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Thread: Hamas attacks southern Israel

  1. #81
    Roma_Victrix's Avatar Call me Ishmael
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Seeing lots of news reports with article links like these on my Reddit feed, it's disastrous. Hamas apparently killed and kidnapped a bunch of tourists, temp workers, and students from around the world, including from Germany, Nepal, Thailand, the Philippines, etc. That dead woman with broken legs paraded on the back of a pickup truck that Hamas said was an Israeli soldier was actually a 30-year-old German woman attending a music festival, an event that got shot to pieces and raided.

    Caught in crossfire: 7 Nepalis injured, 17 held captive by Hamas in Israel

    I guess Nepal is the new Great Satan, or something? This is quickly turning into the worst terrorist attack Hamas has ever conducted and it looks like they're about to piss off a bunch of countries that were otherwise neutral in their affairs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Thesaurian View Post
    For Muslims, jihad against the Jews is as inevitable as the day of judgement. That’s partly why Muslims around the world are celebrating what’s happening in Israel right now. Hamas simply sees themselves as the tip of the spear, as do their supporters in Gaza and worldwide.
    This kind of comment is not helpful or constructive right now. Hamas doesn't even have the full support of Palestinians (a large chunk of whom follow the rival Fatah party), let alone the entire Muslim world. Even prominent American Muslims like Congresswoman Ilhan Omar who is otherwise very supportive of a two-state solution for Palestinian nationhood is unequivocally condemning Hamas for this. Maybe cool it with the generalizations and focus on Hamas instead.

  2. #82
    Alastor's Avatar Vicarius
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix View Post
    This is quickly turning into the worst terrorist attack Hamas has ever conducted and it looks like they're about to piss off a bunch of countries that were otherwise neutral in their affairs.
    About? Hamas is being decried all over the west for this atrocity. The real issue is that thanks to Hamas and this "accomplishment" of theirs, support for the Palestinian people in general is also diminishing.

  3. #83
    mishkin's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix View Post

    Caught in crossfire: 7 Nepalis injured, 17 held captive by Hamas in Israel

    I guess Nepal is the new Great Satan, or something? This is quickly turning into the worst terrorist attack Hamas has ever conducted and it looks like they're about to piss off a bunch of countries that were otherwise neutral in their affairs.
    I don't know if they have much long-term intelligence, I don't know if they dont care anymore about angering the Nepali government, the American government or anyone else.

  4. #84

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    we were doing very well not confusing Hamas, the Palestinians and the Muslim community in general
    The quote from article 7 is from Mohammed himself. Anyone who rejects him rejects Islam. Point being what Hamas is doing right now is what all Muslims believe must happen at some point in time as a sign the day of judgement is close at hand. So it’s inaccurate to suggest Hamas wouldn’t target Jews outside Israel proper, because according to them, they most certainly would.
    Quote Originally Posted by Roma Victrix
    This kind of comment is not helpful or constructive right now. Hamas doesn't even have the full support of Palestinians (a large chunk of whom follow the rival Fatah party), let alone the entire Muslim world.
    I am merely correcting a misconception stated by my interlocutor. As for the sympathies of the Islamic world, I don’t think I need to exhaustively prove to you they are not with Israel at all. Even in Turkey, where the government has called for an end to Hamas, many people rallied in support.

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=FptKlWyqqxE
    Even prominent American Muslims like Congresswoman Ilhan Omar who is otherwise very supportive of a two-state solution for Palestinian nationhood is unequivocally condemning Hamas for this.
    Omar isn’t a great example. She’s gotten in hot water multiple times for her antisemitic views, and she’s openly sympathetic to conservative Islamic governments.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...ution-n1073991

    Maybe cool it with the generalizations and focus on Hamas instead.
    I quoted Mohammed cited in the Hamas charter as part of the justification for their mission. The important thing isn’t whether or not every single Muslim supports Hamas. It’s to understand the gravity of Hamas’ commitment to killing Jews, and the religious component of the widespread sympathy with their mission/opposition to the existence of Israel. Of course, there are other non-Muslim groups who sympathize with Hamas, especially on the left, so I’m not suggesting support for Hamas is purely religious.

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-pro...pport-rallies/
    Last edited by Legio_Italica; October 08, 2023 at 01:01 PM.
    Of these facts there cannot be any shadow of doubt: for instance, that civil society was renovated in every part by Christian institutions; that in the strength of that renewal the human race was lifted up to better things-nay, that it was brought back from death to life, and to so excellent a life that nothing more perfect had been known before, or will come to be known in the ages that have yet to be. - Pope Leo XIII

  5. #85
    mishkin's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Thesaurian View Post
    The quote from article 7 is from Mohammed himself. Anyone who rejects him rejects Islam.
    nothing to do with trying to present all Muslims as evil, right?

