'Star Wars' discussions

[Akar]

good god obi wan was ing terrible

bad acting, bad cg, bad dialogue, bad characters, anachronistic story, nonsense force powers that invalidate entire parts of the original trilogy, the worst plot ever, terrible child actors, unnecessary and cringey comedy, etc

[conon394]

good god obi wan was ing terrible

bad acting, bad cg, bad dialogue, bad characters, anachronistic story, nonsense force powers that invalidate entire parts of the original trilogy, the worst plot ever, terrible child actors, unnecessary and cringey comedy, etc

Wow for that level of rant I would like some additional filler because I kinda seem to have watched a different show.

nonsense force powers that invalidate entire parts of the original trilogy

Umm Which ones exactly?

[Akar]

Umm Which ones exactly?

Third Sister reading Nanjiani's mind invalidates the entire opening problem in the original trilogy. Why doesn't Vader just read the Rebel Captain's mind if that's a thing people can do with the force now?

And while it wasn't nonsense story wise the Third Sister's ridiculous force jumps while chasing Obi-Wan couldn't have been shot worse, unless they were trying to make it seem like a cheesy kung-fu wire jump.

Leia's actor was decent in some parts and abysmal in others, though it's hard to tell if that was just the writing being bad. Why does she seem super mature and like an intelligent 10/11 year old in some scenes and then in others she's an incompetent boob who seems like a 5/6 year old? I understand she's a child but her actions are irrational and out of line even for someone of her age. She just got kidnapped and taken from her family and her first move after being rescued is to... 'run' (it's more of a toddle) away from her savior and into the hands of the enemy. I know she's a child but she has zero self preservation. Even when she's being shot at she still runs away from the person trying to help her.

Speaking of Leia, the kidnapping scene was atrocious. How can 5 adults fail to capture a single child for 15 minutes? The shots of them tripping and falling over rocks and sticks was cringe inducing and took me right out of the scene. Whoever shot the chase sequence on the roof tops needs to lose their damned jobs. How can a city full of bounty hunters, dark jedi, and a jedi master spend upwards of 15 minutes chasing a god damned child around a city she's never been in before? And then when Obi-Wan finally catches up with her she just literally runs off of the roof into thin air like wiley ing coyote. And when he uses the force to save her, he just immediately appears down on the ground by her side and the bounty hunters are just gone and no longer chasing them for some reason.

How the does Bail Organa know exactly which cave Obi-Wan is hiding? How does he just immediately appear there (unescorted)? Where is his ship? Where is his vehicle? How did he know where Obi-Wan is? Did Obi-Wan tell him?

Why the is Obi-Wan just walking around everywhere in his Jedi robes? Is that literally his only outfit? It's the exact same outfit in the mug shots they distribute of him ffs, why are you still wearing that stupid ass robe? Why do stormtroopers not immediately recognize someone in the same uniform as their arch nemeses?

A lot of the CGI was kind of wonky too, especially the scenes in the first episode where Obi-Wan is a meat farmer or whatever the that job was supposed to be.

Why did Kumail Nanjiani's character even need to exist at all? Wouldn't pretending to be a Jedi be literally the worst ing idea ever when there is an entire army hunting down every single one of them? It feels like someone in the writers room mentioned that you could use magnets to mimic the force and they were like "oh that's a good idea, we've gotta put that in there". Why does he go from selling people out for credits to literally sacrificing his life so two strangers can escape? And when he confronts the Third Sister, who is portrayed as the cringiest and edgiest loose cannon in all of the Empire, just ignores him and lets him survive? Even though she wanted to kill an entire village just to send a message to one guy she thought was a jedi just last episode she ignores him. Haha funny character lives but gets punched haha

I'm a huge Nanjiani fan and he played the character well, but every time his character was on screen it just took me out of things. Why does Disney keep thinking that every star wars movie or show has to have some sort of comedy relief? Did they not understand that's why everyone hates Jar Jar Binks? No one wants to watch a show where every couple of minutes some character sort of leans to the audience and goes "This whole thing is ing stupid, isn't it?" I want a show that takes itself and the universe seriously.

I feel like they just saw that Bill Burr nailed it in the Mandalorian and thought "oh, who's another comedian who's a pretty good actor? we should have them in the show!", which entirely misses the point of why people loved Bill Burr's character. Just because the character is played by a comedian doesn't mean they have to be comedic relief. And if they are comedic relief, don't use them to do a sort of fourth wall breaking "isn't this all silly" statement to the audience.

