler who had moved the wives of two of his brothers from Iraq to Idlib, two officials told the Guardian.

    Donald Trump is due to make an announcement at 9.00am (1300GMT) on Sunday in Washington, having tweeted on Saturday night without explanation: “Something very big has just happened!”

    Intelligence officials believe Baghdadi may have detonated a suicide belt as troops approached a house near the Turkish border in which he was hiding. The blast is thought to have also killed two of his wives.

    Explosions and gunfire were reported from the small town of Barisha at about 1.30am Syrian time on Sunday. It is understood that the Isis leader had been tracked to the home of one his bodyguards who attempted to defend him. The raid is thought to have left at least nine people dead.
    There is also chatter now that the operation was green lighted a week ago and al-Baghdadi arrived at the location of the strike 48 hours prior to the operation. The intelligence was seemingly shared by Turkey. The strike most likely came from Turkish soil.
    Last edited by PointOfViewGun; October 27, 2019 at 05:21 AM.
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