View Poll Results: Whom do you support and to what extent?

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  • I support Ukraine fully.

    104 68.87%
  • I support Russia fully.

    17 11.26%
  • I only support Russia's claim over Crimea.

    4 2.65%
  • I only support Russia's claim over Crimea and Donbass (Luhansk and Donetsk regions).

    11 7.28%
  • Not sure.

    7 4.64%
  • I don't care.

    8 5.30%

Thread: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

  1. #5561
    Vanoi's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by Laser101 View Post
    Elon Musk recently got pilloried on Twitter for this. I think he goofed on the details, since a more practical argument would have focused on Crimea and the issues of a) the demographics (which have been consistently majority ethnic Russian since 1959) and b) the fact that there is an actual precedent for an organic separation movement. Neither of these arguments apply on the mainland where the population is overwhelmingly ethnic Ukrainian, even if they speak Russian (c.f. most Irish nationalists in N. Ireland are Anglophones). One could argue that an obvious mistake that the Russians made planning this in the first place is confusing 'language' and 'ethnic identity'; the two do not always overlap.

    Considering some of the responses though, I suspect that if Ukraine does manage to retake Crimea by force, then the West (US/EU/NATO) will be faced with the question of whether or not they are fine with ethnic cleansing/genocide as long as it's committed by the side they support. Unfortunately, given prior precedent (e.g. the Yugoslav Wars and the German expulsions) I'm inclined to believe that the answer is yes.
    Ethnically Russian does not equal support for being part of Russia.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Crimea

    The number of Crimean residents who consider Ukraine their motherland increased sharply from 32% to 71.3% from 2008 through 2011; according to a poll by Razumkov Center in March 2011,[23] although this is the lowest number in all Ukraine (93% on average across the country).[23] Surveys of regional identities in Ukraine have shown that around 30% of Crimean residents claim to have retained a self-identified "Soviet identity".[24]

  2. #5562

    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by conon394 View Post
    Well were I Ukraine I keep it in a Turkish port for now.
    I think it's a moot point. Launching does not mean the ship is ready. It means the basic hull is finished and watertight, so the ship can be moved outside of drydock. Now it's time for fitting out, which can take some time. I checked and it seems to be well over a year for Ada class corvettes.

    I don't think the war will last more than 9 more months.

  3. #5563

    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanoi View Post
    Ethnically Russian does not equal support for being part of Russia.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Crimea
    I suppose that's the tricky part.

    It's pretty clear that the results of the 2014 referendum were heavily rigged (to say nothing of more recent ones). The question is whether or not a 'free and fair' vote would give a majority support anyway (either in 2014 or now). As far as I can tell, accounts of Crimean public opinion in the past 8 years vary.

  4. #5564
    nhytgbvfeco2's Avatar Praefectus
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Another day, another Russian front completely collapsed. Wonder what resident military expert, Papay, has to say about this, after all he predicted no more Ukranian offensives for, what was it, 6 months? And declared the Kherson offensive over and failed?

    Cope harder, Rashists. Slava Ukraini!

  5. #5565
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by nhytgbvfeco2 View Post
    Another day, another Russian front completely collapsed. Wonder what resident military expert, Papay, has to say about this, after all he predicted no more Ukranian offensives for, what was it, 6 months? And declared the Kherson offensive over and failed?

    Cope harder, Rashists. Slava Ukraini!
    Morning word is the Russian did not make a stand at Dudchany and going to try some 15km farther back. This does not seem to indicative of a fighting retreat designed allow the the guys in what is looking like a really uncomfortable pocket to fight out of.

    Also where is the Russian air force? This would seem to be their moment for an all hands on deck moment flying strike after strike to blunt Ukrainian advances. Theoretically I keep reading the south is open country not like the north where dispersed units can find persistent cover.

    ---------------

    Quote Originally Posted by Laser101 View Post
    I suppose that's the tricky part.

