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  1. #1

    Default Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6318413.stm

    Another terrorism raid, another Muslim community in shock. At Alum Rock, the community woke up on a bright Wednesday morning to witness anti-terror arrests on their doorstep.

    Several streets in the Alum Rock area have been cordoned off

    Alum Rock is a relatively poor area east of Birmingham city centre. Most of its Asian residents come from a Pakistani-Kashmiri background.

    The area has been changing in recent years with the arrival of Somalis and, in the last year, Polish migrant workers looking for cheap housing.

    But amid the day-to-day business of solving local problems, they now have a much larger one.

    At 0400 GMT, police from the Midlands counter-terrorism unit, a new police team based in Birmingham, with West Midlands Police officers and colleagues from the Metropolitan Police, raided 12 properties across the city. Two homes and a grocery shop in Alum Rock are among those now shut up.

    Stick together

    At the Alum Rock Islamic Centre, just a street away from the raid on the shop, local leaders said they had first heard of what happened on the news. But they said the key thing was for the community to stick together and support the police in their work.

    Ayub Pervaz, president of the mosque, said that the committee had contacted local police chiefs as early as they could to propose that officers base themselves in the institution during the investigation to help ease any potential community tensions.

    But at the same time he said the community wanted to see the wheels of justice turn correctly. We do not want trial by media and that is what this community is most afraid of

    Mosque president Ayub Pervaz


    Ninth arrest over 'terror plot'

    "If there has been a crime, the people who have done this should be brought to justice. But if they are innocent, then they should be exonerated and be seen to be exonerated.

    "We do not want trial by media and that is what this community is most afraid of - that British justice used to be innocent until proven guilty and now it may be the other way around."

    Shabir Hussein, another community elder, said that the public could not underestimate the fear of local people. He said that parents were worried sick about their young men and just wanted to do what they could to help the investigation.

    'Parents are scared'


    As Mr Hussein was being interviewed by the BBC, a van which was passing slowed. The driver hurled racist abuse at Mr Hussein, before driving on.

    "Look at that," he said. "This is what we are dealing with because of what happens. Parents are scared. They want to work with the police.

    "Parents are asking their sons who they are talking to, who they meet, where they go, what they are looking at on the internet. We are all being very, very vigilant but we never spotted or smelt anything like this in our area."

    But according to one community source, there has been some frustration over the pace of countering the threat posed by extremist political groups in Birmingham.

    One community worker told the BBC of previous running battles with Al Muhajiroun, a radical group that says it has disbanded, in predominantly Muslim areas of the city.


    Police outside a house in Jackson Road

    Leaflets would go out, or stickers onto lampposts, promoting what most people would regard as extreme views. Local young Muslims, opposed to Al Muhajiroun's views, would tear them down.

    "We found it difficult to get some people, including within communities and the authorities, to take this kind of thing seriously," he said. "People had their head in the sand as to what was going on. It makes it a lot harder to combat."

    But other young men in the area said that the raid was another example of how Muslims in British society felt they were now being treated.

    "I have a lot of white friends," said the man, who said he worked in forensic science. "But get on a bus now with a beard and a rucksack and you get the stares. I don't blame them, you know.

    "It's all been so hyped up."





    Dear TWC
    Kind Regards

    More worrying yet unsurprising reports of muslims planning to bring yet more terror to the streets of Britain.
    A group planned to kidnap a British soldier (a muslim one no less).
    Can these savages go any lower?
    Not only do they wish to kidnap and possibly kill British people in Britain but people of there own faith!
    Thank god we have such an excellent intelligence service and police to stop these human scum.
    Hopefully we can stop all attempts to terrorise our country in the future.

    Yours Thankfully
    MoralMan
    Last edited by VALIS; January 31, 2007 at 03:58 PM. Reason: Mong spelling

  2. #2
    Big War Bird's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    I must say I am not shocked, beheading is Allah's command

    "I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them." Koran 8:9
    As a teenager, I was taken to various houses and flats above takeaways in the north of England, to be beaten, tortured and raped over 100 times. I was called a “white slag” and “white ****” as they beat me.

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  3. #3

    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Big War Bird View Post
    I must say I am not shocked, beheading is Allah's command

    "I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them." Koran 8:9
    Just a small point, but wasn't the intended victim a Muslim? Which would make him a believer rather than an Unbeliever as mentioned in your quote from the Qu'ran?

    You'll find extremists in every group and every faith. People were frequently shocked upon discovering that their neighbor belonged in the KKK (although they are frequently and erroneously labeled a Christian extremist group in posts such as this, which they were not). There will always be hidden extremists in every "peaceful" community. Indeed, it is very unfortunate that this had to happen. But it would be a mistake to profile every member of the world's largest religion based on a misinterpreted quote from their holy book and the actions of a few of its extremist members.
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  4. #4

    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    They're criminals and will be given what they deserve.