The show is a solid 5 or 6 out of 10, maybe.

[conon394]

Third Sister reading Nanjiani's mind invalidates the entire opening problem in the original trilogy. Why doesn't Vader just read the Rebel Captain's mind if that's a thing people can do with the force now?

I don't recall that was it ever established that every Jedi and or Sith had the same power set. Also committed solider for the cause and willing to die for it vs last minute heroics from a grifter? Also the Vader sequence seemed to show him acting in anger and emotion not at his best thinking through of what he could or could not do and the the Princess was his actual target. Also Palpatine played with Anakin's head.

Leia's actor was decent in some parts and abysmal in others, though it's hard to tell if that was just the writing being bad. Why does she seem super mature and like an intelligent 10/11 year old in some scenes and then in others she's an incompetent boob who seems like a 5/6 year old? I understand she's a child but her actions are irrational and out of line even for someone of her age. She just got kidnapped and taken from her family and her first move after being rescued is to... 'run' (it's more of a toddle) away from her savior and into the hands of the enemy. I know she's a child but she has zero self preservation. Even when she's being shot at she still runs away from the person trying to help her.

Children's actions are often irrational and she really had no particular basis to trust Ben. I mean you can call my son today I am betting he could still not tell you why jumped off the roof of house at 10/11. He could tell you it was kinda good for a frozen moment - and than he hit the ground and though he might have broke his leg.

Speaking of Leia, the kidnapping scene was atrocious. How can 5 adults fail to capture a single child for 15 minutes? The shots of them tripping and falling over rocks and sticks was cringe inducing and took me right out of the scene.

That was in fact poorly done and should not run for so long I agree. But I will say at 11 my son on our 49 acres could likely have dragged out that chase as long. He would know were the hot wires were, the old barbed wire was , all the places you scale up and down the cliff face behind the property were the overgrown paths to the high pasture were etc. And of course the overgrown non working bits would have been vastly more dense and easy for him to navigate than an adult trust me I know. Seems the problem is establishing that. We either needed to see Leia going into something much dense than than a park forest and scampering around in a way that would indicate its what she did in trees and rough terrain all the time. Sufficiently so that a bunch of ship/city dwellers would in fact have a hard time chasing her. Else I agree she should caught strait away.

child around a city she's never been in before? And then when Obi-Wan finally catches up with her she just literally runs off of the roof into thin air like wiley ing coyote. And when he uses the force to save her, he just immediately appears down on the ground by her side and the bounty hunters are just gone and no longer chasing them for some reason.

I also agree on that one. They clearly want obi in the doubts his Jedi powers not the person he was so the more obvious quick thing he would have done circa the prequels is jump down. Perhaps the better option would have been to land her in ally that was more secluded so the cut to getting there could have been a more intermittent amount of time. Movies/TV have forever loved them some getting knocked out is something you shake off... could have just saved her but still not soft landing so she wakes up when he gets there.

How the does Bail Organa know exactly which cave Obi-Wan is hiding? How does he just immediately appear there (unescorted)? Where is his ship? Where is his vehicle? How did he know where Obi-Wan is? Did Obi-Wan tell him?

Err lots people fly about in one man ships in star wars and land anywhere they want. Also I assumed If obi left his comm device in the cave it would lead him to it.

Why did Kumail Nanjiani's character even need to exist at all? Wouldn't pretending to be a Jedi be literally the worst ing idea ever when there is an entire army hunting down every single one of them? It feels like someone in the writers room mentioned that you could use magnets to mimic the force and they were like "oh that's a good idea, we've gotta put that in there". Why does he go from selling people out for credits to literally sacrificing his life so two strangers can escape? And when he confronts the Third Sister, who is portrayed as the cringiest and edgiest loose cannon in all of the Empire, just ignores him and lets him survive? Even though she wanted to kill an entire village just to send a message to one guy she thought was a jedi just last episode she ignores him. Haha funny character lives but gets punched haha

I would say she was in a hurry. Putin was in a hurry to overrun Ukraine and look how that turned out. She wanted to catch Obi, and he was not a Jedi so why bother? Just because you a cleave con man does not make a good just of the consequences of a good con. Also I'm not sure it was he selling out the people conned for transport. If so one assumes he felt he could just check with officer so and so I am not a Jedi but just routing force sensitive people to imperial detention. It was not clear to me if was really saving people or not.