    I believe that Hamas would be more than satisfied if they disintegrated the state of Israel (no small feat), but if you think that would be just the beginning, good for you. continue trembling in fear of what evil Muslims want
    Last edited by mishkin; October 08, 2023 at 01:13 PM.

  6. #86

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    Hamas doesn't give a ### about your Jewish neighbor
    Well, Hamas supporters abroad tend to be hostile to Jews, often violently so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  7. #87
    mishkin's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    Well, Hamas supporters abroad tend to be hostile to Jews, often violently so.
    How often? What would be the number of Jews abroad violently attacked by Hamas sympathizers?

    Anyway, yes, I don't think that a Hamas sympathizer views with much sympathy his neighbor who sympathizes with Israeli policies, regardless of his religion. (But it's one thing to look at him badly in the doorway of the building and another very different to beat him up).

  8. #88

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    Well, Hamas supporters abroad tend to be hostile to Jews, often violently so.
    Yeah, seems to have been a spike in:
    "Antisemitic incidents during the Gaza War (2008–2009)"

    "Antisemitic incidents escalated worldwide in frequency and intensity during the Gaza War, and were widely considered to be a wave of reprisal attacks in response to the conflict."
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antise...%E2%80%932009)

    But, no doubt, understandable. After all, 98:6 says that jews are among the worst of creatures...

  9. #89

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Thesaurian View Post
    The quote from article 7 is from Mohammed himself. Anyone who rejects him rejects Islam. Point being what Hamas is doing right now is what all Muslims believe must happen at some point in time as a sign the day of judgement is close at hand. So it’s inaccurate to suggest Hamas wouldn’t target Jews outside Israel proper, because according to them, they most certainly would.
    Given that the percentage of cases where a Muslim encountered a Jew but did not attack is so close to 100% that it's opposite is not portrayable it shows how little gravity what you're trying to argue here holds. Probably because the concept of Dajjal doesn't even exist in the Quran.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Thesaurian View Post
    I am merely correcting a misconception stated by my interlocutor. As for the sympathies of the Islamic world, I don’t think I need to exhaustively prove to you they are not with Israel at all.
    Even in Turkey, where the government has called for an end to Hamas, many people rallied in support.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=FptKlWyqqxE
    You seem to have not noticed the Syrian flags. This is not a Turkish crowd but a Syrian one. Knowing the size of the Syrian population in Turkey, especially in Istanbul, it's a relatively small one.
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  10. #90
    mishkin's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Yes, it is not difficult to imagine that during periods or exceptional vuolence in israel or palestine there would be outbreaks of violence against the Jewish community abroad.

    I am tempted now to tell you about how much catholics hate the jewish. A big part of our culture.

  11. #91
    swabian's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Hamas is a piece of garbage ofc, but I think this is Iran's doing. The retaliation will be ruthless and has to be. Evacuating the Gaza strip means to bring incognito Hamas over the border. There should be a long term solution with Egypt to take up the Arab population in the Gaza strip. With enough money and diplomatic pressure, it should be possible.

  12. #92
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    Yes, it is not difficult to imagine that during periods or exceptional vuolence in israel or palestine there would be outbreaks of violence against the Jewish community abroad.

    I am tempted now to tell you about how much catholics hate the jewish. A big part of our culture.
    I feel there's expected to be violence in Melbourne against our Jewish community here, and its been brewing for a little while.

    The Palestinian community here is stable and well integrated (I am related by marriage to Palestinians here) and their protests are models of sober and democratic civic action, but the Saudi funded nutcases get at disaffected people, often traumatised people from recently arrived refugees as well as lost youth on the internet. AFAIK we haven't seen Iranian funded terror here. We have decent cyber security and these idiots keep using the internet so we have been lucky so far.

    Dropped of a farewell card to a retiring colleague at his shule a month ago, they had hastily erected a double fence, had a ring camera and multiple locks and the Rabbi didn't even come out to see us. I mean he didn't know me (big fat Irish looking goy) but he knew my other mate who has been studying there with our retired colleague. This is a city where Catholics and Protestants were marrying 100 years ago and Croats and Serbs and Turks all live next door to each other.

    I was very happy when Trump helped nomalise some of the regional diplomatic ties with Israel, but this is a huge step backwards. The blame lies chiefly with Hamas, terrorist scum, but Netanyahu has to take his slice of blame too. It appears he would stop at nothing to keep power.

