what makes people think they are so great?

[Amorphos]

what makes people think they are so great?

a beautiful woman is not actually so, they just have good DNA and this doesn’t make ‘them’ beautiful.
a great sportsman may be similar, ok so it takes a great deal of work, but you have to have the right genetics to begin with. that is why people whom work equally hard may come first or last, why one has the skill to get past another and score a goal, its not that one is better than the other!

so why all the yay i’ve done it? is it all just self gratification on false pretences?

on another level, why do stars of all varieties think they are so great and deserve so much money - have they no humility? isn’t a lot of it to do with luck of the draw, being in the right place at the right time, connections and money [which is usually needed to begin anything like a band etc].

jus a rant at the glamourous and the lucky

[Tajir]

One of the great things about my faith is that it tells me that no man is above humanity or average status.

Its like in the game, when you catch that ten-star, ten-dread general, and when you plan to execute him, he grovels to you.

I love the idea that all men are equal. I love the fact that peasants slit the throat of Julius Caesar, and I love the fact that any man who thinks of himself as God, be him King or Athlete, are ALL weak!

Good thread! I always looked at it this way as well; we're all nothing but savage beings, and to think that we can use our bodies and minds to sway people to thinking otherwise about our existence, is absolutely assinine. Because in the end, Nicole Kidman takes a crap just like me and you, Mohamed Ali lost some fights, the USSR fell apart over night, the United States is losing a war to peasants, and Brittney Spears despite all her money and glory is suffering from depression and mental health issues.

Justice shines clearly in the strangest places.

[Amorphos]

ha, nice reply dahir.

of course the same applies to Mohammed or Jesus etc. you would not have a religion without some pretentious a-hole saying to follow [in some way].its a shame these people weren’t like the greek philosophers we could all learn from them without the catches then.

[harm]

The man who is incapable of working in common, or who in his self-sufficiency has no need of others, is no part of the community,' wrote Aristotle. Such a man is 'like an animal or a god'. Achilles, to Zeus alone for the validation of his claim to honor, has made himself independent of his fellow men. He re-enters the battle not to save his compatriots, but in pursuit of a private revenge. In the cataclysmic battle that follows he is both subhuman and superhuman. both bestial and divine. He is likened to a forest fire, to a massive ox threshing barely, to a lion (repeatedly), to the Dog Star that rains down pestilence, to the frenzied god of war. He kills and kills and kills until the earth is drenched with blood and the river that flows before the walls of Troy is choked with corpses. His rampage is outrageous, so transgressive in the extremity of its violence that earth and heaven alike are angered by it.

I wish I got Achilles genes

[KIllerGecko]

It has to do with how a person is raised. Most people (a few exceptions) can look or be as physically adept as they want to be. Of course, money can be a factor in certain realms. What happens with many people that think they're so great is that they, have been told or lead upon their entire life to think they're great. While some are not told this all their life, great fame and support can of course, go to a persons head. When that happens, thats when people start to believe that they are better than every one else. Take Brittany spears for example, as far as i knew she was just another useless singer who made average-subpar songs but, because the songs for most people became popular she had many fans, many supporters and chances are greater than naught that she was told ever since she became famous that she is great at what she does. Eventually of course, this can lead to an inflated ego, which also leads to thinking you're better than some one else. About the physical part, some people are actually rather unlucky with the genes they have been given but, with enough work and $$ any face now days can become as good looking as a person wants. enless that person wants to be taller... thats a bit different. (human growth hormone ftw! jk)

[turtle]

Good posts, generally.

The thought of one's self being great is often constituted by either sociological (parents, caregivers) praise or personal actions, or both. In reality, very few are actually great, in my opinion, but there are great people. They may have been just people and pretty much no different than any other person, but their actions speak louder than their looks or inherent abilities. When someone does great things, despite their social or physical condition, that is great. But, when someone does something great when they've got all the tools, space and ability to do so, that is not so great. Do you see what I'm saying here. It all depends on circumstance. Most truely great people wouldn't consider themselves to be great. The ones who have emense ability and social ease are the ones who usually think themselves to be great, simply because they have been told they are or because they utilized the already perfected methods and tools to accomplish something.

