Russia, US, Ukraine, and the Future

[Loyt]

27% of russians believe that hostilities in Ukraine must be continued. 50% - for the start of peace negotiations, - Levada Center.

50 % russians not support war.

https://t.me/dmytrogordon_official/12743

Yeah, right. They might be for stopping war while preserving current situation with occupied territory. Bet, Putin would like that too.
Ask them if they agree to leave all ukrainian territory - you'll see different results. Russians was supporting winning war, but now it became a painful stalemate and they want to quit. But somehow magically without losses.
And their opinions don't matter anyway.

[Peresvet]

Yeah, right. They might be for stopping war while preserving current situation with occupied territory. Bet, Putin would like that too.
Ask them if they agree to leave all ukrainian territory - you'll see different results. Russians was supporting winning war, but now it became a painful stalemate and they want to quit. But somehow magically without losses.
And their opinions don't matter anyway.

they themselves will gradually leave the Ukrainian territories, under the blows of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, since they will not be able to keep them with heavy losses. But in this survey there was no clarification at what stage to start peace negotiations, perhaps many respondents support a return to the state before February 24.

[Loyt]

they themselves will gradually leave the Ukrainian territories, under the blows of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, since they will not be able to keep them with heavy losses.

You yourself was complaining about insufficient help from West just a few hours ago. And now it's suddenly a done deal, winning guaranteed?

But in this survey there was no clarification at what stage to start peace negotiations, perhaps many respondents support a return to the state before February 24.

Some, yes. But first - not majority, and second - Feb24 is not enough for Ukraine, they want all ukrainian territory back.
It's simply too early for mass defeatist feelings to appear in Russia, propaganda downplays difficulties, so many think "it's alright, just a minute setback, we didn't even started for real yet".

[Peresvet]

You yourself was complaining about insufficient help from West just a few hours ago. And now it's suddenly a done deal, winning guaranteed?

Exactly. Ukraine will win, I believe in its victory, even without Western weapons, since Ukrainians are strong in spirit and patriotism, and they are simply much larger in number, more than 1 million. But this will continue for years. And if Western aid would come in a much larger volume, this would dramatically accelerate the Ukrainian victory.

[Loyt]

Exactly. Ukraine will win, I believe in its victory, even without Western weapons, since Ukrainians are strong in spirit and patriotism, and they are simply much larger in number, more than 1 million.

No one wins wars with only patriotism and strong spirit. Those things help, but they can't replace actual weapons. Ukraine still has less weapons, than Russia. And i'm not sure what did you mean by "larger in number"? Russian army is bigger in number, and have bigger manpool reserve. Not all of it's forces are involved in actual combat in Ukraine, but same can be said about AFU.

[Peresvet]

No one wins wars with only patriotism and strong spirit. Those things help, but they can't replace actual weapons. Ukraine still has less weapons, than Russia. And i'm not sure what did you mean by "larger in number"? Russian army is bigger in number, and have bigger manpool reserve. Not all of it's forces are involved in actual combat in Ukraine, but same can be said about AFU.

no, russian army is weak and have no spirit, and many divisions are not prepare for real combat. russians army lose permanently, in Charkov battle, in Kiev battle, near Herson. Many of soldiers not involved in combat and concentrated in different regions of country. That why ukrainians are win.

[Loyt]

no, russian army is weak and have no spirit, and many divisions are not prepare for real combat. russians army lose permanently, in Charkov battle, in Kiev battle, near Herson.

Despite that they stopped AFU's advance for now. Quality might be bad, but quantity is quality of its own. Putin doesn't care about losses, he'll just keep mobilization going.
And it's not like Ukraine is in great shape itself, they suffer big losses too, theirs economy is almost paralyzed, theirs infrastructure get bombed almost every day.
There is no guarantee of the win. Russian original goals of disarmament and creating pro-Kremlin puppet state might be unreachable already, but it's not the win for Ukraine yet. They still need to free all they lands.
And that is very hard task still. Zaluzhnyi in his recent interview didn't underestimate russian army and admitted shortage of military resources to conduct effective operation. That's why continuation of outside help is absolutely crucial and necessary.

[nhytgbvfeco2]

Despite that they stopped AFU's advance for now.

That there even was a Ukranian advance says everything you need to know, really. And it hasn't stopped, advances are being made towards Kremmina.

[Loyt]

That there even was a Ukranian advance says everything you need to know, really. And it hasn't stopped, advances are being made towards Kremmina.

Sure thing, easy-peasy, "Moscow in 3 days". Helped russians before...oh, wait.