    I hope our Palestinian and Israeli posters are all safe.
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  13. #93

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Given that the percentage of cases where a Muslim encountered a Jew but did not attack is so close to 100% that it's opposite is not portrayable it shows how little gravity what you're trying to argue here holds. Probably because the concept of Dajjal doesn't even exist in the Quran.
    The percentage of Muslims who are Quranists is close to 0%. In fact, they are considered unbelievers by close to 100% of Muslims.
    You seem to have not noticed the Syrian flags. This is not a Turkish crowd but a Syrian one. Knowing the size of the Syrian population in Turkey, especially in Istanbul, it's a relatively small one.
    Lol.
    Of these facts there cannot be any shadow of doubt: for instance, that civil society was renovated in every part by Christian institutions; that in the strength of that renewal the human race was lifted up to better things-nay, that it was brought back from death to life, and to so excellent a life that nothing more perfect had been known before, or will come to be known in the ages that have yet to be. - Pope Leo XIII

  14. #94

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Thesaurian View Post
    The percentage of Muslims who are Quranists is close to 0%. In fact, they are considered unbelievers by close to 100% of Muslims.
    Lol.
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  15. #95
    alhoon's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by swabian View Post
    Hamas is a piece of garbage ofc, but I think this is Iran's doing. The retaliation will be ruthless and has to be. Evacuating the Gaza strip means to bring incognito Hamas over the border. There should be a long term solution with Egypt to take up the Arab population in the Gaza strip. With enough money and diplomatic pressure, it should be possible.
    Egypt taking up the Arabs of Gaza strip seems the least bad option in my opinion. But how to you move 2.3 million people from their homes?! Well as I said, the least bad option.
    Perhaps parts of Gaza should be given to Egypt for them to house soldiers and create big lines etc.
    alhoon is not a member of the infamous Hoons: a (fictional) nazi-sympathizer KKK clan. Of course, no Hoon would openly admit affiliation to the uninitiated.
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  16. #96
    swabian's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    I think Egypt has refused thus far out of spite, mostly, but they can't keep that up forever. Israel doesn't want or need the Gaza strip. It's a constant nuisance.
    Last edited by swabian; October 08, 2023 at 05:52 PM.

  17. #97

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Check out this interview:
    https://fb.watch/nz6zpcQK_E/

    He said only one thing that was inaccurate... that Hamas doesn't aim to kill/injure civilians. Otherwise, his arguments are 100% accurate. Unfortunately for Palestinians, the situation I feel is beyond repair, and perhaps now the best course of action is to abandon ship, and move out of Israel permanently. Perhaps a new nation state can be created somewhere for the Palestinians, a place where they can be free and prosperous. Israel is not that place. Any takers? Perhaps a piece of Kazahkstan? (Although I don't see Palestinians enjoying the Kazahk winter...) Some place where there is a lot of space for people. Which brings another problem: the world is really running out of space... Sure, Saudi Arabia or Iran have lots and lots of space... of empty desert. Prime real estate where people can grow food? Hard to come by.

    The whole irony is that this whole thing got started because the Jews were looking for a homeland after being on the run and persecuted for two thousand years. Now that the Jews have their homeland, we need to find a homeland for the Palestinians.

    Another solution is for a scientist to invent some kind of zap gun of enlightenment that makes people understand that their whole identities are a figment of their imagination. Suddenly Israelis and Palestinians realize through the zap gun of enlightenment that they are just simply human beings and that we're all the same, that religion and nationality is mental garbage. And maybe after all the world has been zapped, then people can live together and in peace.

    Hmmm... I wonder why I spend so much mental energy on things that don't have a solution, and things that don't concern me (around 99.9% of all the news I read). And yet the mind wants to feel part of something bigger, the illusion of being able to make a difference, perhaps. Perhaps it's not all in vain, and one day my idea of a zap gun of enlightenment catches the eye of some aspiring young scientist who goes on to save the world through his invention. Who knows....
    Hypocrisy is the foundation of sin.

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  18. #98
    Kyriakos's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Wars are piling up. Sleepwalking into a fusion of all of them to world war 3, looks ever more likely.
    Λέων μεν ὄνυξι κρατεῖ, κέρασι δε βούς, ἄνθρωπος δε νῷι
    "While the lion prevails with its claws, and the ox through its horns, man does by his thinking"
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  19. #99

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyriakos View Post
    Wars are piling up. Sleepwalking into a fusion of all of them to world war 3, looks ever more likely.
    Yeap... chances of human survival or the survival of the global civilization are dropping fast. Climate change compounded by nationalism and religious ideologies, plus a resource depletion crunch... not looking good. Two things that can change the game:
    1.) Fusion power or some other kind of technology that produces immense amounts of energy at low cost
    2.) An enlightenment zap machine that makes people realize we are all the same and nationalism/religion is garbage.

    If 1 and 2 don't happen, I'm afraid we're done for.
    Last edited by Siblesz; October 08, 2023 at 09:34 PM.
    Hypocrisy is the foundation of sin.

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  20. #100
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Musk would abuse the enlightenment zap machine to get laid, then he'd roll out an inferior substitute for 8.99 a month and it'd bomb.
    Jatte lambastes Calico Rat

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