TLR v1.9 Beta - Diplomacy / Campaign AI Discussion

[tornnight]

Diplomacy / Campaign AI Discussion Only

[Sligh]

Which version of UAI does 1.9 b3 use? In my game, England has allied with the Papal states, which i thought was impossible.

[tornnight]

1.9b3 doesn't use UAI at all.

The papal states will ally. No harm done. Just politics.

[Lopus]

Hmmm ... I wonder why Scotland refuses to ally with me (England).

[tornnight]

If your global reputation and faction standing is high then it has to do with the hidden cost of the alliance.

Noone knows exactly what goes on in the background to compute the 'cost' of what a diplomatic interaction is.

Probably a mixture of your military strength / wealth.

[Lopus]

Not so bad, I've got perfect relations with the Danish, the Sicilians and the Papacy (all allies), reasonable relationship with the French (also allies), and trade relations with Spain, Portugal, Almohads, HRE, Poland, Hungary, Russia, Venice, Milan, and Byzantium.

Scotland so far has refused to even go into a trade agreement with me for the last 8 turns (using 4 different diplomats). Oh well, after I finish of Caernarvon, I'll probably go to war with them, (or rather make them go to war with me.)

[Averroës]

As the Novgorods, I could only get the Byzantines to ally with me, even when the screen showed a favorable expectation or with massive monetary offers and a very charming princess. I expect this is intended, religion vs. religion. But just in case it isn't, I thought I'd mention it.

I may have been wrong about how Portugal would respond to having nearby rebel settlements to take. It's now 1096, 32 turns into it and the Portuguese are just sitting there with a medium size army next to their own city. They may really need Lisbon added to them or a boost to their starting money or something. Spain is also just sitting there, with a full stack at Madrid, while the Moors have taken Valencia and are now about to take Toledo.

The English and HRE also seem to be stuck somehow. The English have a full stack sitting halfway between Nottingham and Caernarvon; but it hasn't moved since year 1088, 16 turns ago. The HRE has also not taken any provinces or moved toward any.

Everyone else seems to be expanding slowly, with the Magyars and the Venetians and the Moors taking mutliple provinces and the others at least moving toward or having taken 1 province.

[Lopus]

Funny, in my new campaign, everyone has taken at least one province (with the Moors in the lead at 3 new provinces), but that was over a 15 year window, slow and easy does it I guess.

[Phil Stanbridge]

I'm at about 1110 ish and the HRE have blitzed the map! It's quite incredible, but they have literally attacked france, milan, venice, me (poland) and england in one hit. They have full stacks of militia type armies wondering around creating havoc. I can barely defend myself against them! I've never witnessed a more agressive AI faction. Not so early in the game. I can't imagine the consequences of this course of action.

[Averroës]

It's beginning to look like there is a huge random element to it. In my game, the HRE hasn't taken one province by 1100. The Moors do seem to be particularly disposed to expansion. Hungary is doing well, having taken Zagreb first and then Bran and cleaning up Sophia and Preslav after the Byzantines failed attemped sieges on both.

Venice allied itself with the Papacy in the first few turns and then set about taking the northern rebel cities in Italy. Milan went for Marseilles and then north, which may be what stopped the HRE in its tracks. Scotland expanded north. Sicily just took Tunis and Bari. The Fatimids took the one town just south of Damietta. The Seljuks are making moves northwest toward Antioch and west toward Jerusalem. The Danes, as usual went south and took Lubeck, Stettin and Magdeburg. The Poles finally moved and went for Halych. The Byzantines have been trying but failing miserably, having lost sieges at Athens, Adrianople, Sophia and Preslav.

Only the Portuguese, Spanish, French, English and HRE are still doing nothing as of 1100.

[tornnight]

I'm glad that people are expanding as fast anymore. As long as they don't stall completely then it's ok.

Have to just make sure every faction has a chance.

[Averroës]

I restarted as the Novgorods. This time around everyone expanded except Portugal. They're still just sitting there with a full stack halfway between their two towns in 1101. They did just declare war on the Moors, but it was with a fleet blockade at Marrakech. The army hasn't moved.

