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    Default Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    The Case for the Strong Executive
    Under some circumstances, the rule of law must yield to the need for energy.

    BY HARVEY C. MANSFIELD
    Wednesday, May 2, 2007 12:01 a.m. EDT

    Complaints against the "imperial presidency" are back in vogue. With a view to President Bush, the late Arthur M. Schlesinger Jr. expanded and reissued the book of the same name he wrote against Richard Nixon, and Bush critics have taken up the phrase in a chorus. In response John Yoo and Richard Posner (and others) have defended the war powers of the president.

    This is not the first time that a strong executive has been attacked and defended, and it will not be the last. Our Constitution, as long as it continues, will suffer this debate--I would say, give rise to it, preside over and encourage it. Though I want to defend the strong executive, I mainly intend to step back from that defense to show why the debate between the strong executive and its adversary, the rule of law, is necessary, good and--under the Constitution--never-ending.

    In other circumstances I could see myself defending the rule of law. Americans are fortunate to have a Constitution that accommodates different circumstances. Its flexibility keeps it in its original form and spirit a "living constitution," ready for change, and open to new necessities and opportunities. The "living constitution" conceived by the Progressives actually makes it a prisoner of ongoing events and perceived trends. To explain the constitutional debate between the strong executive and the rule of law I will concentrate on its sources in political philosophy and, for greater clarity, ignore the constitutional law emerging from it.





    The case for a strong executive should begin from a study, on this occasion a quick survey, of the American republic. The American republic was the first to have a strong executive that was intended to be republican as well as strong, and the success, or long life, of America's Constitution qualifies it as a possible model for other countries. Modern political science beginning from Machiavelli abandoned the best regime featured by classical political science because the best regime was utopian or imaginary. Modern political scientists wanted a practical solution, and by the time of Locke, followed by Montesquieu, they learned to substitute a model regime for the best regime; and this was the government of England. The model regime would not be applicable everywhere, no doubt, because it was not intended to be a lowest common denominator. But it would show what could be done in the best circumstances.
    The American Founders had the ambition to make America the model regime, taking over from England. This is why they showed surprising respect for English government, the regime they had just rebelled against. America would not only make a republic for itself, but teach the world how to make a successful republic and thus improve republicanism and save the reputation of republics. For previous republics had suffered disastrous failure, alternating between anarchy and tyranny, seeming to force the conclusion that orderly government could come only from monarchy, the enemy of republics. Previous republics had put their faith in the rule of law as the best way to foil one-man rule. The rule of law would keep power in the hands of many, or at least a few, which was safer than in the hands of one. As the way to ensure the rule of law, Locke and Montesquieu fixed on the separation of powers. They were too realistic to put their faith in any sort of higher law; the rule of law would be maintained by a legislative process of institutions that both cooperated and competed.

    Now the rule of law has two defects, each of which suggests the need for one-man rule. The first is that law is always imperfect by being universal, thus an average solution even in the best case, that is inferior to the living intelligence of a wise man on the spot, who can judge particular circumstances. This defect is discussed by Aristotle in the well-known passage in his "Politics" where he considers "whether it is more advantageous to be ruled by the best man or the best laws."

    The other defect is that the law does not know how to make itself obeyed. Law assumes obedience, and as such seems oblivious to resistance to the law by the "governed," as if it were enough to require criminals to turn themselves in. No, the law must be "enforced," as we say. There must be police, and the rulers over the police must use energy (Alexander Hamilton's term) in addition to reason. It is a delusion to believe that governments can have energy without ever resorting to the use of force.

    The best source of energy turns out to be the same as the best source of reason--one man. One man, or, to use Machiavelli's expression, uno solo, will be the greatest source of energy if he regards it as necessary to maintaining his own rule. Such a person will have the greatest incentive to be watchful, and to be both cruel and merciful in correct contrast and proportion. We are talking about Machiavelli's prince, the man whom in apparently unguarded moments he called a tyrant.

