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Thread: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

  1. #61
    Gigantus's Avatar I am not special - I am a limited edition.
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Adrian View Post
    Having n separate threads sorted by mod in separate forums kind of defeats the purpose of the whole thing imho. We need a one stop thing where you can see that FluffyButtCheeks88 worked on Medieval, Empire and Troy mods so he would probably deserve at least a 501 gold.
    Well, let's hear a practical suggestion then on how to get there. Because you are talking of creating a data base from scratch for approximately 300 main mods and roughly the same number of small mods and even more guides\tutorials. At least the main mods will have multiple members, occasionally small mods do as well.

    Hope you haven't got anything planned until Xmas next year?










  2. #62

    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    The Modding Staff was envisioned to assist modders and keep tabs on development in their respective areas. Unfortunately, the Modding Staff got warped into something unsustainable.

  3. #63
    Sir Adrian's Avatar the Imperishable
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    I've already answered all of that at least twice + in the OP. But for the sake of brevity:

    There will be a single thread posted somewhere public and linked in all the modding fora. Modders can submit their work to one of the people curating the thread if they want to make it easier to get awards. Nobody will force them to do it. The goal is not to achieve a 100% coverage of all mods on the site. The goal is not to recognize entire teams. The goal is to make it easier for unknown modders to gain recognition. If they do not want any, that's their choice. Nobody will be looking for anything, nobody will be retroactively adding anything. Nobody will be adding anything that has not been submitted by PM or by comment in the thread. Nobody will be trawling the modding sections for anything.

    The main purpose of this is awards and the main requirement is accessibility for the people active in the Curia and Prohalamos, not data completeness. I care to see what mods user HappyBurger has not worked on. I don't care that TWC has 5 mods that have not been worked on since 2007. I don't want to have to open 8 threads and click 30 links in each thread just to see if HappyBurger worked on anything.

    If you want to add extra functionality, go ahead, but you have to accommodate this requirement.

    Hope you haven't got anything planned until Xmas next year?
    I did something identical in the Scriptorium back in 2013, where I catalogued a few thousand entries by myself, and it took me ~30 hours of work iirc. That's very little as far as I'm concerned. Others may disagree.
    Last edited by Sir Adrian; October 14, 2021 at 06:39 AM.
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  4. #64
    Muizer's Avatar member 3519
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    I think the best way to persuade modders to participate is greater exposure for their work. If the registry can be set up as the primary entry point for users looking for mods to play, that would be the best bet of getting modders involved. The prospect of medals and awards may help to, but I don't think that's enough in itself.
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  5. #65

    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Don't we already have a place to see this?


    If you want the Curia to pass of these awards, the Consul can appoint or we can elect someone to curate the thread.
    This person (and you can pick some Romanized name if you like) can make a thread in the Curia, post the person and the award the qualify for. I do not see why we have to vote for them. The thread could be a matter of public record with the OP containing the list whent he person was awarded a medal for modding.

  6. #66
    Sir Adrian's Avatar the Imperishable
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Ok, Pike. make that show me at a glance all the awardable work user Mr_Nygren has done.

    Quote Originally Posted by Muizer View Post
    I think the best way to persuade modders to participate is greater exposure for their work. If the registry can be set up as the primary entry point for users looking for mods to play, that would be the best bet of getting modders involved. The prospect of medals and awards may help to, but I don't think that's enough in itself.
    Hmmm. You may be right. What are you proposing?
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  7. #67

    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Muizer View Post
    I think the best way to persuade modders to participate is greater exposure for their work. If the registry can be set up as the primary entry point for users looking for mods to play, that would be the best bet of getting modders involved. The prospect of medals and awards may help to, but I don't think that's enough in itself.
    One of the things we were working on in the modding staff was a creation of a searchable data base on wiki for all mods.
    It would have been possible to search by modder as well. It is a daunting task, smething that needed to have been done 10+ years ago. It would take a gargantuan effort to get something like that up and running.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Adrian View Post
    Ok, Pike. make that show me at a glance all the awardable work user Mr_Nygren has done.
    See comments above.


    Short of that, there isn't much you can do unless you have a committee group or persons willing to look for this stuff. The further back you go, then the larger the group you will need. I worked on Attila for over a month (I did nothing else but my regular job) and I barely scratched the surface. I also identified at least 10 modders that modding one or more mods in which more than half would have qualified for Artifex if someone was "watching."

    Again this is what modding staff was meant to do, work and support modders and recognize contribution and we screwed the pooch.

  8. #68
    Gigantus's Avatar I am not special - I am a limited edition.
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Adrian View Post
    I did something identical in the Scriptorium back in 2013, where I catalogued a few thousand entries by myself, and it took me ~30 hours of work iirc. That's very little as far as I'm concerned. Others may disagree.
    Hats off - that's an impressive chunk of voluntary time commitment.










  9. #69
    Sir Adrian's Avatar the Imperishable
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Sorry I've left this hanging. I was supposed to come up with a model by sunday but work got in the way - never commit change requests to production on friday afternoon is all I can say.

    I'll try to have a proof of concept by friday.


    Quote Originally Posted by PikeStance View Post

    Short of that, there isn't much you can do unless you have a committee group or persons willing to look for this stuff. The further back you go, then the larger the group you will need. I worked on Attila for over a month (I did nothing else but my regular job) and I barely scratched the surface. I also identified at least 10 modders that modding one or more mods in which more than half would have qualified for Artifex if someone was "watching."

    Again this is what modding staff was meant to do, work and support modders and recognize contribution and we screwed the pooch.
    We don't need to search for anything though, as I said this is a free service provided to the modders to help get bling. If they do not want to use said service, their choice, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. Nor do I really care to create a complete index.