Lots of interesting wars, otherwise. The HRE and Venice went to war and Venice ended up taking Vienna from them. Sicily and the Byzantines went to war over Durazzo and Sicily ended up invading and taking Thessalonika.

The Moors are expanding all over. Spain did manage to take Toledo this time around, but the Moors have taken everything else except for Lisbon which is still rebel. The Moors took Valencia, Zaragosa, Pamplona, Barcelona, Toulouse and Bordeaux. They got a jihad declared on the town just west of Algeria - Ourhan? - and took it as well as the town down the coast from Marrakech. They're turning into the faction to beat. At some point, the Moors are going to get attacked, either by France, Milan, Spain, or possibly Sicily which just took Tunis.

[Lopus]

Averroës, it looks like it is totally random, I restarted (with the Greeks using the edited family file) and within 10 turns everyone went crazy, taking out 2 or 3 rebel provinces.

Spain went to Zaragoza.
Portugal went to Lisbon.
France has Dijon and is trying to take Angers.
Milan took Florence and Marseille, then stopped.
Venice took the vacant province to their west, then went to war with Hungary (with both trying to gain my alliance).
Hungary started to take Bohemia but then Venice attacked them.
Scotland is hungry for the highlands.
England has 2 armies (one going around England, took York already aiming for Southampton) although one looks like its been massacred (when it tried to siege Bruges).
Denmark made a beeline south and around the Baltic.
Poland headed north and met up with Denmark.
HRE took Switzerland and Metz, has a massed army (2 full stacks) heading east now.
Novgorod has taken Finland and then aimed straight for the Black Sea (one long line of provinces).
Almoravids took Valencia.
Fatamids reached Dongala.
Seljuks are going crazy for Antioch (I have no idea why).

[Averroës]

OK, works for me. As long as someone is seeing Portugal move, it's good.

I have to say, I'm loving the way Tornnight's idea of relieving France and the HRE of some provinces has improved the game play in Europe. Lots of interesting things happening which I've never seen before. All in all, this is by far the best TLR version and TLR was already the best compilation+ mod going, in my opinion. Thanks, Tornnight!

[Lopus]

I have to say, I'm loving the way Tornnight's idea of relieving France and the HRE of some provinces has improved the game play in Europe. Lots of interesting things happening which I've never seen before. All in all, this is by far the best TLR version and TLR was already the best compilation+ mod going, in my opinion. Thanks, Tornnight!

I agree senhor, is muy bueno, this mod.

[tornnight]

Excellent! How is the income situation?

[Lopus]

Excellent! How is the income situation?

I'm making a lot of money now, although a huge chunk of it is going to my "expendable" units.

[Irishmafia2020]

The diplomacy and economy seem much easier...

[borschwanger]

yea much easier...im playing h/h with scotland and i have all of eastern britain and tara about to move into caen and would be ending the kingdom england except they just took brussels...its 1101....and im not poor at all...

granted this comparison is against a vh/h where i ended up having a second kingom form in the middle east and a third in northwestern france with milan as my faction...so its hard to say how much corruption killed my income in the last game

no crusades called yet but there were four factions excommunicated...one jihad to algiers so far unresolved.

[Lopus]

I'm not sure if this is because I've blocked their access to the east, but Venice and Hungary allied up and both broke their alliances (150 turns/180 turns respectively) with me (as Byzantium) and invaded. I'm in 1196 already (turn 231).

They swarmed me with little stacks, in one instance 4 different small stacks (about 6-9 units each) attacked one of my "fast reaction forces" (1 general, 2 Byzantine Lancers, 4 Byzantine Cavalry, 8 Skythikons) from multiple directions, obviously I retreated (losing the battle) after inflicting severe casualties to 2 of their stacks.

Is it just my style of playing (with the Byzantiums) that in 231 turns, I've had only 41 victories and 196 losses, yet have barely lost any soldiers? Talk about losing the battles but winning the wars. 48 regions (the area surrounding the Black Sea, Asia Minor, Greece, Rhodes, Cyprus, Malta, and Palma).

Oh, and the workaround to not having your generals go down with the various diseases is to move them around as much as possible, they only join in sieges towards the tail end (so far I've never assaulted anything, just wait them out).