Supreme court to overturn Roe vs Wade

[The spartan]

And another progressive democratic socialist goes into "well, should we consider this part of demographic as really human" levels of eugenics.

While I'm a progressive, I am sure as hell not a socialist, so that's a strike right there. And what I said had nothing to do with eugenics. And what part of the demographic are you talking about? Aren't you kinda presupposing a zygote is "part of the demographic" here? I don't believe a zygote can have an experience of personhood or humanity, there is no entity being harmed here. That you find it self-evidently true doesn't sway me much, though feel free to explain.

holy cow, do majority of pro-choice people manage to make the most unhinged religious pro-lifers sound reasonable in comparison.

Perhaps you can explain pro-lifers that support exemptions for rape to me, because that seems unhinged: they believe that abortion IS murdering a baby, but that murdering a baby is ok if that baby resulted from a rape? I mean, holy , at least pro-choice people don't (commonly) believe they are killing a baby and can have that internal consistency, but wtf is with the pro-lifers actually believing they are ok murdering babies because a crime was involved?

[Coughdrop addict]

Voters in Montana of all places voted to reject a similar ballot measure restricting access to abortion: Voters support abortion rights in all five states with ballot measures

The SCOTUS really put the GOP in a bind here, but then again many GOP candidates hitched themselves to the same wagon. No wonder the predicted Red Wave hit a Blue Wall instead. Younger women in crucial swing states started registering to vote in significant numbers during the course of the summer. It was clear to me that this was because of Roe V. Wade, the thing that pollsters seemed to miss consistently because younger people don't pick up phone calls from unknown numbers, and for that matter most people don't do that anyway considering the amount of spam calls everyone gets these days. A skewed age bias in the polling is the result, since lonely retirees probably don't mind a random call.

And such retirees are more likely to believe that unwanted pregnancy should ruin the life of any woman. To them "nice" girls should not want sex, sex is something a man does to a woman for his enjoyment, not something that is in any way mutually enjoyable. Should she actually like it and even seek it out she deserve to be punished.

And if she were raped? Well it's her fault. If she wouldn’t be so brazen in flaunting her lady parts, men would have more control.

[Sir Adrian]

Voters in Montana of all places voted to reject a similar ballot measure restricting access to abortion: Voters support abortion rights in all five states with ballot measures

The SCOTUS really put the GOP in a bind here, but then again many GOP candidates hitched themselves to the same wagon. No wonder the predicted Red Wave hit a Blue Wall instead. Younger women in crucial swing states started registering to vote in significant numbers during the course of the summer. It was clear to me that this was because of Roe V. Wade, the thing that pollsters seemed to miss consistently because younger people don't pick up phone calls from unknown numbers, and for that matter most people don't do that anyway considering the amount of spam calls everyone gets these days. A skewed age bias in the polling is the result, since lonely retirees probably don't mind a random call.

The SCOTUS wisdom is to be applauded. The gave the people an opportunity to unequivocally express their will and the people are doing just that. Their decision was a win for America.

[conon394]

The SCOTUS wisdom is to be applauded. The gave the people an opportunity to unequivocally express their will and the people are doing just that. Their decision was a win for America.

Yes about that Matthew Kacsmaryk seems to differ.

[Sir Adrian]

Yes about that Matthew Kacsmaryk seems to differ.

He's entitled to his own opinion.

[conon394]

He's entitled to his own opinion.

I suppose so Unfortunately he happens to a federal judge and extremely politically biased who just attempted to make himself head of the FDA And very much is not returning the decisions on abortion to the people.

[Lord Thesaurian]

I suppose so Unfortunately he happens to a federal judge and extremely politically biased who just attempted to make himself head of the FDA And very much is not returning the decisions on abortion to the people.

It has been returned to the people. Democrats could have passed an abortion bill if everyone loves it so much. For whatever reason they’d rather try to pack SCOTUS instead, because judicial authority is only valid if it facilitates Democrat policy objectives.

[conon394]

It has been returned to the people. Democrats could have passed an abortion bill if everyone loves it so much. For whatever reason they’d rather try to pack SCOTUS instead, because judicial authority is only valid if it facilitates Democrat policy objectives.

Yes and now a Federal judge is seeking to supersede the will of the people. You can't have it both ways.

[Lord Thesaurian]

Yes and now a Federal judge is seeking to supersede the will of the people. You can't have it both ways.

Correct. You can pass an abortion bill or accept the decision of a judge.

[conon394]

Correct. You can pass an abortion bill or accept the decision of a judge.

No you can't the 5th circuit court judge is attempting a nation wide band on a safe and effective means of abortion based on no evidence and no expertise on his part that will impact say Michigan where voters clearly amended their constitution and voted in a Democratic Trifecta that supports abortion Aside from the ludicrousness of overruling the FDA. This clearly not returning the question to the states.

[Sir Adrian]

I suppose so Unfortunately he happens to a federal judge and extremely politically biased who just attempted to make himself head of the FDA And very much is not returning the decisions on abortion to the people.