    The American Founders heeded both criticisms of the rule of law when they created the presidency. The president would be the source of energy in government, that is, in the administration of government, energy being a neutral term that might include Aristotle's discretionary virtue and Machiavelli's tyranny--in which only partisans could discern the difference. The founders of course accepted the principle of the rule of law, as being required by the republican genius of the American people. Under this principle, the wise man or prince becomes and is called an "executive," one who carries out the will and instruction of others, of the legislature that makes the law, of the people who instruct or inspire the legislature. In this weak sense, the dictionary definition of "executive," the executive forbears to rule in his own name as one man. This means that neither one-man wisdom nor tyranny is admitted into the Constitution as such; if there is need for either, the need is subordinated to, or if you will, covered over by, the republican principle of the rule of law.





    Yet the executive subordinated to the rule of law is in danger of being subordinate to the legislature. This was the fault in previous republics. When the separation of powers was invented in 17th-century England, the purpose was to keep the executive subordinate; but the trouble was the weakness of a subordinate executive. He could not do his job, or he could do his job only by overthrowing or cowing the legislature, as Oliver Cromwell had done. John Locke took the task in hand, and made a strong executive in a manner that was adopted by the American Founders.
    Locke was a careful writer, so careful that he did not care if he appeared to be a confused writer. In his "Second Treatise of Government" he announces the supremacy of the legislature, which was the slogan of the parliamentary side in the English Civil War, as the principle that should govern a well-made constitution. But as the argument proceeds, Locke gradually "fortifies" (to use James Madison's term) the executive. Locke adds other related powers to the subordinate power of executing the laws: the federative power dealing with foreign affairs, which he presents as conceptually distinct from the power of executing laws but naturally allied; the veto, a legislative function; the power to convoke the legislature and to correct its representation should it become corrupt; and above all, the prerogative, defined as "the power of doing public good without a rule." Without a rule! Even more: "sometimes too against the direct letter of the law." This is the very opposite of law and the rule of law--and "prerogative" was the slogan of the king's party in the same war.

    Thus Locke combined the extraconstitutional with the constitutional in a contradiction; besides saying that the legislature is "the supreme power" of the commonwealth, he speaks of "the supreme executive power." Locke, one could say, was acting as a good citizen, bringing peace to his country by giving both sides in the Civil War a place in the constitution. In doing so he ensured that the war would continue, but it would be peaceful because he also ensured that, there being reason and force on both sides, neither side could win conclusively.

    The American Constitution adopted this fine idea and improved it. The American Founders helped to settle Locke's deliberate confusion of supremacy by writing it into a document and ratifying it by the people rather than merely scattering it in the treatise of a philosopher. By being formalized the Constitution could become a law itself, but a law above ordinary law and thus a law above the rule of law in the ordinary sense of laws passed by the legislature. Thus some notion of prerogative--though the word "prerogative" was much too royal for American sensibilities--could be pronounced legal inasmuch as it was constitutional. This strong sense of executive power would be opposed, within the Constitution, to the rule of law in the usual, old-republican meaning, as represented by the two rule-of-law powers in the Constitution, the Congress which makes law and the judiciary which judges by the law.

    The American Constitution signifies that it has fortified the executive by vesting the president with "the executive power," complete and undiluted in Article II, as opposed to the Congress in Article I, which receives only certain delegated and enumerated legislative powers. The president takes an oath "to execute the Office of President" of which only one function is to "take care that the laws be faithfully executed." In addition, he is commander-in-chief of the military, makes treaties (with the Senate), and receives ambassadors. He has the power of pardon, a power with more than a whiff of prerogative for the sake of a public good that cannot be achieved, indeed that is endangered, by executing the laws. In the Federalist, as already noted, the executive represents the need for energy in government, energy to complement the need for stability, satisfied mainly in the Senate and the judiciary.