  5. #5
    Tabell's Avatar Decanus
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    not really, because criminals like this deserve death. However, they will instead get out and they will start again

  6. #6

    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Tabell View Post
    not really, because criminals like this deserve death. However, they will instead get out and they will start again
    Britain does not support capital punishment under any circumstances.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    They are being good Muslims and attacking Muslims who do not follow the Koran literally. The Koran literally says to behead unbelievers, and thats how extremists read it.
    The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be used until they try and take it away.
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Sétanta View Post
    They are being good Muslims and attacking Muslims who do not follow the Koran literally. The Koran literally says to behead unbelievers, and thats how extremists read it.
    Well... I know this is usually met with the response that the Old Testament doesn't count, but The Bible also literally says a lot of things that Christian extremists read it. Don't follow me up on that, I don't really mean anything by it. But I do believe the operative word should be extremist or fantatic, rather than Muslim or Christian.

  9. #9
    Domesticus
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Islam also believes that all living beings are Allah's creations and should not be harmed. IIRC.

    Also Koran says, clearly.

    "let there be no compulsion in religion."

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Big War Bird View Post
    I must say I am not shocked, beheading is Allah's command

    "I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them." Koran 8:9
    No.

    From what I have read, what is presented in the article is completely forbidden in Islam.

    Taking a quote, out of the context, from the Koran is not evidence.

    I suggest you read through user Salah-Al-Din's posts in this very enlighting thread on a another gaming forum.

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showth...200783&page=27
    Last edited by Princeps; January 31, 2007 at 02:45 PM.

  11. #11
    Big War Bird's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Princeps View Post
    No.

    From what I have read, what is presented in the article is completely forbidden in Islam.

    Taking a quote, out of the context, from the Koran is not evidence.

    I suggest you read through user Salah-Al-Din's posts in this very enlighting thread on a another gaming forum.

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showth...200783&page=27
    Obviously these didn't folks don't think so. And the quote is quite in context. The beheader of Nicholas Berg, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi used this incident from the Koran to justify his actions saying, "The Phrophet, the most merciful ordered his army to strike the necks of some prisoners in the battle of Badr and to kill them . . . And he set a good example for us."
    As a teenager, I was taken to various houses and flats above takeaways in the north of England, to be beaten, tortured and raped over 100 times. I was called a “white slag” and “white ****” as they beat me.

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  12. #12
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Big War Bird View Post
    Obviously these didn't folks don't think so.
    Are you sure they even cared?

    And the quote is quite in context. The beheader of Nicholas Berg, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi used this incident from the Koran to justify his actions saying, "The Phrophet, the most merciful ordered his army to strike the necks of some prisoners in the battle of Badr and to kill them . . . And he set a good example for us."
    Given how the prophet spared so many of his enemies that even Allah commented how he allowed war criminals go free and unpunished, and given the wide range of contrary verses in the Koran, Khawaarij heretic Musab al-Zarqawi was probably quite selective.
    Last edited by Princeps; January 31, 2007 at 04:09 PM.

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    Big War Bird's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Princeps View Post
    Are you sure they even cared?



    Given how the phrophet spared so many of his enemies that even Allah commented how he allowed war criminals go free and unpunished, and given the wide range of contrary verses in the Koran, heretical Musab al-Zarqawi was probably quite selective.
    Perhaps you should consider that you are witnessing to the wrong crowd.

    Quote Originally Posted by Manstein16
    You'll find extremists in every group and every faith. People were frequently shocked upon discovering that their neighbor belonged in the KKK (although they are frequently and erroneously labeled a Christian extremist group in posts such as this, which they were not). There will always be hidden extremists in every "peaceful" community. Indeed, it is very unfortunate that this had to happen. But it would be a mistake to profile every member of the world's largest religion based on a misinterpreted quote from their holy book and the actions of a few of its extremist members.
    It is not me that is sullying the reputation of Islam.
    Last edited by Big War Bird; January 31, 2007 at 04:16 PM.
    As a teenager, I was taken to various houses and flats above takeaways in the north of England, to be beaten, tortured and raped over 100 times. I was called a “white slag” and “white ****” as they beat me.

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  14. #14
    Domesticus
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Big War Bird View Post
    Perhaps you should consider that you are witnessing to the wrong crowd.
    I'm sorry, but I do not understand what you mean.