    It's pretty clear that the results of the 2014 referendum were heavily rigged (to say nothing of more recent ones). The question is whether or not a 'free and fair' vote would give a majority support anyway (either in 2014 or now). As far as I can tell, accounts of Crimean public opinion in the past 8 years vary.
    My feeling is the Crimea is a point where Ukraine might have to give ground in negotiations. The problem is the place folded rather quickly back in 2014, even if the referendum was rigged or at least not conducted with open observation. While Europe was kinda like meh on the issue. Also given it would extremity easy to defend (or wall off) it would almost certainly be the last place the Ukraine could attempt to retake military
    Last edited by conon394; October 04, 2022 at 07:42 AM.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  6. #5566
    nhytgbvfeco2's Avatar Praefectus
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Dudchany's already fully liberated, even pro-rashist sources admit that.

    most stuff marked as "warzone" is also in Ukranian hands. On the 1st of October the Rashists still controlled Osokorivka, top right of the map.

  7. #5567
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Ahh looking at fresher map than I saw a little while ago.

    Supposedly the Russian had better defenses planed in the region but I wounder in sliding down along the Dnieper river invalidates that.
    Last edited by conon394; October 04, 2022 at 07:49 AM.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  8. #5568

    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    https://www.newsweek.com/vladimir-pu...nflict-1748320

    The Chechnya Republic leader Ramzan Kadyrov has taken to Russian social media to announce that all three of his three teenage sons will eventually be joining the fight in Ukraine.
    Posting to VK, a Russian social media platform, on Monday morning, Kadyrov said his 14-year-old-son Adam, 15-year-old Eli and 16-year-old Akhmat would join the front lines.
    It is not entirely clear whether Kadyrov is referring to the ongoing conflict or a future one. In addition, he does not specify how soon they will be engaged in any conflict.
    He praised them for the military training they already possess while attaching a video of the three teenagers firing weapons, using tanks and conducting drills.
    Sacrificing his own children to Putin as surely as if he burned them on the tophet.

    Assuming, of course, he actually intends to do so.
    Last edited by Coughdrop addict; October 04, 2022 at 07:53 AM.

  9. #5569
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by Coughdrop addict View Post
    PR BS. Kadyrov is playing a careful game. He has a powerful security force of 30 -40,000 that has not budged out their home. He sent volunteer units which one imagines run the table of criminals to political detainees to anyone viewed as less than loyal. I doubt his kids will ever leave home.
    Last edited by alhoon; October 04, 2022 at 02:24 PM. Reason: Continuity ~ alhoon
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  10. #5570
    nhytgbvfeco2's Avatar Praefectus
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Not to mention that it's a warcrime to send children into war. Not that it would stop the Kremlinist regime, they treat warcrimes as a bingo, trying to get them all.

  11. #5571
    Ludicus's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    Zelensky ...he thinks he can shame the Israeli leadership into helping more, or at least he thinks it's worth a try.
    Yes, but I think he stopped trying. Zelensky begins to use a mixed tone of aggressive disappointment and frustration.
    September 23
    Ukraine's Zelensky: 'Israel Gave Us Nothing'
    Israel did not provide us with anything. Nothing. Zero! We can notice the influence of Russia on Israel.
    Meanwhile, Orban doubles down: (26/9) Hungary says West in favor of Russia-Ukraine war
    If sanctions on Russia are lifted, energy prices would fall by half, says Hungarian President Orban.
    “Today, the West favors war and Hungary favors peace. We demand an immediate cease-fire and peace talks instead of continuing and deepening the war"
    Europe is slowly waking up to the new reality, but it has no will of its own “EU wants 'new transactions-based LNG benchmark'
    ("Europe wants"!)
    The European Union wants a new transaction-based benchmark for liquefied natural gas (LNG) as it says the fall in Russian pipeline gas flows and record high LNG imports have created imbalances in the current pricing mechanism.
    Prices for LNG cargoes are now largely influenced by the fact that Europe is competing with Asia for spot LNG cargoes
    Anise Ganbold, senior analyst at Aurora Energy Research, said lowering the price of gas by moving away from or reforming the TTF could have unintended consequences, reducing incentives to increase gas supply or reduce consumption.
    Of course. Cheap prices can have unintended consequences.
    --
    How the gas industry capitalized on the Ukraine war