"There is no greater danger than underestimating your opponent" (c)

[nhytgbvfeco2]

I'm not saying Moscow in 3 days, I'm saying the Ukranians are still gaining ground.

[bitterhowl]

Uh oh, pretty funny. Looks like you almost win (in a little Internet thread ofc). Still gaining some hundreds of TWC political mudpit pages. Keep on going folks with "50% Russians against Special Military Operation", yeah.

[Loyt]

I'm not saying Moscow in 3 days, I'm saying the Ukranians are still gaining ground.

In Kreminna? AFU attempted to take Kreminna since Kharkiv conteroffensive. So since early september.
Russians reporting about "gaining ground in Bahmut" since august. With similar "success".
There is no real advancement. Yet. I'm not saying it'll stay that way.

[nhytgbvfeco2]

Uh oh, pretty funny. Looks like you almost win (in a little Internet thread ofc). Still gaining some hundreds of TWC political mudpit pages. Keep on going folks with "50% Russians against Special Military Operation", yeah.

Hit me up when you guys manage to take Bakhmut. I mean, you've been assaulting it for 5 months now, maybe another 10 or so will do the trick?

In Kreminna? AFU attempted to take Kreminna since Kharkiv conteroffensive. So since early september.
Russians reporting about "gaining ground in Bahmut" since august. With similar "success".
There is no real advancement. Yet. I'm not saying it'll stay that way.

The Ukranians cut the road north of Kreminna last week I believe, as they now control Chervonopopivka. They also secured Dibrova a couple days ago. It's slow, but it's moving.

[Ludicus]

this cowardice of Europe and the United States before the aggressor... Need to give Ukraine as many weapons and long-range missiles as possible.

Once again,
Whatever political orientation of any Russian, there is none who wants to see his country attacked by enemy missiles. The same goes for the nationals of any other country. It is interesting to note that someone who calls himself Russian not only expresses such desire, but even insults the US and Europe by calling them cowards. And even if these words come from the mouth of someone who is not Russian, they still don't make sense, if we consider the colossal financial and military aid provided by the US and the EU.
And no regime, no matter how democratic, wants to have a hostile alliance aiming missiles at it within 400 kms of its capital. Gorbachev initially accepted NATO expansion Gorbachev's Consent to Unified Germany's Membership in NATO.
Later he realized that whatever the Russian regime was, NATO would remain an alliance hostile to Russia.
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Presenting moral arguments to support Zelenski’s regime does not change the crux of the matter - Europe is paying for and buying a political regime with certain characteristics and one should not think that spoiled wine is Moet & Chandon. I already posted a few days ago the article in the Guardian newspaper about the proposal by Zelenski's culture minister, As Ukraine's culture minister, I'm asking you to boycott Tchaikovsky

Proposals of this kind to silence artists and their works in various ways are a revealing feature of Nazism. Nazism and fascism are regimes of a very different nature. Basically, Nazism proposes the dehumanization of the other, it is racist; fascism proposes the subjugation of the individual to the state. The proposal to ban the work of a cultural creator, a 19th century Russian, curiously, the great-grandson of a Ukrainian Cossack, as was Tchaikovsky, allows us to distinguish Nazism from fascism.
Nationalsozialistische, National Socialism, refers to the Volksgemeinshachaft - the community of pure Germans, a concept that can be extended today to define a group by its race or cultural identity (true or artificial). Nazism set up gas chambers to eliminate the other by considering him or her a trash, fascism did no such thing.

Nazism is tribal in nature, "his people" are surrounded by "a world of enemies", "one against all", and he acts on the assumption that there is a fundamental difference between this people and all others, his people are not only superior to the others, but represent the pure race. It is this rejection of belonging to one humanity and acceptance of the culture of others that the proposal by Ukraine's culture minister reflects. We are at the heart of Nazi thinking and the racism that distinguishes it from fascism.

Even on a symbolic level, the Ukrainian regime is the heir to Nazism: the black Nazi cross on a white disk and a red background inspired the gray trident on a red and black background of Stepan Bandera's Ukrainian Rebel Army, which is the origin of Ukraine's current symbols; the golden trident on a blue background, the swastika and the trident refer to the purity of the race and its fighting spirit. For its part, the symbol of fascism is the "fasces" Fasces and refers back to the history of Rome, to the power of the state, and the axe was the symbol of the Roman official who had the authority to execute sentences - the lictor lictor | ancient Roman official

Fascism was nationalist, Nazism was racist, and it is this distinction that explains Nazism's need to annihilate the culture of others. The current Ukrainian regime, with Zelenski as its visible figure, rests on two pillars: the oligarchs who have grown rich like their Russian counterparts through the privatization of public assets after the end of the USSR, and the transformation of state capitalism into neoliberalism that, as far as the Ukrainian oligarchs are concerned, is called the "Monaco Battalion" - by comparison with the Azov Battalion made up of national and international Nazi militias.