Going back to the main question: Most people's self labeling of greatness comes from their own lust for self gratification... their own desire to be recognized. When someone thinks/knows themselves to be great of higher than another, that is when they cease to be great, IMO.

[Sadreddine]

Agreed. A person may be great in what he/she does, but the greatest the is one who doesn't sincerely consider himself/herself great at all.

I myself ony have a deep respect for those who are great in fields of knowledge. For me, the worst of people are those who, based on mere physical merit (be it sportive or based on physical appearance) or social merit ("star" singers, actors or actresses) consider themselves superior to others. Along with those who inherit a fortune and consider themselves to have the right, provided by money, to look down on others.

Very few of those are able to overcome their own greed and self-centrism, and yet those who are able to do it are the greatest of them, even if they don't make as many bucks, or any bucks at all.

[Zephrelial]

Quetzacoatl I think I have the answer of your first question.What makes one think he is so great?
That depends exactly how his merit is in harmony with his ego.I'll try to explain this as best as I can.By ego I mean our innerself.Who we really want to be?
What we want from life?So by that I mean our secret desires,the things we desire most.
Let's suppose girls are very important for someone.And let's call this someone B.
B dates many girls, have sex with tons of them.So his ego is satisfied.He thinks he is Omnipotent,a God.Because his greatest motive and desires are satisfied.
But B doesn't make much money.Doesn't have any friends.That just don't matter.These kinds of things do not concern him because they are not totally part of their ego.
As for me I don't think I'm great because my ego is not satisfied.But I feel that greatness when I have ever got close to satisfying it.I hope I could explain a bit.

[AngryTitusPullo]

what makes people think they are so great?

a beautiful woman is not actually so, they just have good DNA and this doesn’t make ‘them’ beautiful.
a great sportsman may be similar, ok so it takes a great deal of work, but you have to have the right genetics to begin with. that is why people whom work equally hard may come first or last, why one has the skill to get past another and score a goal, its not that one is better than the other!

so why all the yay i’ve done it? is it all just self gratification on false pretences?

on another level, why do stars of all varieties think they are so great and deserve so much money - have they no humility? isn’t a lot of it to do with luck of the draw, being in the right place at the right time, connections and money [which is usually needed to begin anything like a band etc].

jus a rant at the glamourous and the lucky

That main question is, would you yourself will be thinking yourself as great, if somehow you were at their place ?

Who knows a month from now, you're just strolling down the street and some dude by the name of Steven Speilberg stops you and ask you to be in his movie, and by some fluke the movie sells well and everyone likes your act in there and you have enough money to buy a piece of property at Beverly Hills.

Will you still be having the same question as you have now ? Or you just think' Who gives a duck what people think of me. I know I'm great !!'

of course the same applies to Mohammed or Jesus etc. you would not have a religion without some pretentious a-hole saying to follow [in some way].its a shame these people weren’t like the greek philosophers we could all learn from them without the catches then.

At least for me, Muhammad (or religion) teaches me of how to behave even when I have everything in this world. It teaches me to be humble and accept that everything that has been granted to me is from God alone and He can take it back anytime He wishes.

Whether I will still be humble when and if I have everything in this world is of course another story.

[coffebean]

WOAH
deepness
in my opinion the average person isn't that deep as you mate
and they will think how important they are on how much they attention they get not on generally what they do.
celebrities you see get a lot of attention so they in there mind are important cause why else would so many people be interested in me? makes sense huh?

the world is a lot more simple than most people believe
unfortunately people will mistake that and say the world is stupid

[boofhead]

Reminds me of the story where a man in a restaurant finds a hair in his soup. He is repulsed and thinks it is disgusting, he complains vehemently. But when a drop-dead gorgeous waitress apologizes that it was her own hair that fell in the soup....the hair was no longer disgusting to him.

I find many of the Hollywood stars, politicians, big business executives etc to be posers and very shallow people. I actually think there should be a cap on personal wealth - it is disgusting how much a single individual can acquire. A guy who can kick a soccer-ball gets every day/week what I earn in a year - and I actually contribute with manual hard labour to the betterment of the earth?

It makes me sick actually. I am not a vindictive person, but when these people go broke as sometimes happens, I laugh to myself and think "Now you can experience life as a normal person" which is in fact way better here in the West than in most of the world anyway.