[Akar]

I suppose that you're right, at the end of the day most of my issues just come down to the way the ideas were shot and presented rather than with the fundamentals.

Err lots people fly about in one man ships in star wars and land anywhere they want.

Sure, that's true, I suppose it just felt really jarring to see him there. Especially since Obi-Wan, who is both force sensitive and in hiding from the empire, and clearly paranoid enough to rig up his home with sensors or w/e to let him know someone is inside seemed surprised to see Bail there - if he had flown there and parked nearby he would have just seen the ship and known what was up. If the ship is hidden it raises the question of where did he hide it and did he just walk all the way there alone or what? Again, I guess it could have just been shot or presented better.

I don't recall that was it ever established that every Jedi and or Sith had the same power set.

No, I suppose not, but it seems like they didn't consider the repercussions of adding that specific use of the force to the SW universe. It means that either, A) they didn't think about the consequences of the scene and just wanted a way for her to get the information and they invalidated every single star wars scene where any force user interrogates someone, or B) that she's such a powerful force user that she's inventing unique ways to use the force, something most Jedi don't ever do in their life times.

I don't know which of those is worse to me.

Maybe I'm just nitpicking and frustrated with always being let down by Disney.

[conon394]

Sure, that's true, I suppose it just felt really jarring to see him there. Especially since Obi-Wan, who is both force sensitive and in hiding from the empire, and clearly paranoid enough to rig up his home with sensors or w/e to let him know someone is inside seemed surprised to see Bail there - if he had flown there and parked nearby he would have just seen the ship and known what was up. If the ship is hidden it raises the question of where did he hide it and did he just walk all the way there alone or what? Again, I guess it could have just been shot or presented better.

Again I agree. Its a bit erratic how thay treat the security of his home. He seems to have security but it does not seem to do anything. A landing shot for the senator would have been good and taken no time (akin to say Maul landing in the prequels). I give a pass on the force because they did pretty much make it clear hopelessness or guilt has clouded his connection to being a force user.

No, I suppose not, but it seems like they didn't consider the repercussions of adding that specific use of the force to the SW universe. It means that either, A) they didn't think about the consequences of the scene and just wanted a way for her to get the information and they invalidated every single star wars scene where any force user interrogates someone, or B) that she's such a powerful force user that she's inventing unique ways to use the force, something most Jedi don't ever do in their life times.

I don't know which of those is worse to me.

Maybe I'm just nitpicking and frustrated with always being let down by Disney.

Fair argument.

I guess my counter would be we don't have too many examples of force users interrogating people or Sith really. I mean we got one reckless Vader kill. And we got Vader vs his own Daughter (who is clearly prepared to die vs admitting anything). Luke is half trained Jedi and he does slip up in the RoftheJ. And he is not weak force user if not well trained. Would the Jedi have allowed a forced mind interrogation seems like it would violate their code so. Thus I could see a good sith doing it on a non force user and possibly quickly.

I mean its not like out side of EU books or comics I don't read anyone ever bothered to explain why Jedi mind tricks don't work on some creatures except that its a useful plot point/problem.

Maybe I'm just nitpicking and frustrated with always being let down by Disney.

Too each his own man. As long as everyone is say debating arguing without getting mean or toxic I got no problem with that. Nobody has to have the same tastes and or the same bar were they decide their suspension of disbelief has been crossed or their sense of boredom etc.

I mean I would certainly say Citizen Kain is overrated when people toss out Best movie ever but many would disagree. As long as it reasonable discussion I'm fine (and yes I know there was a lot technological and filming method ground breaking stuff in it )

[Akar]

In Citizen Kane's defense, you have to watch it with the mindset of a viewer at the time, not a modern viewer. To a modern viewer all of the things that Citizen Kane first introduced are just normal things we see every day in film - they're not as revolutionary to us. Seinfeld has a similar issue with some new viewers

[conon394]

In Citizen Kane's defense, you have to watch it with the mindset of a viewer at the time, not a modern viewer. To a modern viewer all of the things that Citizen Kane first introduced are just normal things we see every day in film - they're not as revolutionary to us. Seinfeld has a similar issue with some new viewers

I know I know... Still just can't bring myself to call it the best of the best. But than again I have I general problem with that kind of thing since I think some absolute best is a mistake and most need things category judging. I mean take a sport I know. I would not really say either Wayne Gretzky, Gordie Howe or Bobby Orr is best hockey player ever... Because I immediately devolve into the eras when they played, the roles they had etc and what about goalies and that is fraught subject again (how many good or great modern goalies would be so great in pads that weighed twice as much - no sprawling around for you and hoping right back up - and with no face shielding?). I kinda view movies the same way you really need to put them in time an place and type and then refine out the best of the best but that is still going to be personal.