    --
    In this country, the price of gas on the free market will triple orquadruple by the end of this month and will be subject to change every 2 months. Not to mention the poorest of the poor, who have gone from the age of lights to the age of candles, the middle class, if it exists, doesn't know how to make it to the end of the month, counting the money that is not enough for everything. Prices are skyrocketing. According to the owner of a modest bakery in Lisbon, who usually pays 5,000 euros a month for gas, he will now pay 25,000 euros a month. I can't guess the method chosen by this poor man to commit suicide.
    Someone has said, "When disaster strikes Europe, it can’t be blamed on America, except for Trump, because the American establishment despised and rejected him, so Europeans must do the same".

    Elon Musk tweets 'peace plan' for Russia-Ukraine war.

    ... amid the harsh response, Musk doubled down.
    “Let’s try this then: the will of the people who live in the Donbas & Crimea should decide whether they’re part of Russia or Ukraine”

    The official Twitter account of the Ukrainian news outlet, Kyiv Post, wrote of Musk’s original proposal: “We don’t carry out votes on apartheid and Nelson Mandela.”
    That must be the reason why the Nelson Mandela of Ukraine has been bombing the Russians of the Donbass since 2014 and implementing linguistic and cultural apartheid in that region, not to mention the burning of 2 million Russian books, including Russian scientific articles. Some children's fairy tales and romance novels will be preserved "for specialists to study the roots of evil”. But if you think this is too much, don't be surprised, irrational hatred spreads quickly Science journal punishes Russian authors by refusing to review their papers.
    Last edited by Ludicus; October 04, 2022 at 11:57 AM.
    Il y a quelque chose de pire que d'avoir une âme perverse. C’est d'avoir une âme habituée
    Charles Péguy

    Every human society must justify its inequalities: reasons must be found because, without them, the whole political and social edifice is in danger of collapsing”.
    Thomas Piketty

  12. #5572
    Mithradates's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by Coughdrop addict View Post
    https://www.newsweek.com/vladimir-pu...nflict-1748320



    Sacrificing his own children to Putin as surely as if he burned them on the tophet.

    Assuming, of course, he actually intends to do so.
    Joining the fight in Ukraine, yeah... the kids will shoot down some traffic lights in glorious combat, empty their magazines on abandoned buildings, maybe even get permission to shoot an RPG in a random direction and it will all be uploaded to social media for all to see how Kadyrov's sons have undergone their baptism of fire and become full-fledged TikTok troopers.

  13. #5573

    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    I machine translated and manually corrected (in a cursory fashion) part five in a series of blog posts on the problems of the Russian military. It is written by an ethnic Russian politician and academic living in Finland called Andrey Sergeyev. This part is about corruption in the Russian military and society and highlights what the practical consequences of the Russian kind of corruption are, as witnessed in the war at hand. I very much recommend reading it.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    What Is Wrong with Putin's Army? Part Five.
    --
    The Kremlin's decision to practically run down the conscription army and replace it with a professional army was justified in many ways. However, there is one feature that separates the Russian professional army from its Western counterparts: rampant corruption.

    It would not have been possible to end up in a different situation, considering the development path of the Russian army, which I have discussed in previous updates. Already the conscription army was corrupt and when the professional army was built into it, its foundation was a quagmire.

    When Russia started to get rich with oil revenue, Putin channeled huge amounts of money into the professional army. In fact, in the 2010s, Russia spent a larger share of its national income on military than any other country. And when you pour money into an already corrupt system, it's like pouring gasoline into the flames.