"Monaco Battalion": where the richest people of Ukraine sit out the war.


As we know, Russian oligarchs should all be expropriated; but in the case of the Ukrainian oligarchs (they are all at the head of colossal fortunes) for Zelensky there is a question of... "law and morality",
The “Monaco Battalion”: for Volodymyr Zelensky, there is “law and morality concerning these oligarch wealth refugees on the Côte d’Azur

Questioned by Nice-Matin, this Friday, September 23, President Zelensky made a careful analysis of the situation. According to him, this famous “battalion” poses a problem in relation to the law. “Those who have not respected it will have to be held responsible” he said.
He refuses to generalize
“And then there is a question of morale. On this point, it is difficult for me to comment. Let me not tell you what I think of each of them. I cannot generalise. Some had the right to make that choice. They may have been afraid, they may have wanted to evacuate their children, some surely had other reasons”.

As in Nazi Germany, a communications genius like Goebbels was working on leader-centered propaganda. In the case of Ukraine and Zelenski it is journalist Dmytro Lytvyn, who was a political analyst for the People's Servant, Zelensky's political party, and who follows Goebbels' principle of exploiting the emotions generated by strong words and phrases How Zelenskiy's team of TV writers helps his victory message

One former colleague said…I’m not a fan. But he’s smart,” the colleague added… In this Lord of the Rings-style drama, Russian soldiers were “orcs” and Putin an invisible Sauron.

The regime that Europeans are supporting in Ukraine has a Nazi matrix, and this is an assumed legacy by erecting Stepan Bandera as a national hero. Stepan Bandera was a Ukrainian ultranationalist, leader of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists and its armed wing, the Ukrainian insurgent Army (UPA), but outside Ukraine, especially in Poland, he is accused of collaborating with the Nazis, anti-Semitism, and being a war criminal, and held primarily responsible for the massacre of Polish civilians in Volinia in 1943, in an operation that had the characteristics of ethnic cleansing,
Massacres of Poles in Volhynia and Eastern Galicia

Poland intervenes after Ukrainian ambassador denies wartime massacre of Poles and Jews. JUL 1, 2022

Poland’s foreign ministry has intervened after Ukraine’s ambassador to Germany denied that Ukrainian nationalist leader Stepan Bandera was responsible for the mass murder of ethnic Poles and Jews, and also sought to justify his collaboration with Nazi Germany.
The episode has renewed tensions over what has long been a sensitive issue in Polish-Ukrainian relations. In response, Ukraine’s foreign ministry has distanced itself from the words of the ambassador, Andrii Melnyk, saying that they were just his “own opinion”.

Poland says Ukraine must recognise Bandera's genocide - Aug 19, 2022
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This is what Ukraine's vibrant democracy is all about but if you think about it, why can't a regime with a Nazi matrix belong to NATO, if after all there is a country that had a fascist regime at the time it was a founding member of NATO?
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The regime that Ursula has said that "belongs in the European family” is well known to her for family reasons Germany's new war minister and Stern magazine