    Energy and stability are necessary in every form of government, but in their previous, sorry history, republics had failed to meet these necessities. Republican government cannot survive, as we would say, by ideology alone. The republican genius is dominant in America, where there has never been much support for anything like an ancien régime, but support for republicanism is not enough to make a viable republic. The republican spirit can actually cause trouble for republics if it makes people think that to be republican it is enough merely to oppose monarchy. Such an attitude tempts a republican people to republicanize everything so as to make government resemble a monarchy as little as possible.
    Although the Federalist made a point of distinguishing a republic from a democracy (by which it meant a so-called pure, nonrepresentative democracy), the urge today to democratize everything has similar bad effects. To counter this reactionary republican (or democratic, in today's language) belief characteristic of shortsighted partisans, the Federalist made a point of holding the new, the novel, American republic to the test of good government as opposed merely to that of republican government.

    The test of good government was what was necessary to all government. Necessity was put to the fore. In the first papers of the Federalist, necessity took the form of calling attention to the present crisis in America, caused by the incompetence of the republic established by the Articles of Confederation. The crisis was both foreign and domestic, and it was a crisis because it was urgent. The face of necessity, the manner in which it first appears and is most impressive, is urgency--in Machiavelli's words, la necessitŕ che non da tempo (the necessity that allows no time). And what must be the character of a government's response to an urgent crisis? Energy. And where do we find energy in the government? In the executive. Actually, the Federalist introduces the need for energy in government considerably before it associates energy with the executive. To soothe republican partisans, the strong executive must be introduced by stages.

    One should not believe that a strong executive is needed only for quick action in emergencies, though that is the function mentioned first. A strong executive is requisite to oppose majority faction produced by temporary delusions in the people. For the Federalist, a strong executive must exercise his strength especially against the people, not showing them "servile pliancy." Tocqueville shared this view. Today we think that a strong president is one who leads the people, that is, one who takes them where they want to go, like Andrew Jackson. But Tocqueville contemptuously regarded Jackson as weak for having been "the slave of the majority." Again according to the Federalist, the American president will likely have the virtue of responsibility, a new political virtue, now heard so often that it seems to be the only virtue, but first expounded in that work.

    "Responsibility" is not mere responsiveness to the people; it means doing what the people would want done if they were apprised of the circumstances. Responsibility requires "personal firmness" in one's character, and it enables those who love fame--"the ruling passion of the noblest minds"--to undertake "extensive and arduous enterprises."

    Only a strong president can be a great president. Americans are a republican people but they admire their great presidents. Those great presidents--I dare not give a complete list--are not only those who excelled in the emergency of war but those, like Washington, Lincoln and Franklin Roosevelt, who also deliberately planned and executed enterprises for shaping or reshaping the entire politics of their country.

    This admiration for presidents extends beyond politics into society, in which Americans, as republicans, tolerate, and appreciate, an amazing amount of one-man rule. The CEO (chief executive officer) is found at the summit of every corporation including universities. I suspect that appreciation for private executives in democratic society was taught by the success of the Constitution's invention of a strong executive in republican politics.





    The case for a strong executive begins from urgent necessity and extends to necessity in the sense of efficacy and even greatness. It is necessary not merely to respond to circumstances but also in a comprehensive way to seek to anticipate and form them. "Necessary to" the survival of a society expands to become "necessary for" the good life there, and indeed we look for signs in the way a government acts in emergencies for what it thinks to be good after the emergency has passed. A free government should show its respect for freedom even when it has to take it away. Yet despite the expansion inherent in necessity, the distinction between urgent crises and quiet times remains. Machiavelli called the latter tempi pacifici, and he thought that governments could not take them for granted. What works for quiet times is not appropriate in stormy times. John Locke and the American Founders showed a similar understanding to Machiavelli's when they argued for and fashioned a strong executive.
    In our time, however, an opinion has sprung up in liberal circles particularly that civil liberties must always be kept intact regardless of circumstances. This opinion assumes that civil liberties have the status of natural liberties, and are inalienable. This means that the Constitution has the status of what was called in the 17th-century natural public law; it is an order as natural as the state of nature from which it emerges. In this view liberty has just one set of laws and institutions that must be kept inviolate, lest it be lost.