1. He's a lowly judge. He can't decide anything for anyone on the topic.
2. 90% of the democratic/republican party/electorate is heavily politically biased. That's just par for the course in the US sadly
3. Attempted means he failed.

He can't ban anything nationwide and he can't even ban it in his own tiny corner of America's armpit. It's an electoral stunt so people will vote for him. Elected judges is yet another thing the US got ass-backwards.

If he's really that annoying why don't you rainbow blooded Americans just start a campaign "I am a proud LGBT and judge whatshisface showed me that NASCAR is a pure LGBT event". He'll be too busy saving his reelection to care about abortion anymore.


EDIT: Federal judges are not elected. I was lied to and could not be assed to fact check. Last time I trust Cope on anything.

[Lord Thesaurian]

No you can't the 5th circuit court judge is attempting a nation wide band on a safe and effective means of abortion based on no evidence and no expertise on his part that will impact say Michigan where voters clearly amended their constitution and voted in a Democratic Trifecta that supports abortion Aside from the ludicrousness of overruling the FDA. This clearly not returning the question to the states.

If that’s the case, Democrats had no grounds to throw together an effort to have Judge Rice block the FDA from doing anything to alter the approval and status of the drug, impacting states where abortion is restricted. Like I said, they’ll do anything but try to pass a bill to protect a constitutional right that doesn’t exist.

[Lord Thesaurian]

Federal judges are not elected. I was lied to and could not be assed to fact check. Last time I trust Cope on anything.

Is it that, or is that you weren’t aware until he called you out for posting incorrect info?

[Sir Adrian]

It is that.

[Roma_Victrix]

Yes about that Matthew Kacsmaryk seems to differ.

Considering how a judge in Washington state gave a ruling contradicting this one in Texas, this either has to go to the Supreme Court, or there will be basic lawlessness until it is resolved. AOC is already saying the Biden admin and FDA should just ignore the Texas judge's ruling on mifepristone. It's also yet another example of why overturning Roe has been a complete cluster **** disaster, the easiest thing in the world to predict, by the way. You now have states like Idaho trying to make it illegal for girls to travel to other states to get an abortion, which is clearly unconstitutional. It is reminiscent of slave catcher laws before the Civil War. Yet it's not like this is an issue that has helped out the GOP, either. They basically lost the Wisconsin Supreme Court over it already and deep red states like freaking Kansas have had referendums preserving abortion rights.

[conon394]

For a deep dive into just how bad the Kacsmaryk ruling the is

https://adamunikowsky.substack.com/p...ule-of-law-9c4

Its a fun read and this guy used to clerk for Scalia so no I didn't just find an obvious liberal at Slate for example.

-----

Its interesting Blues state attorney generals had a counter case teed with a different Federal Judge. Conservative groups and red states have been judge shopping to Kacsmaryk and 5th circuit for a while now seems like the democrats decided to play the same game as you say R_V SCOTUS opened a can o worms.

[Lord Thesaurian]

You now have states like Idaho trying to make it illegal for girls to travel to other states to get an abortion, which is clearly unconstitutional. It is reminiscent of slave catcher laws before the Civil War.

It isn’t like slavery, because you have a right not to be enslaved, not a right to get an abortion. Conflating the potential consequences of a night of bad decisions with a lifetime of being treated like a draft animal also suggests the anti-racist party has no concept of how horrific being a slave was, just for a bit of irony. How the left fails to grasp such a simple fact underpinning their clown crusade is beyond me, but then, these are the people who get their legal analysis from AOC, so I guess it all connects in the end.

Conservative groups and red states have been judge shopping to Kacsmaryk and 5th circuit for a while now seems like the democrats decided to play the same game as you say R_V SCOTUS opened a can o worms.

That’s what happens when Democrats try to make invent constitutional rights through judicial activism and then just sit on it for decades instead of passing a bill. For all the left wing gaslighting about the wonders of abortion, only a third of Americans support abortion on demand, which is the same amount as in the early 90s.

[Roma_Victrix]

It isn’t like slavery, because you have a right not to be enslaved, not a right to get an abortion. Conflating the potential consequences of a night of bad decisions with a lifetime of being treated like a draft animal also suggests the anti-racist party has no concept of how horrific being a slave was, just for a bit of irony. How the left fails to grasp such a simple fact underpinning their clown crusade is beyond me, but then, these are the people who get their legal analysis from AOC, so I guess it all connects in the end.

It's not outright chattel slavery, but it's certainly second class citizenry. You're basically arguing women should be a second class of citizen beneath men. Criminalizing people for physically leaving a state also violates interstate travel and commerce clause. But go ahead, keep advocating for this kind of stuff. It'll be hilarious when the GOP gets blown to bits in the next election cycle, the last midterms of which were a pretty good indication of that.

That’s what happens when Democrats try to make invent constitutional rights through judicial activism and then just sit on it for decades instead of passing a bill. For all the left wing gaslighting about the wonders of abortion, only a third of Americans support abortion on demand, which is the same amount as in the early 90s.