    Everyone rushed to get their share of the armed forces spending at every step in the chain of command. At the highest level, the Minister of Defense had numerous yachts, the generals had huge villas, the major had a nice car and could afford nice shopping trips in Finland with their family. At the lowest level of the system, the contract soldier Vasiliy took the sneakers from the feet of the unfortunate conscript Oleg and told him to ask his mother for new ones.

    Everyone has probably heard that corruption is destructive in the armed forces, but it may be difficult for Finns to understand why it is so destructive. We easily think of corruption as some kind of loss or tax. However, its effects are much worse than its face value.

    As a theoretical example, suppose that corruption is 10% and an army unit orders ten tanks. But since there is that 10% corruption, do they only get nine tanks? No. The unit does get the ten tanks it ordered, but all of them are missing 10% of the things they should have.

    When the tanks start moving, one won't start at all because the fuel has been sold. One's radio device turns out to be just an empty shell. The third's reactive armor is filled with styrofoam. And all have military-standard optics replaced with cheap Chinese consumer products. Instead of nine usable tanks, the unit gets ten more or less usable ones. And no one knows to what degree they are usable.

    In a corrupt system, things do not disappear from places that make sense from the point of view of the whole, but from where they can be stolen at any given time. Unpredictable and often destructive.

    Furthermore, systemic corruption is like a black hole that absorbs value. You have to remember that corruption is illegal, so the appropriated goods are basically stolen. And thus much lower in value than legitimate stuff.

    It follows that when the contract soldier Vasiliy steals the army's night vision binoculars and exchanges them for a couple of bottles of Putinka vodka, quite a few rubles from Putin's defense budget evaporate. I won't try to find out how much it costs to manufacture night vision binoculars in Russia, but I'm betting that it's quite a lot more than a couple of bottles of vodka. But since the vodka peddler knows that Vasiliy has stolen the binoculars from the army, he has no reason to pay more.

    After which, another contract soldier, Pavel, unexpectedly finds himself in Ukraine with his tank. In the pitch-black night, he can see movement in the bushes, but Pavel doesn't have night vision equipment because Vasiliy had stolen them. Pavel has to watch with his naked eyes what is happening there, and of course he can't see anything. Well, the Ukrainian corporal Serhii with NATO night vision equipment and an NLAW under his arm is there in the bushes. That's the end of Pavel and his tank.

    So what exactly happened to value? A T-72 tank costs from half a million to a couple of million dollars, depending on the model and the time of manufacture. This value turned into a couple of bottles of vodka, which have also already been emptied. You can probably get an idea why Russia's huge defense budget turns into a military capability with very low efficiency.

    In addition to losing value, corruption also eats away at the morale of the troops. The private soldiers understood the connection between things very well. They were supposed to get, for example, new combat vests, but they got old leather straps smelling of storage grease which still have the Soviet coat of arms on them. At the same time, the captain replaced his car with a newer one and the colonel ordered a new sauna for his summer house. This is not conducive to building trust between the enlisted and the officers. And it makes sure that the privates themselves steal whenever they can.

    At this point, of course, the question arises, why didn't Putin stop the destructive corruption of the armed forces?

    The answer is that in Putin's Russia, corruption is not a cancer within the system, but corruption itself is the system. And that's exactly how Putin wants Russia to be.

    So it is not that Putin has failed in his fight against corruption, but that he has never seen a problem with it. He has fully blessed the system, where official status comes with a permission to snatch your share of resources and this principle extends from lower-level officials to the Kremlin's elite.

    That is no coincidence. Putin has systematically removed all institutions that curb corruption. The free media, which acts as the watchdog of political power, has been effectively silenced, and there is nothing left of the independence of the justice system. Moreover, the justice system has been subjugated as a tool of the Kremlin whose mission is to protect corruption. That became clear even to the dumbest in November 2009 at the latest, after the so-called Magnitsky case.