    But Locke was a wiser liberal. His institutions were "constituted," less by creation than by modification of existing institutions in England, but not deduced as invariable consequences of disorder in the state of nature. He retained the difference, and so did the Americans, between natural liberties, inalienable but insecure, and civil liberties, more secure but changeable. Because civil liberties are subject to circumstances, a free constitution needs an institution responsive to circumstances, an executive able to be strong when necessary.

    The lesson for us should be that circumstances are much more important for free government than we often believe. Civil liberties are for majorities as well as minorities, and no one should be considered to have rights against society whose exercise would bring society to ruin. The usual danger in a republic is tyranny of the majority, because the majority is the only legitimate dominant force. But in time of war the greater danger may be to the majority from a minority, and the government will be a greater friend than enemy to liberty. Vigilant citizens must be able to adjust their view of the source of danger, and change front if necessary. "Civil liberties" belong to all, not only to the less powerful or less esteemed, and the true balance of liberty and security cannot be taken as given without regard to the threat. Nor is it true that free societies should be judged solely by what they do in quiet times; they should also be judged by the efficacy, and the honorableness, of what they do in war in order to return to peace.





    The American Constitution is a formal law that establishes an actual contention among its three separated powers. Its formality represents the rule of law, and the actuality arises from which branch better promotes the common good in the event, or in the opinion of the people. In quiet times the rule of law will come to the fore, and the executive can be weak. In stormy times, the rule of law may seem to require the prudence and force that law, or present law, cannot supply, and the executive must be strong. In judging the circumstances of a free society, two parties come to be formed around these two outlooks. These outlooks may not coincide with party principles because they often depend on which branch a party holds and feels obliged to defend: Democrats today would be friendlier to executive power if they held the presidency--and Republicans would discover virtue in the rule of law if they held Congress.
    The terms of the disagreement over a strong executive go back to the classic debate between Hamilton (as Pacificus) and Madison (as Helvidius) in 1793-94. Hamilton argued that the executive power, representing the whole country with the energy necessary to defend it, cannot be limited or exhausted. Madison replied that the executive power does not represent the whole country but is determined by its place in the structure of government, which is executing the laws. If carrying on war goes beyond executing the laws, that is all the more reason why the war power should be construed narrowly. Today Republicans and Democrats repeat these arguments when the former declare that we are at war with terrorists and the latter respond that the danger is essentially a matter of law enforcement.

    As to the contention that a strong executive prompts a policy of imperialism, I would admit the possibility, and I promise to think carefully and prayerfully about returning Texas to Mexico. In its best moments, America wants to be a model for the world, but no more. In its less good moments, America becomes disgusted with the rest of the world for its failure to imitate our example and follow our advice. I believe that America is more likely to err with isolationism than with imperialism, and that if America is an empire, it is the first empire that always wants an exit strategy. I believe too that the difficulties of the war in Iraq arise from having wished to leave too much to the Iraqis, thus from a sense of inhibition rather than imperial ambition.

    Mr. Mansfield is William R. Kenan Professor of Government at Harvard.
    This disgusting screed is even more despicable when its source is viewed - this man is a Harvard professor, openly calling for a "Prince" rather than a President, a Cromwell who would be above the rule of law.

    While horrified by the article, I'm saddened at the realization that at least 25% of the American people would agree with it; and moreover that it is the governing principle of the current Presidential administration laid out in the barest terms.
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    Thanatos's Avatar Now Is Not the Time
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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    "I did not fight George the Third to become George the First."

    - George Washington, First U.S. President

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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanatos View Post
    "I did not fight George the Third to become George the First."