And why do "stars" buy handbags worth $20,000 FFS?

Those Google boys have it right - one still drives around in a bomb of a car - sentimental value. I give that guy my vote.

[Scar Face]

what makes people think they are so great?

What makes people think they are so great? I don't know why people think they are great, but I know I am.

a beautiful woman is not actually so, they just have good DNA and this doesn’t make ‘them’ beautiful.

Hm? Yes it does. Thats exactly what it makes them.

a great sportsman may be similar, ok so it takes a great deal of work, but you have to have the right genetics to begin with. that is why people whom work equally hard may come first or last, why one has the skill to get past another and score a goal, its not that one is better than the other!

Thats exactly what it is. The person has the better genes, so it comes easier to him than the others. He is better at it.

so why all the yay i’ve done it? is it all just self gratification on false pretences?

Hardly so. Everything everyone does, and how well, is based at least on some level on their genes. All they have done is what they did, not their genes. The genes just helped along. If we can say genes are their reason for success, and its not them (It is their genes...but really its the same thing) then everyones failure is based upon their genes as well....so no one can take credit for anything, good or bad. Do you see the ill-logic of this?

on another level, why do stars of all varieties think they are so great and deserve so much money - have they no humility? isn’t a lot of it to do with luck of the draw, being in the right place at the right time, connections and money [which is usually needed to begin anything like a band etc].

They think they deserve money, because when they ask for it they get it. For many people, that begins to chip away at who they once were, and they begin to think they truly do deserve it.

And why do "stars" buy handbags worth $20,000 FFS?

Why do you have to ask this question? Is it not answered in the quote "Power corrupts, apsoloute power corrupts apsoloutely" ? They buy handbags worth $20,000, because they can.

I love the fact that peasants slit the throat of Julius Caesar

Peasents? Hardly. They were hardly peasents, they were hardly the Liberators they pretended to be as well.

[Siblesz]

Survival of the fittest. We are individual organisms that are trying to survive. Mix in billions of organic particles in one, and billions of years of evolution, and you get a human being. But we're still those same endless particles, all woven together by the universe's energy and mass.

The mind, an immediate extension of our survivalist instincts, tells us that we're individuals, when we're just tiny parts of a large mass. It's an illusion of mind. It's hard to understand this reality, because the ego will try to deny it to death. In Buddhism they call it the negation of the self. I think it's impossible to do so. It's possible to deny yourself as an individual in theory, but impossible in practice. Until death, that is.

[Amorphos]

turtle
yes i agree there is a kind of greatness unique to the individual,einstiens genes probably weren’t that special - he didn’t have the highest iq but did well with it.

ibn rushd
agreed! it seams that the realm of mind is where its at.

zeph
yes i think i see what you mean, the ego is satisfied and constitutes greatness if enough people agree - uphold the ego. i would presume that this is equivalent to them having the same proportions of ego?

lestaT

no i don’t think so, but if it happened when i was younger then perhaps i would have got drunk in ego too yes. i like to think i would be humble enough to do things for others as well as myself,and i couldnt bare living in a big mansion house or something.
religion can teach you this yes, but what i am saying is that philosophy does too i,e, they could have said all the wisdoms that they did without trying to make claims on being a god or that their words are gods words.

coffebean
hmm interesting and profound point for someone not so deep? stupidity and simplicity can be confused yes! in some ways the world is stupid though, and yes in others merely simple.

boofhead
ha disgustingness is subjective - nice example. i agree completely about the rest of your post!

scarface
hmm nah, what i am saying is that a beautiful woman is a genetic construct, but if you think that is ‘who’ she is then fine... kinda missing the point though i.e.it is not something she has done or attained in any way - it is given.

sibs
is that all we are? is the 'mind' just a chemical circuit made of millions of little batteries? another debate perhaps.

as above, the question is; are people great because of something given or because of something they themselves have achieved?

i wouldn’t deny the individual before or after death - thats why i am not a buddhist i suppose.

don’t you ever watch the flow of mind between people - how we may get the same ideas at the same time as another, how one may pick an idea 'out of the air' [Aether] and make that invention just before someone else, or how people separated in reagions and sometimes in time can arrive at a certain idea or set of? i am sure you know what i mean!