    Sergei Magnitsky was a straight-up accountant who stuck to the principles of the rule of law even when there was nothing left of the rule of law. In court, he defended his client, a British investment fund, whose holdings were being hijacked by parties close to the Kremlin. Magnitsky pursued the case tenaciously and skillfully in court, even though he had no chance of winning in the thoroughly politicized Russian legal system. At the same time, he exposed the corruption of those in power with the help of public sources.

    As a result, the Kremlin made Magnitsky a cautionary example. It is pointless to seek protection from the justice system if you challenge those in power. Magnitsky was arrested on completely made-up charges and thrown into prison. There, the unyielding accountant was brutally beaten and denied medical treatment. He eventually died of a heart attack while being handled by the guards.

    Magnitsky's fate caused an uproar abroad and even a number of US sanctions were named after him. But the Kremlin made sure the message got through. Even after his death, Magnitsky was sued for tax fraud (!). Taking a dead person to court was something that had not been seen even in Stalin's time.

    The results of Putin's policy of personally protecting corruption have been in line with expectations. You could imagine that during his long reign the situation would have improved compared to the chaos of the 1990s - but the situation is exactly the opposite.

    Despite the economic and administrative development, Putin's Russia is more corrupt than Yeltsin's Russia. Measured by Transparency International's Corruption Perceptions Index, Russia's corruption ranking among 180 countries in 2021 was a dreadful 136.

    Corruption is thus part of the DNA of Putin's regime, and a significant institution like the armed forces could not even in principle be outside of it. After all, corruption is an essential tool with which Putin rules. It's a way to reward loyalty and also punish for failure. It is illegal in principle, but since everyone is involved in it, anyone can be punished at any time.

    If someone angers the Kremlin's autocrat, their corporate headquarters is suddenly full of tax inspectors and criminal investigators. Ambiguities (both real and fake) result in a flurry of accusations in a Kafkaesque (quite literally) legal system, and ones wealthy upper-class life can end and you can find yourself an imprisoned pauper in just a few weeks. Putin shares power and wealth, but he can also take it away.

    It is easy to understand what this climate of fear does to trust in between people. Even in the armed forces, everyone benefits from corruption, but everyone also has to watch out for each other. When settling mutual grudges and power struggles in between different factions, accusations of corruption are a useful weapon. After all, everyone is guilty of something and everyone knows it.

    This is the systemic corruption of the Russian army in all its misery. It destroys predictability, it destroys value, it destroys morale and, most of all, it destroys all trust. And it can never be removed from the system, because in Putin's Russia it is the system.
    Last edited by Septentrionalis; October 04, 2022 at 01:25 PM.

  14. #5574
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    But if you think this is too much, don't be surprised, irrational hatred spreads quickly Science journal punishes Russian authors by refusing to review their papers.
    Oh so sad Boycotts are OK as long as they don't effect me. Again Ludicus what actions do you approve of by the nations alone or collectively to deter aggression. If nobody feels any pain nothing is actually deterred.

    ----

    "If sanctions on Russia are lifted, energy prices would fall by half, says Hungarian President Orban.
    “Today, the West favors war and Hungary favors peace. We demand an immediate cease-fire and peace talks instead of continuing and deepening the war"

    Pretty sure that be achieved if Putin just stop invading.

    But again Ludicus what do want to negotiate about. You did read Putin's speech right?

    " West in favor of Russia-Ukraine war"

    Last I checked Putin started the war so umm err not seeing how that works out.
    Last edited by conon394; October 04, 2022 at 03:01 PM.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  15. #5575
    swabian's Avatar igni ferroque
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by Laser101 View Post
    Actually, I don't think Putin cares that much. He's set things up so he can abandon pretty much all of Ukraine without issue. Consider that the plans for annexation have been repeatedly delayed or rescheduled to avoid making any concrete commitments.
    Withdrawing completely would be without a doubt a serious threat for Putin's political standing. Furthermore, the sanctions would not stop in that case until Russia is ready to pay long term reparations to Ukraine. It couldn't be more dire for Russia, therefore I couldn't disagree more, because I think it couldn't be more obvious.