    - George Washington, First U.S. President
    The problem is that many Americans have forgotten our political past.
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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    If Thomas sowell can work for Stanford, why can't an authoritarian work for Harvard?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Debs
    The Republican and Democratic parties, or, to be more exact, the Republican-Democratic party, represent the capitalist class in the class struggle. They are the political wings of the capitalist system and such differences as arise between them relate to spoils and not to principles.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhinosaur View Post
    If Thomas sowell can work for Stanford, why can't an authoritarian work for Harvard?
    Er... Stanford is a far more right-wing school than Harvard.
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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheep View Post
    Er... Stanford is a far more right-wing school than Harvard.
    My Abuelito's wife is a Stanford grad and as atheist and WASPy and liberal as they come. I haven't seen any conservatism (other than Sowell's) from that school. Although, truth be told, I don't go there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Debs
    The Republican and Democratic parties, or, to be more exact, the Republican-Democratic party, represent the capitalist class in the class struggle. They are the political wings of the capitalist system and such differences as arise between them relate to spoils and not to principles.

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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhinosaur View Post
    My Abuelito's wife is a Stanford grad and as atheist and WASPy and liberal as they come. I haven't seen any conservatism (other than Sowell's) from that school. Although, truth be told, I don't go there.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condoleezza_Rice

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoover_Institution

    My point was not that Stanford is a right-wing school, just that it is far more conservative than Harvard. You expressed that it was equally surprising (perhaps even moreso) that a conservative scholar could be found at Stanford as opposed to Harvard, and I was indicating that you should not be so very surprised.

    Stanford is widely recognized among academics at least, as the most conservative of the four major universities in the state of California.
    Last edited by Sheep; May 03, 2007 at 11:45 PM.
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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Just like USMA WestPoint is more conservative than UC Berkeley.

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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    stanford is still liberal
    just not harvard liberal
    there are only actually three conservative universities in the top 25 as far as rankings go
    and only one of them has a conservative majority in the student body as well as the faculty

  10. #10

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Are you saying I'm wrong, or right?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Debs
    The Republican and Democratic parties, or, to be more exact, the Republican-Democratic party, represent the capitalist class in the class struggle. They are the political wings of the capitalist system and such differences as arise between them relate to spoils and not to principles.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    I fail to understand why being defined as "right wing" in the thread title is relevant. Is it suppose to be worse because you believe he is right wing or are you attempting to use it as a codeword for something? College professors have a tendency to say alot of things that piss people off and it just happens that alot of those incidents actually involve professors slanted to the left wing and are worse in content then this (Ward Churchill, Chomsky anyone?).

    Only reason Im asking is because I dont understand the point of the thread and what you are trying to say. This is the man's opinion if you disagree with it sure but a bit of substance on why you do would actually make the thread interesting since there would be something to talk about. I dont see what is all that bad about it either

    In quiet times the rule of law will come to the fore, and the executive can be weak. In stormy times, the rule of law may seem to require the prudence and force that law, or present law, cannot supply, and the executive must be strong. In judging the circumstances of a free society, two parties come to be formed around these two outlooks. These outlooks may not coincide with party principles because they often depend on which branch a party holds and feels obliged to defend: Democrats today would be friendlier to executive power if they held the presidency--and Republicans would discover virtue in the rule of law if they held Congress.
    There is alot of truth in that. The problem of course comes when you have a weak president attempting to be that strong one, compare say FDR to Bush. The old saying of knowing ones limitations which is what makes "imperial presidency" a bad idea since you'll never know what you will get.
    Last edited by danzig; May 03, 2007 at 11:04 PM.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    I use the term because it is a widely accepted and used phrase that denotes a more authoritarian outlook on executive power. The term itself derives from the legislature of the French Republic circa 1792; where the "Second Estate", traditionally supporters of the monarchy, were seated to the right of the President's chair.

