What would we do if we didn't have Christmas and Easter?

[conon394]

conon394,

The word of God, the Bible, is your source. All I have to say is that, " It is written," and for you to search out where and why, not for me to make it easy for you. If you really, really, wanted to know about God and His saving Grace, you wouldn't be questioning me about it, rather having heard of it, be searching for yourself as I did when yet unsaved.

So you are just being rude now? You nominally used a quote from a source that is very much not the Bible and refuse to source it? I think it is somebody with little faith in his assertion who unwilling to cite his sources. In post 18 you are not citing the Bible so again cite the actual source. . Or specifically indicate a usage in the OT of saint.

Also "100 times, about three dozen in the Old Testament"

That is BS it is a written text. Either your source can count or they can not.

[Cyclops]

12 Apostles, what were their names again? I've got 1. Simon 2. Andrew 3. James 4. John 5. Philip 6. Bartholomew 7. Nathaniel 8. Thomas 9. Matthew 10. Levi 11. Another James 12. Thaddeus 13. Lebbaeus (not kidding) 14. Judas (not Iscariot) 15. At least one more Simon (there are several surnames) and 16 Judas Iscariot (subbed for Matthias after he suicided for carrying out God's plan). The only time a change to the roster is mentioned is in Acts, no mention of a change in the roster at any other time, just contradicting stories.

The unerring word of God.

Also Acts says there were no Christians until the community in Antioch took the name, definitely after Jesus died, to call anyone before the time of Moses a Christian is contradicting scripture. What's the Christian punishment for that again? I think its Hell.

[Akar]

I feel like people don't talk enough about how Charles Manson had more disciples than Jesus

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

Mostly female. ^^

[Cyclops]

I feel Jesus loved his disciples, and sent them to help the community. I feel like Manson was an unhinged loon, and a murderous scum bag. Weren't many of his girls made to be underage whores? Horrendous evil man.

Christmas and Easter are good examples of how cultural and religious movements absorb elements from one another. There's much in the Bible that wasn't particularly Jewish or Christian in their beginning (eg the erotic poetry, the Mesopotamian myths) but they stuck to the tradition, or people liked them despite the priests and now they seem thoroughly part of the religion now. IIRC something similar happened with Purim, it was a Mesopotamian festival, thge Jews there liked it and kept it, so the religious authorities in Jerusalem came up with a paper thin retcon, and now its a lovely Jewish tradition.

Easter and Christmas are lovely holidays and even non Christians can enjoy them and reflect on the ethical and spiritual lessons. I mean its not like Bible thumpers own the Bible, or the holidays, we can all enjoy them.

[basics]

I feel like people don't talk enough about how Charles Manson had more disciples than Jesus

Akar,

Really? What about all the women who followed Jesus even stood before the cross when the men had run away?

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

I feel Jesus loved his disciples, and sent them to help the community. I feel like Manson was an unhinged loon, and a murderous scum bag. Weren't many of his girls made to be underage whores? Horrendous evil man.
...

Yes, most of them were teenies with a difficult relationship to their parents. Easy, most vulnerable, influenceable prey for male hyenas like Manson or Koresh.

Its interesting how easy it is for such guys to misuse girls under the cloak of "religion ".

I'm having a fine spring festival.

[Akar]

All of the women (or at least the female family members listed on the wikipedia page) were 18+ when they met Manson. I don't think it's a fair characterization to say that he "forced" them to be "underaged whores" when there are plenty of legitimate reasons to lambast the man. The girls willingly aided and abetted Manson for years. They were certainly manipulated but they were anything but unwitting victims.

Its interesting how easy it is for such guys to misuse girls under the cloak of "religion ".

It wasn't just girls - both Manson and Koresh had quite a few male followers as well.

[basics]

Morticia Iunia Bruti,

The women who followed Jesus were for the best part not teenie weenies rather mature ladies as well as mothers themselves. To compare them to Manson's followers is just ludicrous.

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

Who talked about Maria or Maria Magdalena? I talked about Manson and his female disciples.

@Akar: Legally they were like Susan Atkins still teens at this time, as they were not 21. And with 19 you are still unsecure in your "Ego", your character is not finished then, at least for some at this age - i guess i was not adult at this age too. So they were open for manipulators, which treat them as someone special and put their weird thoughts into them (Manson ideas are crude nonsense even in comparison to other sects). His male followers had mostly a devout personality, which saw Manson as Alpha (weird!). And Manson had pretty girls. If i remember right, Sex played a big role in his sect.

[conon394]

Gotta say this has a macabre and odd turn

[Akar]

r: Legally they were like Susan Atkins still teens at this time, as they were not 21.

18/19 doesn't mean underage though, which is my point . You're definitely an adult at 18 even if your brain isn't fully developed until like 25 or whatever.

So they were open for manipulators, which treat them as someone special and put their weird thoughts into them

People are susceptible to manipulation at all ages, just look at NXIVM

If i remember right, Sex played a big role in his sect.

They had a bit of a free love thing going on, but in all of my reading about Manson and his family I've never heard it alleged that the girls were anything but willing participants. I mean, just read any of the interviews with them in prison and they definitely realized how much they ed up.

Gotta say this has a macabre and odd turn

Better than arguing over god again

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

I mean, just read any of the interviews with them in prison and they definitely realized how much they ed up.

Yeah but if i remember right, this realisation needed years of being in prison.

Better than arguing over god again

Honestly this happened to almost every thread in the EMM to be turning in a attempt to proselytize to the evangelical faith since years.

Its boring.

[Akar]

Yeah I have no idea why the mods aren't enforcing the off topic posting rules in the EMM anymore

[Cope]

Christmas and Easter were brought by the Logos, without whom there is only the void.

[basics]

Cope,

Without the crucifixion and the resurrection there would be no rescue from hell so you're right on the button.

[conon394]

Christmas and Easter were brought by the Logos, without whom there is only the void.

Ahh the legacy of Neo Platonic thought.

[basics]

conon394,

What have the thoughts of mere men got to do with anything? God is God and they are what?

[Akar]

We should go back to talking about Manson.

What is your guy's favorite Manson Moment?

Mine is when he hung out with the Beach Boys for like a year.

[conon394]

conon394,

What have the thoughts of mere men got to do with anything? God is God and they are what?

Quite a bit really you neo manichaeism is heavily the construction of Augustine.

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Akar - sorry really can't muster much enthusiasm to talk about Manson