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The political roots of Ursula von der Leyen
Von der Leyen emerged from the Lower Saxony branch of the CDU. She is the daughter of Ernst Albrecht, who was premier of that federal state from 1976 to 1990 and exhibited a pronounced tendency towards elitism and the ideology of National Socialism (Nazism).
In 1976, Albrecht’s book, The State, Idea and Reality: Outlines of a political philosophy, was published by the national-conservative Seewald Verlag. The work expresses his contempt for democratic legislation and the broad masses of the population, “the mob”, as well as his preference for Old Testament forms of rule.
“If we succeed in bringing people of above-average capabilities to governance,” he writes, “an autocracy or the rule of the few will be able to create a better order than the rule of the people”.
“The rule of the people”, he grumbles, “especially direct rule, is essentially such that decisions are not determined by the insight of the insightful (elite), but rather by the common average level based on the majority of the population”.
This mentality of a maturely ruling elite was associated with National Socialist mindsets in the Lower Saxony CDU. In the 1950s, the Lower Saxony CDU admitted into its ranks members of the extreme right-wing German Reich Party and Socialist Reich Party, as well as the national-conservative German Party.
In 1976, Albrecht made Hans Puvogel his minister of justice. During his tenure, Puvogel was particularly active in combatting notions of more liberal penal and rehabilitation systems. He had already set out justification for his stance in a 1935-1936 doctoral thesis. There, he wrote of the “inheritance of criminal tendencies”, of “constitutionally predisposed criminals” and “inferior people”, who would have to be “eliminated from the community”. “Only a person of value to the race” would have “a right to exist within the national community”.
The state government under Ernst Albrecht used every opportunity to court former Nazis. In a 1978 speech, Deputy Premier Wilfried Hasselmann (CDU) greeted the Association of Knight’s Cross Recipients, a league of former Wehrmacht (Hitler’s army) officers and SS men, certifying that they had “shown courage and given an example to others”. Hasselmann declared he was “deeply impressed by the solidarity of your order. You have fulfilled your duty as soldiers in an exemplary manner. This will continue to be evident to a younger generation”.
The Lower Saxony CDU member, Hans Edgar Jahn, stood as candidate for the first European elections in 1979. The 1943 publication of his book on European policy-making, The Storming of the Steppes - Jewish-Bolshevik imperialism, was seen to have qualified him for this position. The book predicts the final destruction of Judaism and the assemblage of the all “Germanic peoples” around a common hearth. “But even after thousands of years”, writes Jahn, “humanity and especially our youth will sound one particular name with respect and awe: Adolf Hitler”.
Albrecht’s daughter, Ursula, thinks much of her father, who is now suffering from dementia. In 2003, she stated in an interview that he was for her “a wonderful counsellor”. She said they shared a common “core belief”, which was based on “Christian and traditional family values”.
Von der Leyen has carried this conviction throughout her political career, beginning it where her father once ruled. When he lost the premiership of Lower Saxony to Gerhard Schröder (Social Democratic Party, SPD) in 1990, she felt it was an affront on the part of voters and joined the CDU at 31 years of age. In a later interview, she said she had thought at the time: “An intolerable disgrace”.
Already by 2003, she had been appointed to the post of minister of social affairs, women, family and health in the Lower Saxony state government, led by the CDU. She distinguished herself mainly by pushing for cuts in social spending. She managed, for example, to abolish benefits for the blind.
The social attacks, begun by the SPD-Green Party government under Gerhard Schröder in 1998, were continued by the CDU-SPD coalition under Chancellor Angela Merkel (CDU) from 2005. As federal minister for family affairs, senior citizens, women and youth, von der Leyen pressed through parental allowance benefits, specifically designed to encourage higher income earners to produce more children, while financial support for poor mothers and fathers was reduced.
As minister of labour and social affairs from 2009 to 2013, she later ensured that funds for the unemployed were curtailed and financial penalties for recipients of unemployment benefits implemented more efficiently. Many “reforms” (i.e., social cuts) later, she took over the post of defence minister to advance the economic and geopolitical interests of German imperialism throughout the world. Faced with widespread anti-war sentiment within the population, she has devoted herself to the revitalisation of German militarism.

…but it is not that of all Europeans, and it is not even comparable to Italian fascism, Spanish fascism, and Portuguese fascism/Salazarism, a one-party dictatorship as defined by Hanna Arendt. And the radical difference lies in the racism inherent in Nazism, which Zelenski's culture minister exposed, and which also constituted the ideological knot of Stepan Bandera, the hero of the Ukrainian regime.
----

In his most recent book, The Economic Weapon: The Rise of Sanctions as a Tool on Modern War. N. Mulder notes that economic sanctions dominate the world stage, and that they are ultimately based on the devastating war techniques they are intended to prevent. It teaches us about what happened the last time this approach was tried. As for the EU, it would be good to ensure strategic autonomy, at a time when sanctions are ignored by other players (China, India, Turkey, Brazil, and others). The cost of gasoline in Europe is four times higher than gasoline in the U.S. and twice as much as gasoline. The EU cannot be undermined economically. EU countries, regardless of their position in this conflict, must avoid being caught up in a geopolitical and economic maelstrom that irretrievably weakens the EU. France, historically, has been sovereignitist, sovereignty is the basis of its historical behavior, and it tries to row against the tide. In France there are still those who think. Which is already an achievement in these times of the hegemony of the "single thought",

Macron on Ukraine: 'I don't want the Chinese and Turks to be the only ones negotiating the day after'...