    Quote Originally Posted by danzig View Post

    Only reason Im asking is because I dont understand the point of the thread and what you are trying to say. This is the man's opinion if you disagree with it sure but a bit of substance on why you do would actually make the thread interesting since there would be something to talk about. I dont see what is all that bad about it either.
    There is alot of truth in that. The problem of course comes when you have a weak president attempting to be that strong one compare say FDR to Bush.
    My disagreement is with the assertion that, at any point, the elected leader of a free people should be above the law. The assertions made in the above article are especially repugnant when viewed in the light of current political matters; e.g., the President using partisan laws to justify his actions ex poste facto, as in the case of the Patriot Act legalizing his wire-tapping activities, and also the case of the 2006 Military Appropriations Act legalizing the President's capture and interrogation of foreign nationals at prisons not open to international scrutiny.

    For myself, I agree more with Thomas Paine than the Macchiavelli that Prof. Mansfield so proudly espouses.

    Let a day be solemnly set apart for proclaiming the charter; let it be brought forth placed on the divine law, the word of God; let a crown be placed thereon, by which the world may know, that so far as we approve of monarchy, that in America THE LAW IS KING. For as in absolute governments the King is law, so in free countries the law ought to be King; and there ought to be no other. *bolding mine*
    Last edited by Phaedo; May 03, 2007 at 11:11 PM.
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  13. #13

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedo View Post
    I use the term because it is a widely accepted and used phrase that denotes a more authoritarian outlook on executive power. The term itself derives from the legislature of the French Republic circa 1792; where the "Second Estate", traditionally supporters of the monarchy, were seated to the right of the President's chair.
    But it is also a distraction since it starts off with an attempt to invoke a judgment (even if that isnt the intention) before someone even reads it thanks to the fact each side of the political spectrum has spent decades demonizing the other so that being called left wing or right wing is often used as a way to dismiss someone before they even open their mouth. The old "left wing loonie" or "right wing nazi" etc.

    Hell I find myself pretty much tossing away any news article, commentary etc that describes someone as "right wing" or "left wing" since usually its done to box everything into nice orderly little we vs them. Everyone is so eager to define themselves but even more so to define someone ELSE.

    For myself, I agree more with Thomas Paine than the Macchiavelli that Prof. Mansfield so proudly espouses.
    Cant argue but which one is more realistic given the way people are? Paine is what it should, Macchiavelli is more what it is. Ill use my FDR example again, FDR in terms of US presidency goes wielded an unmatched level of influence and power which given what was going on in the world was absolutely necessary imo. My agreement with the original article is pretty much limited to, yeah sometimes it IS necessary to have that "Prince".
    Last edited by danzig; May 03, 2007 at 11:19 PM.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by danzig View Post
    But it is also a distraction since it starts off with an attempt to invoke a judgment (even if that isnt the intention) before someone even reads it thanks to the fact each side of the political spectrum has spent decades demonizing the other so that being called left wing or right wing is often used as a way to dismiss someone before they even open their mouth. The old "left wing loonie" or "right wing nazi" etc.

    Hell I find myself pretty much tossing away any news article, commentary etc that describes someone as "right wing" or "left wing" since usually its done to box everything into nice orderly little we vs them. Everyone is so eager to define themselves but even more so to define someone ELSE.



    Cant argue but which one is more realistic given the way people are? Paine is what it should, Macchiavelli is more what it is. Ill use my FDR example again, FDR in terms of US presidency goes wielded an unmatched level of influence and power which given what was going on in the world was absolutely necessary imo. My agreement with the original article is pretty much limited to, yeah sometimes it IS necessary to have that "Prince".
    Well considered response.

    However, I object to both assertions. Even if Paine is more ideal than substance, his thoughts of liberty and freedom from political oppression were central in stoking the American Revolution and substantially influenced later lawmaking, pieces of which included the U.S. Constitution and the appended Bill of Rights. Paine's ideas and principles guided the laws that are the foundation of this country - and now these foundations are being shaken, not simply by the ideals espoused by men such as this professor, but by concrete actions from the most influential executive position in our republic.

    If a President can consider himself above the law in times of crisis, what preserves legislative oversight? I personally see even the temporary suspension of habeas corpus, such as that used by Lincoln during the Civil War (and more pertinently, the American government's holding of U.S. citizen Jose Padilla for 3 years without indictment) as unjust; and to support this trend not only damages the system of checks and balances that preserves our republican institutions, but also endangers your personal rights.