But of course Gordie is clearly better than Gretzky so the best Forward ever/so far

[conon394]

OK Akar gotta say 3rd episode did not work for me.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

That really did invalidate the dialogue of a new hope. Seeing Vader be at the top of his game is all cool, but Ben needed to be able to slip aside using the force so that Vader either thought he found him and was wrong or was still not quite able to catch him or pin point him. Ben could have judged correctly that he himself was not able to face him a duel any more but by eluding/distracting him Ben would still be the master. I mean Darth is not surprised that Obi-Wan is alive in ANH. So an encounter now is fine but Obi-Wan needed to escape more less by still managing a force trick or something and like I said showing mastery. It would have more satisfying to see Vader as unstoppable force but still wondering was Obi-Wan there or never there or just eluded him. With Obi-Wan sayinf something like the dark side has made him more powerful but not more skillful or some such

I think if they wanted their run with that episode we really needed a ghost interlude with Q Jin to show Obi-Wan has his game back and confidence if not maybe his prime fighting ability.

So yes rallied for the defense but now a bit bummed. Feel like I owe you a beer.

[Akar]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I was pleasantly surprised by that episode, actually, though I had much of the same issues with it as you did. I also feel like the plot moves along way too conveniently. This is the second planet in a row where the first or second person they talk to is the one who ends up helping them which just makes all of these planets and the galaxy in general seem tiny.

Leia was a much more realistic character this episode than in either of the last two but all of the people that just randomly show up to save the day just feels weird. I get that they're trying to show that not everyone is pro-empire, but having random people who we've never seen before pop up and give their life for Obi-Wan feels weirdly deus ex machina to me.

Vader was super cool but I wasn't a fan of how he just apparently lets Obi-Wan go because there's a smidge of fire in front of him?

Third Sister was much less cringe and edgy this time, but I still feel like she's channeling all of the worst parts of Hayden Christiansen from AOTC and ROTS

There's a person on TV shows who is in charge of continuity between shots/episodes and whatnot. I feel like they need a couple people like that on the set or in the writers room to just remind them of what some of the implications of their various ideas are and why even though they seem cool in a vacuum they don't end up working when taken in with the rest of the Star Wars universe as a whole. Like I said before, It just feels like there isn't anyone there to say "no" to any of their ideas.

It's funny how both of our tones have shifted in the other direction based off of this episode.

[Wallachian]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Vader's appearence and presence was awesome. But surely this is not the only duel between them two. Surely there has to be another duel that is a bit more serious and contested. And I get that Vader is afraid of fire. But surely he could use the force to blow away the fire and surely his armour (and the stormtrooper armour) would protect the wearer from armour.

Does anyone have an issue with how many women officers there are in the Empire? I don't know, I always saw the Empire as a sort of Nazi Germany (it's flag is pretty much based on Nazi Germany). It's racist, rigid, patriarchal, hierarchical. And the Rebel Alliance is an egalitarian, non-discriminating organisation that welcomes everyone no matter their race, origin, gender and so on.

In the old canon Admiral Daala and Ysanne Isaard were big deals because they were women and yet they still managed to climb the male dominated hierarchy. Also, in the old canon in the Legacy Era the Empire had actually changed/reformed and started welcoming women and aliens in its army. So there was a progression. In the new canon it seems that is thrown away and there is pretty much complete equality in the Empire and its officer corps between males and females.

[conon394]

It's funny how both of our tones have shifted in the other direction based off of this episode.

