Vassal States

[Krusoth_the_Plague]

Salve,

When a computer opponent kneels and becomes a vassal, will they remain so forever? Can they ever betray you?

I assume the answer is yes, but I'd like to be sure before I pass this opportunity up.

Thanks!

[crazyj]

I think they will if they have no room to expand but in your direction, i.e. they're cornered off in Spain or something. Make sure they border somebody you aren't allied with, so they don't get out of vassalage via something cheap either. Just always leave them with somebody to fight, and they should stay your vassal.

[Krusoth_the_Plague]

Thanks for the speedy reply. I'll let the English stare at a French city until I'm ready to finish them off.

Cheers!

[Pnutmaster]

Is the 'vassal' system essentially the same thing as the protectorates from RTW? I have seen the AI make and break vassal agreements, but I haven't seen 'vassal' as an option on the diplomacy scroll.

What's the deal?

[Tadzreuli]

how other faction became as a vassal state? what player must do for this?

[DavidtheDuke]

Vassalship is broken. Don't bother with it until the patch to see if they address the uselessness of it (I've yet to read a outcome where either the Vassal or vassal-lord actually kept the agreement, which is by the way always broken by the AI on either side)

[Derfel von Saljeth]

This is my second campaign and in both i managed to have a Vassal

In first campaign , playing as sicily egipt became my vassal (he had 5-6 regions left) and i've never been betrayed... 120 turns so far. I was winning a war with them, and while besieging one of their cities they "offered" me a cease fire asking 25k florins... I asked them to became my vassal at the same price and they accepted. And altho i sorround them, and they can't expand, they don't backstabbed me

In the second campaign (as scotland) , i was winning against france, besieging them... i was offered ceasefire, but i asked to became vassal for 10k florins and they accepted. 20 turns and no problems

Campaign is set on Hard, so seems for me it works

[Arcaliea]

20 turns is nothing, by the way - but that 120turn vassalage sounds promising. Did you leave strong garrisons at the border, leave it totally open, or a mix of both? How many provinces wree the Egyptians left with, and did they pursue other enemies, or go into passive AI and really sit there and do nothing?

At the very least it's promising to hear that it CAN work.

[Derfel von Saljeth]

@Arcaliea
Against egyptians: i own all the regiorns around them, so they can't expand further... they still own 7 territories, i see their troops (they still have a good ammount of troops) move around their territories and kick rebels, using merchants but they seems enjoy the peace with me. I give them 1k or 2k florins every 8-10 turns to keep them happy
Owning Holy lands costal regiorns, i share with them many borders but i only keep 1 full stack in the sector while in other cities i keep 5-6 units garrison.
Ah.. another interesthing thing is it seems to add your vassals territories in the region count (you now where you see won and lost battles, how many castle and cities and so on)



lol just noted one of their stack in about to kick a rebel army in my territories ...

edit: img added of my territories near them... btw 127 turns now

[Zarekk]

@Arcaliea
Against egyptians: i own all the regiorns around them, so they can't expand further... they still own 7 territories, i see their troops (they still have a good ammount of troops) move around their territories and kick rebels, using merchants but they seems enjoy the peace with me. I give them 1k or 2k florins every 8-10 turns to keep them happy
Owning Holy lands costal regiorns, i share with them many borders but i only keep 1 full stack in the sector while in other cities i keep 5-6 units garrison.
Ah.. another interesthing thing is it seems to add your vassals territories in the region count (you now where you see won and lost battles, how many castle and cities and so on)



lol just noted one of their stack in about to kick a rebel army in my territories ...

edit: img added of my territories near them... btw 127 turns now

How is it that you have that much money?

[Hundred]

How is it that you have that much money?

Probably add_money 40000 cheat.

[Derfel von Saljeth]

How is it that you have that much money?

In my scots campaign i'm at turn 250 (campaign if over long time before turn 225) and i can afford anything i like, i atm have 450k florins and i don't have idea how to spend them... so i make tests, keep my neightbours and allies at top of friendship and so on...
I never had bankroupt in this campaign , but always a good income every year...
My cash only dropped when Black Death reached me

[netfool]

How is it that you have that much money?

As said above, it's not too hard. I'm on turn 110 or so as Denmark and I have around 240,000 in the bank, I profit about 15k/turn. I've only conquered the English Isle and Antioch so far to.

Anyways, on my previous Venice campaign, I managed to get the HRE as a Vassal. They had 4-5 territories between France & Germany. I didn't notice any tribute from them, I believe they were bankrupt, but they never back stabbed me.

[Axe-Battler]

i was being spanish and at war with french, i conquered three of their cities, they had two left. i then offered them to become my vassal. and they agreed.
We had bitterness between our nations and are stance was "abysmal",
but i kept an army by one of their cities to keep them under my control.

Vassal ship is greatly improved over rome and does work in mtw2. You simply need to have enough power over them and keep an eye out and gaurd them so they do not betray.
They will betray you if they feel they can overcome you, so keep stronger than your vassal.

[ProudNerd]

i was being spanish and at war with french, i conquered three of their cities, they had two left. i then offered them to become my vassal. and they agreed.
We had bitterness between our nations and are stance was "abysmal",
but i kept an army by one of their cities to keep them under my control.

Vassal ship is greatly improved over rome and does work in mtw2. You simply need to have enough power over them and keep an eye out and gaurd them so they do not betray.
They will betray you if they feel they can overcome you, so keep stronger than your vassal.

Sounds perfectly realistic to me. This is how it should work.

The first possibility is, you want to save an opponent from destruction. They have one province or so left and rather than wipe them out, you offer them peace. Without fail, every time, with every concession the offer is refused. (On H/H for me anyway). The AI will uniformly chose destruction over peace.

well it makes sense in a way, you're crushed them utterly killing their people and taking their land away i think in that situation id rather fight to the death against my oppressors and die heroic int he face of overwhelming odds then submit to my conquerors. Remember the Alamo.

[Siddyus]

BTW, what are the benefits of a vassal state to your empire? do they provide you extra florins?

[magickyleo101]

In RTW a protectorate will "betray" you if you go to war with one of its allies, and I imagine that it's the same here. Before you get a vassle, check to see who it's allied with and try not to go to war with them.

[Xraider]

if the Vassal thing is the same like Protectorate from RTW then yes , they give some Florins . In Rome you needed to leave a 2-4 unit garisson and then - no problemos whit protectorates . But anyway - the Vassal system is kinda useless . Neither do they give somekinda of a fun or any use . But if you made somebody your vassal then assinated their entire family like me

[dopp]

Yes. You get a large percentage of their income each turn (around 25%). I'm going to experiment with leaving the Egyptians alive to manage Cairo and Alexandria for me.

[scottn72]

I didn't think you gained any money from a vassal currently, just military access etc. could be wrong!

It's annoying it isn't mentioned in the manual at all.