I have always been clear in saying I did not think this conflict could end only militarily…I know this upsets many who are committed to the annihilation scenario. I would like the Europeans and Westerners, who are lecturing me, to tell me who they want to see at the table. I don't want the Chinese and the Turks to be the only ones negotiating the day after. Europe must gain technological and capability autonomy from the United States

Edit,
Macron ruffles feathers with talk of autonomy, Russian security

After decades of European “free-riding” on U.S. military protection, Americans should welcome Macron’s remarks. The Biden administration would do well to endorse Macron’s comments and urge other European allies to work with him. This is an opportunity for European governments to take more responsibility for their own defense… The U.S. has often criticized its allies for spending too little, but then it has swatted down every suggestion that European governments exercise greater autonomy.
Most recently, Macron has suggested the outlines of a new security architecture for Europe that would provide reassurances to all sides, including Russia. If any new security architecture for Europe is to succeed, it will have to take at least some Russian interests into account or it will not be a stable and enduring arrangement.
Instead of bashing Macron for “appeasement,” his European colleagues should give him credit for trying to plan for the post-war world and how to stabilize Europe once the conflict has ended.

[PointOfViewGun]

Nazism is tribal in nature, "his people" are surrounded by "a world of enemies", "one against all", and he acts on the assumption that there is a fundamental difference between this people and all others, his people are not only superior to the others, but represent the pure race. It is this rejection of belonging to one humanity and acceptance of the culture of others that the proposal by Ukraine's culture minister reflects. We are at the heart of Nazi thinking and the racism that distinguishes it from fascism.

Even on a symbolic level, the Ukrainian regime is the heir to Nazism: the black Nazi cross on a white disk and a red background inspired the gray trident on a red and black background of Stepan Bandera's Ukrainian Rebel Army, which is the origin of Ukraine's current symbols; the golden trident on a blue background, the swastika and the trident refer to the purity of the race and its fighting spirit. For its part, the symbol of fascism is the "fasces" Fasces and refers back to the history of Rome, to the power of the state, and the axe was the symbol of the Roman official who had the authority to execute sentences - the lictor lictor | ancient Roman official

This kind of distortion of reality is more in line with Nazi ideology compared to any ties Ukraine might have with Nazism.

[Peresvet]

Once again,
Whatever political orientation of any Russian, there is none who wants to see his country attacked by enemy missiles. The same goes for the nationals of any other country.

ing putinists think so, not Russians, real Russians want the defeat of the putin regime, which imprisoned all Russian nationalists or killed them in prison, for example, Tesak.
If you putinist - you my main enemy and I hate you.

[Cyclops]

This kind of distortion of reality is more in line with Nazi ideology compared to any ties Ukraine might have with Nazism.

Are we back to "Zelenskyy is a Nazi because just like Hitler he invaded Poland"? Tragic times for Putin simps, recently Vlad was recast as a modern Abraham Lincoln (lol too short) and now hes, who? Rooseveldt? Stalin?

So mamy costume changes for yhe little fellow. He tried to wear Peter the Great's coat but once again, too short. Did he accidentally put on Napoleons hat?

I hope doesnt end up with Anastasias underwear.

[Loyt]

Once again,
Whatever political orientation of any Russian, there is none who wants to see his country attacked by enemy missiles. The same goes for the nationals of any other country. It is interesting to note that someone who calls himself Russian not only expresses such desire, but even insults the US and Europe by calling them cowards.

Not true. It is, in fact, normal to wish defeat to your country, if you disagree with war it's waging. And AFU so far didn't waste recources on useless terrorizm of civilians.

Proposals of this kind to silence artists and their works in various ways are a revealing feature of Nazism

They are in the middle of the real war. Hatred to everything associated with the enemy is real, emotions heightened, dumb propositions made. It's inevitable.
And, by the way, in Russia they already open criminal cases if someone listens to ukrainian music. But you somehow avoid to accuse Russia in nazism.

Nazism is tribal in nature, "his people" are surrounded by "a world of enemies", "one against all", and he acts on the assumption that there is a fundamental difference between this people and all others, his people are not only superior to the others, but represent the pure race.

How is that represent Ukraine and not Russia itself?
And there was a time, then i thought, that Orwell exagerrated too much... so ironic.

[Mithradates]

Uh oh, pretty funny. Looks like you almost win (in a little Internet thread ofc). Still gaining some hundreds of TWC political mudpit pages. Keep on going folks with "50% Russians against Special Military Operation", yeah.

Oh, I thought you got mobilized, good to see you are still alive!

Just in case, if anyone ends up being mobilized, here is an educational video what to do next so they wont end up like them.

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Locals in Kreminna are complaining that Russian soldiers have begun looting everything they can get their hands on, thats what usually they do right before they abandon a city.

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I dont really have the time now, but this, just wow...

And no regime, no matter how democratic, wants to have a hostile alliance aiming missiles at it within 400 kms of its capital.

[Vanoi]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/pavel-...in-window-fall

Another Russian elite died falling through a window. Starting to think these guys should really avoid windows or tall buildings in general.