I agree unexpected. Well I guess gotta wait see how the next one plays out

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I should say I liked bit on the back of the of the truck worked really well were they both manged to talk around their gaffs and McGregor was able to deliver the emotion his story required. That he realized the driver was going betray them and dealt with it was good. All in all seemed like they were on road to the pair solving their own problems and than wham saved again by handy reblel

[conon394]

Well...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Good to see Ben get some of mojo his back and for reasons. Liked the tense elements. Did not like the Deus Ex Machina end so much. That a Spy with an imperial shuttle and clearance could fly in is one thing. That some third rate sorta rebels could without being challenged at all just the right time were they orbiting the station? There was no indication that they (Ben et al) had a panic button to push for example or some extraction time line - sloppy. Not even a few more seconds of Underground guy saying as they fly away damn I can't let them try this alone. Given they have teased with Ben and company working things out on the fly, but still seem thay can't run a full we clever-ed our way out of this plot. A hesitant Jedi mind trick say to get them to a landing platform? And a ship out and they discover whomever the underground railroad guy did show up to pick them up...

Still thay have a problem they need some way for Ben to vanish seem dead etc. comparable to Yoda who failed to beat the Emperor but on the defensive seeming could hide himself absolutely.

[Akar]

Yeah the Deus Ex machina is a bit ridiculous at this point. It feels like Obi Wan does zero actual problem solving and everything else is solved by someone coming in at the last minute and helping out.

[conon394]

I mean that Ben got focus and get to form but arc wise I assume he has elude VAder and I cool with the fact he is not the Jedi who could best Anakin/Vader anymore in a head to head fight. But...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Say he shield himself and also know where the inquisitors were going. His companion had see n the maps. And the place look to a the open airfield thing all around. So thay go to a pad where the Imperials are not escape on their own. Also why the waste of time on feeling bad for random good guy I have no ideal who he was and all and doing something stupid anyway. I mean at least conman with hart of gold was introduced and he a tad of back character time and at that point Obi really the assist since we also knew he was sorta broken. In fact thinking about it struck con Jedi should have the story about loosing wife or maybe sister or mother . Than but he was playing a double game protected as playing Jedi because as I can help was feeding real criminals on the run to the empire, while diverting force types to the underground. No inquisitors because the local security chief just reported him as part of sting.

I think they might have shorted themselves here 6 (if I recall right )episodes is cramming stuff in and than having to fix with the D ex M at the end. Seems to me so far each episode would have been better as two with more time to work out a good story arc and middle cliff hanger.

[irontaino]

While there is no tension whatsoever with the action scenes, there's been a few scenes where that have been sufficiently dark/brutal like

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Vader straight up murdering a kid, Vader dragging Obi-Wan through the fire, and the Jedi corpses frozen in amber(?)...all moments that made me say "jayzus!"

[Knight of Heaven]

good god obi wan was ing terrible

bad acting, bad cg, bad dialogue, bad characters, anachronistic story, nonsense force powers that invalidate entire parts of the original trilogy, the worst plot ever, terrible child actors, unnecessary and cringey comedy, etc

This show is terrible, specially for something that is dealing with the peek legacy characters of Star wars, that are Vader and Obi wan. Also done amateurish, the camera always shaking for instance.... the terrible writing that is actually breaking cannon, and the acting is actually sub par. Most of all i find it all boring, with predictable tropes of characters and themes. They are giving Obi wan the last jedi treatment, and i dont appreciate it. The kenobi novel by John Jackson Miller did it much better. I dont understand why they dont adapt the good stuff they already have, hubris i suppose.

[Wallachian]

It's really weird, they invested so much money yet everything is subpar. The snowspeeders shooting lasers at Reva looked absolutely terrible. And the writing sucks so bad.

[Akar]

Also why the waste of time on feeling bad for random good guy I have no ideal who he was and all and doing something stupid anyway.

lol right? When Wade or whoever gets shot down all the characters are sad and I'm just like "literally who the was that?" \

There is zero risk or tension to any of these scenes. I mean even the Leia interrogation was boring and free of tension since you know Disney would never show them torturing or hurting a kid.

Also why does no one get cut in half with lightsabers anymore? The combat looks so weird, it's like Obi-Wan is hitting them with a glowing baseball bat or something. If you can cut Maul in half effortlessly with a lightsaber why are we barely seeing any wounds on the Stormtroopers that he's cutting down?

Ugh.

[Knight of Heaven]

It's really weird, they invested so much money yet everything is subpar. The snowspeeders shooting lasers at Reva looked absolutely terrible. And the writing sucks so bad.

I mean come on they made Obi wan hide Leia under his coat in a base full of military personal... it is beyond cartoonish, it is absurd. As absurd as the chasing Leia scenes.