    As a sidenote: I never really believed Russia wanted to take all of Ukraine. They simply had to advance from the entire border onwards to lure out Ukrainian defenses and get them entangled in local battles and skirmishes in order to avoid being outflanked and encircled. Their actual goal most likely was always that corridor from the Donbass along the coast, connecting the Krim to Ukrainian water supplies and securing oil and gas fields in the Black Sea. So I don't even think Russia is focusing on minimum war goals as of now. If they can't hold the annexed regions, they are in even bigger trouble. Of course Ukraine will not accept the annxation, so there is no end to the sea of poop Russia is drifting in from now on.
    Last edited by swabian; October 04, 2022 at 03:55 PM.

  16. #5576
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    As a sidenote: I never really believed Russia wanted to take all of Ukraine. They simply had to advance from the entire border onwards to lure out Ukrainian defenses and get them entangled in local battles and skirmishes in order to avoid being outflanked and encircled. Their actual goal most likely was always that corridor from the Donbass along the coast, connecting the Krim to Ukrainian water supplies and securing oil and gas fields in the Black Sea. So I don't even think Russia is focusing on minimum war goals as of now. If they can't hold the annexed regions, they are in even bigger trouble. Of course Ukraine will not accept the annxation, so there is no end to the sea of poop Russia is drifting in from now on.
    A bit more than that. He clearly also government decapitation. And a land line all the way to Transnistria so thay could have a join Russia vote and leave they criminal company rule in power but better with Putin backing. Ukraine would ended up a rump dependent state and I am betting he wanted Khrakiv and surrounds as well.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  17. #5577
    Praeses
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Retaking Crimea now out of the fantasy zone and in the unlikely zone now.

    Putin has redrawn the map again, and probably made Taiwan safe for a generation, and hes getting pantsed by a doddering senile US president and a pretty divided Europe.
    Jatte lambastes Calico Rat

  18. #5578

    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    This is misinformation: Biden is a highly qualified and mentally sharp US President. The fact he forgets where he is and absent-mindedly wanders off stage is irrelevant.

  19. #5579
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
    Retaking Crimea now out of the fantasy zone and in the unlikely zone now.

    Putin has redrawn the map again, and probably made Taiwan safe for a generation, and hes getting pantsed by a doddering senile US president and a pretty divided Europe.
    He seems neither doddering nor senile. How many public speeches do you give that are recorded and parsed to the last word? Show me the democratic president with a bare 50 vote majority in the senate (including two showboat senators) that have passed more of their agenda?
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  20. #5580
    swabian's Avatar igni ferroque
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    Default Re: Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

    China has a watchful eye on Ukraine, but it's well observable how they take up distance to Russia. They will not interfere, mostly because they cannot afford it. If they could finance the Russian war and establish a robust alternative trade network to Russia, they probably would, but geography ruins that.


    The Taiwan thing is also not really comparable to Ukraine. Russia is acting like a desparate, hungry vampire. For China, to secure Taiwan would be an important addition, but it would potentially cost them too much. To be honest, I simply don't believe China is going to attack Taiwan (thinking about it calmly), because a Chinese onslaught would be so destructive, they would all but drive out the local computer hardware industry and therefore, in conquering Taiwan, lose everything that is valuable for them, aside from having another military port (which is a completely overestimated strategic point, because Taiwan, to my knowledge does nothing to inhibit the range of Chinese fleet power).

    Rationally, Xi should know better, but if people are in positions of awful power, they lose their rational judgement very quickly. Xi is in a position of awful power since long.

    The Chinese destroyer fleet is no mach to even a single US carrier group, and they know this. The question is, if Xi can overcome his megalomanic emotions and see reason.
    Last edited by swabian; October 04, 2022 at 06:31 PM.

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