[LSJ]

I think greatness should be measured by your intent, then secondly your success.
A good man has good intent and tries to do good things - a great man has good intent and accomplishes good things.

Unless celebrities use their wealth to help those in need and do not keep 99% of it to spend on useless junk, they are not great people.
I do not believe that those who entertain us for money should be valued higher than those who save lives, or protect our freedoms. How are the actors and singers our greatest people? They won't be remembered when they die. They have not changed the world for the better. A paramedic who saves a mans life has also saved that man's future kids, and their kids, and their kids' kids... An actor only makes us laugh for an hour for ten bucks. @_@
People just don't appreciate the things that keep our way of life going (or keep us alive). In general they spend too much time looking for fun and praising the jesters in the short term than giving alms to those who care for the the orphans over the long term.

[Amorphos]

darkprophet
well said - here’s to all the unspoken hero’s, the truly great people. i know i couldn’t do what the average paramedic does daily.

so much stupid waste in the west especially, such spending is unethical, i would ban all ‘names’ in the fashion world if it were down to me... or put caps on how much a product can be sold for. don’t know how one could limit the size of homes or how many yachts one can own [if any at all]. but i do think there should be limits unfortunately rich people would just move to where those limits don’t exist unless it was all nice places. perhaps society needs to frown on them a bit more just so its not cool!

[Scar Face]

scarface
hmm nah, what i am saying is that a beautiful woman is a genetic construct, but if you think that is ‘who’ she is then fine... kinda missing the point though i.e.it is not something she has done or attained in any way - it is given.

Who said her bueaty was not given? Not I. I realize that she was born that way, but does that make her any less "great"? Does she have any less to reason to be proud of her bueaty? It all depends on your definition of what a great person is I suppose.

[LoZz]

ego, some people hve it larger then others

[Siblesz]

don’t you ever watch the flow of mind between people - how we may get the same ideas at the same time as another, how one may pick an idea 'out of the air' [Aether] and make that invention just before someone else, or how people separated in reagions and sometimes in time can arrive at a certain idea or set of? i am sure you know what i mean!

Isn't that proof our out inter-connectedness in the hidden and natural unconscious? Not of our individuality in society? Sure, we're all unique in one given way or other, but that is more of a matter of chance and interplay (two people can't have the same DNA type and environmental consequences). But that does not detract from the fact that the soul is not individual. It is universal. The soul is just the force that keeps everything together. The energy field of our bodies that is always in interaction with the energy of the planet and universe, if you will. For though we are made of mass, that mass is powered by energy. And energy is what all organisms in this planet share, whether conscious of it or not.

[Tecumseh]

An actor only makes us laugh for an hour for ten bucks.

On the subject of people such as actors being paid too much, and the "unsung hero" recieving nothing, the blame rests solely with each of us.

It is an injustice and a crime that the actor makes 20 million dollars to perform in a movie, while the paramedic struggles to pay their car insurance. However, that is capitalism for you. I am by no means a communist, and I'm not railing against capitalism, but it's impossible to just blame "society" for injustices such as these. The sports star generates add revenue on television and sells crappy merchandise. The paramedic sells nothing, nothing of commercial value anyways.

The celebrities don't make too much money because of some mythical force that dictates from above who makes money, they make their money because we give it to them. Paris Hilton may have started off as a trust fund child, however she now makes barrels of her own money. And you know where it comes from? From us. We see her on television, we talk about her, we buy her crappy merchandise. We empower her. The same goes for whoever else is famous for entertaining us nowadays.

You aren't going to stop this injustice by simply pointing it out and complaining about it. You have to take your own initiative, you have to stop watching sports, watching television, watching movies. Think you could actually do it? I know I couldn't. But these things aren't free, and by using them as entertainment you are putting money, the amount of which you don't control, in the pockets of those you despise. You can complain, or you can do something about it. Turn off your TV, skip on the movies. Entertain yourself. Because other than that, you can't say or do anything about how much money celebrities make or should make.

Celebrities surely don't earn your money to make their fortune, but since when has anybody really earned a fortune?

"Behind every great fortune is a great crime." -Honore de Balzac.