    See comments above.
    Which one? I want to be able to see at a glance if I can award BourbonSipper88 or not. I don't care that there's a mod for Rome that adds historically accurate sandals to the civilians in city view.
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  10. #70
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Example thread. This is a rough sketch and requires proper formatting


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    Modding contributions list


    INTRODUCTION


    This thread contains contributions submitted by moders for consideration during award noominations. All submissions have been vetted by <USERS>. If you spot any inconsistencies or errors feel free to contact <USERS>

    Full text to be determined

    User contributions

    User 1 (lhyperlink to user profile)


    Ogniem i Mieczem: Total War
    Realistic Building Tree
    ReallyBadAI Battle System and Battle AI Switcher
    Rise of Empires
    Rise of Kings
    Rise of the Caliphate
    Rise of Xerxes
    Sinuhets Battle Mechanics for MTW2
    Stainless Steel





    User 2 (lhyperlink to user profile)


    Ogniem i Mieczem: Total War
    Realistic Building Tree
    ReallyBadAI Battle System and Battle AI Switcher
    Rise of Empires
    Rise of Kings
    Rise of the Caliphate
    Rise of Xerxes
    Sinuhets Battle Mechanics for MTW2
    Stainless Steel






    etc







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  11. #71
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Looks good to me.

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  12. #72
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Let me see if I understood right: creators of mods\tutorials\resources as well as users thereof are encouraged (through banners and other means) to provide details (creator\creations) which then will be cross checked by staff\appointed members and entered in a thread as proposed just above? Or do the details go straight in and the submitting member will be deemed the 'vetter'?

    Generally support the former approach, skeptical about the latter.










  13. #73

    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    It seems far easier to simply elect/ appoint a single person to watch the already created thread for qualified modders and we can be done with this.

  14. #74
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    I believe the former was the idea, Gigantus, but I can't speak for Adrian. I'm personally also more in favor of the former approach.

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  15. #75
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Akar View Post
    Looks good to me.
    Same here
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  16. #76
    Muizer's Avatar member 3519
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantus View Post
    Let me see if I understood right: creators of mods\tutorials\resources as well as users thereof are encouraged (through banners and other means) to provide details (creator\creations) which then will be cross checked by staff\appointed members and entered in a thread as proposed just above? Or do the details go straight in and the submitting member will be deemed the 'vetter'?

    Generally support the former approach, skeptical about the latter.
    Either way it is based on the assumption that modders will submit this info for the sole purpose of creating an award candidate list. I don't think such an incentive is going to be effective and I kind of doubt if it is even desirable.
    "Lay these words to heart, Lucilius, that you may scorn the pleasure which comes from the applause of the majority. Many men praise you; but have you any reason for being pleased with yourself, if you are a person whom the many can understand?" - Lucius Annaeus Seneca -

  17. #77

    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Muizer View Post
    Either way it is based on the assumption that modders will submit this info for the sole purpose of creating an award candidate list. I don't think such an incentive is going to be effective and I kind of doubt if it is even desirable.
    I agree and not to mention there are already a threads for this.

  18. #78
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Don't take my pessimism too seriously as it clearly hasn't resulted in very much, but I think the idea as it stands is pretty likely to be another flame with a brief duration that quickly burns out. In other words not sustainable or especially constructive to the desired ends, despite meaning well. A handful of users who care getting together to nominate on the spot like the last spree seems more likely to get somewhere and can be done at any time if people would only do it, and since the awards seem here to stay (and did get needed adjustments in other proceedings) we might as well.
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  19. #79
    Sir Adrian's Avatar the Imperishable
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Muizer View Post
    Either way it is based on the assumption that modders will submit this info for the sole purpose of creating an award candidate list. I don't think such an incentive is going to be effective and I kind of doubt if it is even desirable.
    Why do you think it's not desirable?

    The way I see it, if people are not interested in medals, at least we know to stop pestering them and nothing will have been lost. The only reason this would not be desirable from my point of view is if modding on the site has declined so badly that there are very few people left who could submit anything. I don't know if that's the case or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantus View Post
    Let me see if I understood right: creators of mods\tutorials\resources as well as users thereof are encouraged (through banners and other means) to provide details (creator\creations) which then will be cross checked by staff\appointed members and entered in a thread as proposed just above? Or do the details go straight in and the submitting member will be deemed the 'vetter'?

    Generally support the former approach, skeptical about the latter.

    You are modder FluffyToes88. You just completed an overhaul for medieval 3. You would like some bling for that work. You go to one of the sticked redirects of this thread and post in there (or contact via PM, both work imho) Hi I'm FluffyToes88 and I completed this overhaul. Somebody who knows a thing or two about modding (whether it's staff or a volunteer or an elected position is fine by me) vets your work and if it all checks it gets added to the list in the OP and your post is deleted to keep the thread clean.

    I am citizen SudokuNightmare99 and I want to nominate people for awards. I go to the thread in the Proth (or wherever we decide to put it), I see that FluffyToes88 has some work done and is eligible for the Triple Opifex, so I nominate him.

    This helps FluffyToes88 because he gets a medal and it removes all the randomness currently present in awards. It also helps SudokuNightmare99 because he no longer has to keep up with dozens of people and actively scan the modding fora to find people to nominate for Opifex, 501, etc.


    There are a lot of details to iron out, but this is the gist of it.
    Last edited by Sir Adrian; October 28, 2021 at 09:44 AM.
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  20. #80
    Gigantus's Avatar I am not special - I am a limited edition.
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    Default Re: [Discussion] An idea to improve modding awards distribution

    The (self) promoting aspect of it is relatively clear, thanks for expanding, my skepticism was in connection if that information would go directly into award consideration without being vetted.
    Last edited by Gigantus; October 28, 2021 at 10:25 AM.










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