    Legally, any U.S. citizen could be accused of cooperating with foreign terrorists and be imprisoned indefinately; it is important to remember that under current law, nothing prevents this. Indeed, the President's right to withhold habeas corpus from U.S. citizens was upheld by a three-man panel of the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals.

    And to draw a strong demarcation between the actions of FDR and Bush - can you produce evidence that FDR's unconstitutional actions went unchallenged? The Supreme Court overturned several of his New Deal provisions; and whether his good record would have withstood postwar scrutiny of events such as his illegal promises to Churchill is open to discussion.

    I do agree that in stormy times, strong leadership is needed. But it must be open and accountable to both law and people - to assert otherwise is, in my opinion, a grave perversion of the precepts this country was founded on.

    But if you can provide an argument for why unaccountable executive authority is preferable, I'll be happy to listen.
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  15. #15

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedo View Post
    And to draw a strong demarcation between the actions of FDR and Bush - can you produce evidence that FDR's unconstitutional actions went unchallenged? The Supreme Court overturned several of his New Deal provisions; and whether his good record would have withstood postwar scrutiny of events such as his illegal promises to Churchill is open to discussion.
    Was late when I posted that so was a bit rushed so I wasnt clear. Its not that I support the "imperial presidency" but rather I dont think what Mansfield said was especially "disgusting" as it did imo make a valid point even though like you I disagree with an unaccountable presidency. Sorry if I wasnt clear on that.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhinosaur View Post
    Are you saying I'm wrong, or right?
    neither, I am saying stanford is not as liberal as Harvard, but they are both liberal - everyone is right


    @the whole right wing thing - I enjoy the argument but this is a political forum and right wing, although relative to a certain time and place, is a perfectly acceptable and necessary term as is left wing and all the other standard terminology of political debate

  17. #17

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Not moreso, but maybe equally surprised, considering the amount of right wing crybabies *****ing that college is full of lefty commie fags who hate America.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Debs
    The Republican and Democratic parties, or, to be more exact, the Republican-Democratic party, represent the capitalist class in the class struggle. They are the political wings of the capitalist system and such differences as arise between them relate to spoils and not to principles.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhinosaur View Post
    Not moreso, but maybe equally surprised, considering the amount of right wing crybabies *****ing that college is full of lefty commie fags who hate America.
    Well just ask them one question then.

    Who was provost of Stanford University between 1993 and 1999?
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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhinosaur View Post
    Not moreso, but maybe equally surprised, considering the amount of right wing crybabies *****ing that college is full of lefty commie fags who hate America.
    colleges in america are typically left leaning but that is as it should be because the left typically (not so much these days) is more inclusive of various points of view on a subject while the right (whether pragmatist or religious) tends to think there are only a few specific answers on any issues or a range, etc.

    leftists environments are more likely to produce people who can think for themselves (think outside their box)

    also, successful people tend to go right while unsuccessful people tend to go left, that is why you will always see more conservative administrators at colleges with leftist faculty, the conservatives (for good or bad) rise to the top more often.
    This is true in most, and I stress most not all, walks of life

    the right is really only made up of four types - warhawk/isolationist/pragmatist/religious - while the left incorporates variety without end
    which means the right has more concrete answers and a easier time creating a platform that pleases all of their constituents in some way
    Last edited by enoch; May 04, 2007 at 12:08 AM. Reason: addendum

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    Default Re: Right-Wing Harvard Professor Openly Advocates Dictatorship

    Is this guy joking? Has he read the Federalist papers? The founding fathers were not proponents of Machiavelli. They wanted the exact opposite of what European autocracies had. After the War of Independence there was a debate about whether to even become a country! The federalists managed to convince Americans that it was in their best interest to unite. However, they promised that the federal government would be kept small and that States would do the majority of governing.

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