Racism alive and well in USA

[Erich von Manstein]

And who better to demonstrate this than Barack Obama?

Ah, but I'm not talking about your typical left-wing blather about "institutional" racism, incidents of The Man trying to keep a good brotha down. Oh no. This is the worst form of racism - the form dictating that comments and statements are allowable or not based solely on your race. Whenever a white person makes comments like this, no matter how well-intentioned, they are quickly labeled racists by the likes of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. As a result (as Obama points out), such discussion has been rudely shoved out of the public discourse and can only be found in private settings.

Now, before someone gets the idea that I'm ripping on Obama, let me make it clear that I am doing anything but. He is taking a stance that requires quite a bit of courage, given that whites are instinctively classified as southern rednecks if they adopt this viewpoint and Bill Crosby was ostracized by the black community a year ago for making very similar comments. Who knows, this could be some sort of bold campaign ploy on Obama's part - either way, it takes a lot of guts to say what he's saying, given his campaign is riding on it.

Obama's taking the black community to task for its own shortcomings. He made similar statements in East Africa last year, telling the people there to essentially quit blaming their many problems on their historical status as colonies of Great Powers and to start pulling themselves up by their own bootstraps instead of demanding more handouts. Now Obama's telling the African American community to do the same thing - stop expecting others to pick you up when you're refusing to stand up on your own. And he has a point. The so-called "signs" of "institutional racism" - believing that blacks are underachievers, believing that most blacks are criminals, believing most blacks aspire for the sensual delights of a rapper's life and nothing more - are all supported by actual evidence. Black students doing well in school are told by their peers to stop acting so "white." These students reach young adulthood and they take it a step further, displaying absolutely no sense of financial responsibility as they deplete their meager funds on "ice" and "bling." And when, years later, they're stuck working a menial job, they blame a white society that "keeps them down," rather than realizing how many opportunities they had to actually make a life for themselves, institutional racism or no institutional racism.

I'll be curious to see how Obama fares. Crosby's similar statements regarding this issue resulted in his virtual tar and feathering. Can Obama, the Golden Boy of black America and the Democratic Party, do any better?

[God-Emperor of Mankind]

Well from what I have seen, he has a point.
Kudos to Obama for saying it.
Took alot of guts.

[Bwaho]

he speaketh of that which must not be spoken of...

[Oswald von Wolkenstein]

Interesting. Haven't heard it yet. Cosby aside though, there are a number of African Americans in the intelltual community who have been saying similar things for years. Larry Elder, of course, comes to mind and Thomas Sowell from the Hoover Institue, has been examining these issues for decades. Sowell even demonstrated that black Africans who immigrate to the US, achieve a higher economic level of success within one generation than the descendants of slaves. Demonstrating, on the one hand, the horrific devestation of slavery (a crime against humanity committed in the U.S.), on the other hand, also demonstrating that racial prejudice based on skin color is not the limiting factor is was thought to be.

Still, there needs to be some balanced look at this, and honesty. African Americans are no longer the most economically disadvantaged group in the U.S. but they are the group most frequently subjected to attacks based on race -- and that kind of abuse is an impediment - Nonetheless, overcoming it will come both within and without. Things have changed and a real change in mentality is occuring across the U.S..

Consider this -- like it or not -- Don Imus wasn't fired because of Al Sharpton or even because of any action group -- he was fired because white investors and listeners didn't want to be associated with his words. That's actually a really good sign -- it's one step -- albeit a rather clumsy one -- towards eliminating attention to arbitrary dividers like skin color. Gradually, black and white America are forming a single cultural unit and I hope that will lead to the end of racial prejudice as a major factor in the day to day lives of most people. As the saying goes, I hope to live to see the day that the color of a person's skin is of no more significance than the color of their eyes.

[Hunter Makoy]

Interesting. Haven't heard it yet. Cosby aside though, there are a number of African Americans in the intelltual community who have been saying similar things for years. Larry Elder, of course, comes to mind and Thomas Sowell from the Hoover Institue, has been examining these issues for decades. Sowell even demonstrated that black Africans who immigrate to the US, achieve a higher economic level of success within one generation than the descendants of slaves. Demonstrating, on the one hand, the horrific devestation of slavery (a crime against humanity committed in the U.S.), on the other hand, also demonstrating that racial prejudice based on skin color is not the limiting factor is was thought to be.

