Constant retraining...

[apw2]

I know all about the benefits of retraining your units. But i've got a wee problem, I'm constantly retraining my units and i've no idea why.
In my castles I have men who aren't fighting anyone, i've built no new buildings, yet one turn I can train 5 units, then the next turn 2-3 of those 5 units need retraining again.
I've even tried this in a fully upgraded castle, a unit that should have had 7 experience once retrained only improved upon armour and weaponry, only the second retraining did the unit's experience go to 7.
Also I find that often when I build new units they lack any experience that they should have - When I right click on them in the building list it shows they should be built with 2 experience etc... - I can sometimes spot these units by right clicking on the recruitment list, some of the units will show 0 experience while others will show 2.
I don't understand why this problem occurs, as i'm fed up of retraining my men. I've done a search through the forums but haven't seen anyone else having this problem. Anybody know why it happens?

[Goatbuster3000]

I've seen a thread where somebody mentioned retraining would only upgrade one aspect (armor, weapon, experience) at a time. I've never taken notice, I usually retrain to get my men back to full strength, but I hope someone can elaborate and help you.

[Douchebag]

Yes...I have faced the same problem to.

[Real]

Yes...I have faced the same problem to.

yup....

[apw2]

Did you manage to sort it out? If so could you please tell me how?

Thanks.

[awisler]

yeah, maybe its just a bug/glitch, unless you were besieged/there was a riot/or theres a plague, that will sometimes kill a few, but if it hasnt killed anyone it will still allow retraining even if its a full unit.

[apw2]

Well the units are full, never been in a battle, no diseases, sieges, riots, natural disasters, they just don't seem to be able to retrain more than one thing at once (armour, weapons, experience) and its really getting on my nerves.

[Towelie]

pretty anoing when you make some new units of knights.. need to retrain 'em 2-3 times

[apw2]

Yeah, i've installed the patch, but i'm using Road to Jerusalem 2.2 mod, i've never had this problem before so i'm pinning it on this mod.

[dad_savage]

It happens in vanilla. It's somewhat logical when you study it. The thing is, when capable of building a unit with additional experience only a certain number of units per turn can actually be trained to that experience level. This includes retraining. This may be lower than the number of recruitment slots you have, and if you have additional recruitment slots the game will still give you the option to retrain additional units, even if it will not effect them in any way.

[Trajan]

It's another bug/glitch. Not sure whether it's a game bug or mod related. I think it's only a problem in cities, don't remember it happening in castles. What I would do is keep on retraining them every turn until they get trained. It might take 3-6 turns, but they do get trained eventually. If you're encountering the same problem training specific units in various cities, you'll notice that they'll all get trained in the same turn when it happens.

[apw2]

Its actually in castles in which it is happening, not the cities strangely enough.

[big_feef]

I tend to have the same problem with certain units. I notice units that get an experience bonus are the ones that commonly encounter this problem. Specifically, any unit that gets a global experience bonus from a building (such as swordsmith's guild headquarters, etc) tends to encounter this problem all the time; but any of the units that get an experience bonus from their normal building train can also fall victim to this often.

Also, if you load a game and a unit was being trained (or retrained), you can be assured that you will need to retrain that unit at least once. The same happens when you just built a building that will give a unit more experience... you'll have to retrain at least once more than should be necessary.

I've minimized the occurence of this bug a lot by just taking units out of the recruitment queue after loading a game (whether training or retraining). Another tip is to not train/retrain a different unit when you're retraining a unit for the experience bonus; I've never got them to sucessfully get the expereince bonus when I do it that way. Even if it's just one unit, you have to waste the other slots for that turn or do it over on the next turn.

[Trajan]

Its actually in castles in which it is happening, not the cities strangely enough.

For me, I remember it being mostly in cities. It's possible that it could have happened in castles too in my campaigns, I haven't played the game in a month so my memory of the problem might not be that good. I do remember that it was the archer militias and mercenary units that gave me the most trouble.

[big_feef]

For me, I remember it being mostly in cities. It's possible that it could have happened in castles too in my campaigns, I haven't played the game in a month so my memory of the problem might not be that good. I do remember that it was the archer militias and mercenary units that gave me the most trouble.

You can retrain mercenaries? Wow, I'll have to try that out; I never recruit mercenaries because I hate not being able to retrain them (RTW).

[apw2]

Hmm, I found this problem while I was playing as the English, with most of their swordsmen and knights.

big_reef - When you say only train units for one bonus per turn and waste the excess slots, do you also mean that if you were to recruit any new units they too would interrupt the retraining?

Weird thing is, I had this game installed a while ago and never found this problem, its only when I reinstalled it recently.

[awisler]

You can retrain mercenaries? Wow, I'll have to try that out; I never recruit mercenaries because I hate not being able to retrain them (RTW).

well you can not always retrain them. i think that if that mercenary is currently able to be recruited in that region, it takes some of them to retrain it. it seems to be about 50/50 in being able to retrain them. you usually cant retrain more than 2-3 mercenary units of the same type within a couple turns though.

[big_feef]

Hmm, I found this problem while I was playing as the English, with most of their swordsmen and knights.

big_reef - When you say only train units for one bonus per turn and waste the excess slots, do you also mean that if you were to recruit any new units they too would interrupt the retraining?

Weird thing is, I had this game installed a while ago and never found this problem, its only when I reinstalled it recently.

Ok, I should have explained better. The classic examples of this happening are with Byzantine Spearmen and Heavy Cavalry for France, England, etc that get a tourney field. Byzantine Spearmen get a +3 xp bonus with a maxed out citadel; unfortunately, when you train them, they often show up with no xp bonus. Now, if I were to retrain two units of those Byzantine Spearmen to get their xp bonus, but also decide to recruit a unit of Dismounted Byzantine Lancers or Kataphractoi, for example, the spearmen won't get their xp bonus and I'll have to retrain again. But, if I recruited a new unit of Byzantine Spearmen while retraining units of Byzantine Spearmen to get their xp bonus, you'll get them all with their xp bonus in most cases. That's why I mentioned that it is sometimes beneficial to 'waste' a recruitment slot or two.

The problem is even worse with the heavy cavalry example I gave because they can get their xp bonus from two places: the factional global xp bonus from a master swordsmith's guild and from a tourney field. Sometimes you'll get only one of the xp bonus when you train them (usually the one from the tourney field); and it can take several turns to get the one from the swordsmith's guild if you're not careful. This can be minimized a great deal by taking the steps I explained in my previous post and this one.

[apw2]

Ah ok, thank you very much

[Darth Alec]

Weird, I never encountered this problem. Retraining half a stack of bysantine spearmen works perfectly. Both in LTC and vanilla.