Wrong there, kiddo: About six-in-ten Americans say abortion should be legal in all or most cases (Pew Research). Even if this is what you're trying to cite (Gallup), note that the percentage of the US populace that wants abortion illegal in all cases is roughly 13% (gigantic LOL).

Although I will admit the fecklessness of Dem leadership to move boldly on this issue, not there's much that can be done with a currently GOP-controlled House (wouldn't be the case if NY hadn't screwed themselves with gerrymandered maps), odd considering the Dems now control the Senate.

Also, note the emphasis on "all or most cases" there in the Pew Research source. LOL. "The wonders of abortion"...what a sick, twisted, repulsive thing to say. In any modern civilized society one should probably hang their head forever in shame after saying that, maybe have it etched on their gravestone too for future generations to spit on, maybe pee on too while drinking late at night in the graveyard. Many women seeking abortion, by the way, actually want kids and simply don't want to deliver an already dead baby, or a fetus that will most likely cause them to die in the process of childbirth. Only a barbaric Stone Age club dragging person possessing roughly two brain cells to rub together would argue a woman should have to deliver in that scenario.

This story just happened in Florida, where the Florida Senate just recently passed a ban on abortion after six weeks: Florida Woman Denied Abortion Miscarried in Hair Salon Bathroom, Lost Half Her Blood: Emergency room doctors had sent Anya Cook home due to the state's 15-week abortion ban. A nurse gave her antibiotics and promised to pray for her.

The GOP would like to send its thoughts and prayers to all pregnant women!

[conon394]

Although I will admit the fecklessness of Dem leadership to move boldly on this issue, not there's much that can be done with a currently GOP-controlled House (wouldn't be the case if NY hadn't screwed themselves with gerrymandered maps), odd considering the Dems now control the Senate.

NY has some pretty weird politics. I can't say I have a sold grew up their view but there is a solid block of republicans voting upstate and there is a say break between NYC and Buffalo and Oldy school power dems like Cuomo was and his faction that prefer to make deals with republicans at the state level to undercut the obvious political power NCY/Buffalo should have between them. If the Dems had Gerrymandered Like Florida and Wisconsin - Cuomo and his type democrat would rapidly have been sidelined. Essentially as far as I can tell State level issues between NY democrats prevented what should have adjustments that would likely seen the Dems just barley hold the house in the midterms or at least leave the Republican's with a a margin of like 1.

Wrong there, kiddo

Lord Thesaurian by using the phase "Abortion on demand" is likely using polls where the questions force the answer. the particular use is often access to abortion beyond the trimester limit set in Roe. With no alternative answer just keep the roe rules. Thus you force people to answers you want. The Pew poll has a much more nuanced set of questions so gets the 61% number and of course another what 25% who want exceptions or very limited time periods although its not clear they understand how badly that works out in practice in many cases.

[Lord Thesaurian]

It's not outright chattel slavery, but it's certainly second class citizenry. You're basically arguing women should be a second class of citizen beneath men. Criminalizing people for physically leaving a state also violates interstate travel and commerce clause. But go ahead, keep advocating for this kind of stuff. It'll be hilarious when the GOP gets blown to bits in the next election cycle, the last midterms of which were a pretty good indication of that.

Muh second class citizen. It may shock to learn that conservatives also don’t want men to facilitate abortions either, and would morally condemn the circumstances which caused the man to create the unwanted pregnancy to begin with. Please do keep telling yourself that losing the House or picking up seats in MInnesota and Michigan is a win for abortion, though, and not a result of post-census redistricting.

As for interstate commerce, sure, abortion services are a commercial activity, so travel would be federally protected. The point of that, however, isn’t that abortion is a constitutional right. States also can’t punish you for traveling to another state to gamble. That doesn’t mean I have a right to gamble. Congress has authority to regulate interstate commerce, not individual states. Democrats haven’t passed an abortion bill, hence state regulatory authority will have to be hashed out in the courts. #AOCLLP

Although I will admit the fecklessness of Dem leadership to move boldly on this issue, not there's much that can be done with a currently GOP-controlled House (wouldn't be the case if NY hadn't screwed themselves with gerrymandered maps), odd considering the Dems now control the Senate.

The Democrats have controlled Congress and the White House several times since 1973, but Democrats can’t pass an abortion bill because they don’t have the House in 2023, 50 years later?

Wrong there, kiddo: About six-in-ten Americans say abortion should be legal in all or most cases (Pew Research). Even if this is what you're trying to cite (Gallup), note that the percentage of the US populace that wants abortion illegal in all cases is roughly 13% (gigantic LOL).

So you realize, then, that “most or all cases” is deliberate weasel words to make support for abortion look better. Most Americans, including most conservatives, understand there should be legal recourse for a girl or woman raped and impregnated by her relative who doesn’t want to have the baby. That’s why it’s all Democrats talk about, even though cases like that represent less than 1% of abortions. Most Americans do not agree I should be able to get an abortion at the local clinic just because I want one, and that’s 99% of abortions. As I often say, Democrats could almost certainly get broad bipartisan support for a bill banning abortion except in cases of rape or a threat to the mother’s life. They won’t, because that’s not the point.