    I'm saying that he probably misquoted, and exploited the Islamic faith to justify his crimes.
    Last edited by Princeps; January 31, 2007 at 04:17 PM.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by Big War Bird View Post
    It is not me that is sullying the reputation of Islam.
    Perhaps not, but in saying so you are allowing your perception of Islam to be swayed by a small band of extremists who in no way represent their religious "peers." They may be the ones "sullying" it, but you are the one spreading the message that Islam has been dirtied when it has actually been misrepresented.
    Son of Simetrical son of Crandar son of Siblesz
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  16. #16
    Erik's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    These things happen in Iraq all the time.
    But because this time it happened on British soil it suddenly becomes a big deal?
    I suppose having hundreds of your soldiers killed isn't so bad as long as it happens in a different timezone.

    Good they caught them on time though.
    If only Iraq was blessed with such a good police force.



  17. #17

    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    way to go inflating the hype...

    there is unfortunately extremism everywhere. But when anti-terror operations induce fear and distrust in communities, especially communities we need the help and support of, do you not think we're doing something wrong.

    incidentally, moralman, someone who claims to be a moral british patriot ought to remember there's no "z" in terrorise...

  18. #18
    Tom Paine's Avatar Mr Common Sense
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Ever hear what happened to the last major set of raids in the High Wycombe area? Anyone expect the same fizzling and lack of charges? because I do; interesting to note that this, like that, comes in the wake of a problem for the Labour party (who's going to talk about Lord Levy's arrest now!)

  19. #19
    Denny Crane!'s Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Its troublesome, but not extraordinary. Good to see the police are still intercepting these poor blind fools.

    Peter

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Islamofacist plot to behead British citizens in Birmingham

    Quote Originally Posted by PSYCHO V
    Mate, Islamic fundamentalists have claimed Islam as the religion of peace, just prior to blowing themselves up.
    Obviously they are hypocrites then...How many muslims have blown themselves up? If Islam were truly inherently violent, don't you think millions of muslims would be lining up to blow themselves up?

    The “Peace” Islam speaks of is what one can expect only once one has submitted to Islam.
    Actually the peace Islam speaks of is the peace one has when they have submitted to the god of the book.
    And by peace it does not mean peace as in end of hostilities but inner peace. No longer is one at conflict with themselves and with god once they have fully submitted/surrendered to god. That is what Islam means.
    Islam is not violent unless you purposely misinterpret it to suit your own biases.

    The Quran explicitly states that god does not favour one religion over another, and that religion itself means nothing as long as one submits to god. It also states that unbelievers have the right not to believe and that muslims should co-exist with them.. See:

    3: 84
    Say: "We believe in God, and in that which has been bestowed from on high upon us, and that which has been bestowed upon Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and their descendants, and that which has been vouchsafed by their Sustainer unto Moses and Jesus and all the [other] prophets: we make no distinction between any of them.* And unto Him do we surrender ourselves."

    3: 85
    For, if one goes in search of a religion other than self-surrender unto God, it will never be accepted from him, and in the life to come he shall be among the lost.

    But:

    109
    IN THE NAME OF GOD, THE MOST GRACIOUS, THE DISPENSER OF GRACE:
    (1) SAY: "O you who deny the truth!
    (2) "I do not worship that which you worship,
    (3) and neither do you worship that which I worship! 1
    (4) "And I will not worship ~hat which you have [ever] worshipped,
    (5) and neither will you [ever] worship that which I worship. 2
    (6) Unto you, your moral law, and unto me, mine !" 3

    I also suggest you look up the arab/muslim concept of hilm.

    Not Islam / Political!? Oh please, not the old “Muslims are all innocent victims / this is the West’s fault for not submitting to Islam” excuse again.
    So are you saying the millions of muslims who have commited no violent act, nor have supported violent acts are somehow as guilty as the fundamentalists?

    The west and the middle east have a long history, and as such that history impacts on how they see each other, to deny this is silly.

    If one had SturmAbteilung members (Nazi Brown Shirts) running around one’s neighbourhood wanting to attack / kill Jews, Political Adversaries / "Non-believers", etc, to further their own belief … and one discovered one had a member / supporter of the said group living next door, are they then unfairly “targeted” if the police keep an eye on them? If they do not want to be “targeted”, don’t be associated.

    They should be vocal in their opposition.
    When White Supremacists / Neo-Nazis turn up to events, march, etc in Germany, etc they are met by hundreds of thousands of their fellow citizens condemning their ideals, beliefs, actions.
    In the Islamic community, this doesn’t happen. We only ever see rallies / marches supporting or inciting acts of violence, condemnation of / threatening those who would dare question their actions / beliefs… just like Hitler's Nazis did.
    But they are, see:









    But I guess if you search for only one side of the story then that is what you will end up finding.

    Has the West ever “targeted” the Islamic community without first being attacked / provoked?
    While attacks have not specifically targeted Islam, they have targeted Islamic countries, such as the Iranian coup, the displacement of the Palestinians, military support of Israel, and countless CIA operations in the ME etc
    "In bourgeois society capital is independent and has individuality, while the living person is dependent and has no individuality." - Karl Marx on Capitalism
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