so wat u r saying is that people r racist against the decendants of slaves, not against blacks or africans? that doesn't make any sense. for one thing this 'devastation of slavery' doesn't exist anymore. AAs r not former slaves, nor r any of their living relatives. sorry, but the excuse of slavery is starting to die out, and needs too. u illistrate that in ur point that Africans achieve a better standing quicker then AAs. that has nothing to do with slavery and everything to do with their viewpoint and their outlook towards other americans. and if u wanna talk about someone who's been devastated more? africans have had much more devastation brought upon them in africa then AAs have over here. and yet AAs still hold to the fact that 'oh well my great great great great grandfather was a slave, so ive been treated badly and my family has been treated badly', while the average african has gone thru worse just trying to get to america. this generation of AAs were not slaves, nor the children of slaves, they were also not a victom of segregation, but they still do wat they can to use that as an excuse. a promenant black guy was being interviewd on FOX news a lil while ago over the use of the n word. he was saying that it shouldnt' be used. the interviewer pointed out how much black people over use the word. guess who he blamed for that? WHITES AND SLAVERY!

[Last Roman]

My respect for Obama has only gone up after reading this. I saw that some are questioning this as simple politicking, and while I don't doubt that there is some of that going on, I think that Obama is being sincere about this.

[Erich von Manstein]

Yeah, uh, I definitely didn't intend to post that in the TD. Sorry for any confusion.

Moved to the 'Pit.

[Ummon]

The more Obama speaks, the less he is convincing. The more he sounds rational, the less I trust him.

I must be evil. Or, perhaps, intuitive...

[Sheep]

I must be evil. Or, perhaps, intuitive...

*cheerful* You could also be both! Don't sell yourself short!

[Ummon]

I might be both, but in that case, I would trust Obama. :wink:

[Sheep]

I might be both, but in that case, I would trust Obama. :wink:

Well that's the trouble with politicians. How can you trust anyone that actually WANTS the job enough to give up 2 years of their life campaigning for it?

[Last Roman]

Well that's the trouble with politicians. How can you trust anyone that actually WANTS the job enough to give up 2 years of their life campaigning for it?

heh, you can't. You pick the one that you distrust less.

[Carach]

black rappers have only recently began losing material on the subject of their oppression with which to rap about in their tunes.. most southern folk ive spoken with (either directly or indirectly) still maintain an extreme hatred for mexicans and black people.

but then......................theres the neoliberal racism (aka the racism that isnt racism, but its made racism...you follow me? lol..)

thats where i draw the line.

[Ummon]

My main issue with the man, is not his goal (power is certainly always enticing, when one doesn't know that it is a responsibility more than anything else), nor his race (a black president would be good, in absolute terms) but the astute demagoguery. I cannot cease to remember prophecies on the anti-Christ any time I hear Obama.

As a Jungian, my approach to the supernatural is made of two parallel views: skeptic investigation and open-mindedness.

Openmindedness makes it that I do not refuse the possibility of foreseeing the future. Besides, the possibility of foreseeing the future is something which is currently investigated by prominent scientists.

A long story short, something itches me, in Obama.

[Carach]

My main issue with the man, is not his goal (power is certainly always enticing, when one doesn't know that it is a responsibility more than anything else), nor his race (a black president would be good, in absolute terms)

wouldnt you rather have a president picked on merit rather than race?

"he's black, lets pick him otherwise blacks may be offended.."

or.. "she's a woman, lets pick her because thats not been done yet..."

heh..

[Sidmen]

wouldnt you rather have a president picked on merit rather than race?

"he's black, lets pick him otherwise blacks may be offended.."

or.. "she's a woman, lets pick her because thats not been done yet..."

heh..

poor foolish Carach... Presidents arn't picked because they are qualified for the job. They are picked because they look pretty, people liked thier father, they talk real good, or because the other guy stinks more. Running for presidency is a popularity contest--nothing more.

[Alatar]

poor foolish Carach... Presidents arn't picked because they are qualified for the job. They are picked because they look pretty, people liked thier father, they talk real good, or because the other guy stinks more. Running for presidency is a popularity contest--nothing more.

You talk sense.

[Ummon]

In absolute terms, as I said. The complete absence of a black president, is a sign of discrimination, given that many americans are black.

[Krazy Munkey]

Yes. This is a plague affecting all minority communities. I am saddened by the current pure racism present in U.S. politics. Obama, aside from Kucinich, is probably the most sane candidate.

[Lawrence of Arabia]

I never knew Bing Crosby had a relative who called out blacks.