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Thread: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    Cleitus, did you happen to load a save before ending the turn when the AI dropped their 1-turn siege? I think they "forget" or otherwise readjust their moves after loading, you can see by passing a turn as normal (after playing through at least one end turn), then loading the save from previous turn right before ending it and seeing how they behave. Pretty often, it's a different move than what they had done without the loading.

    That said, if this doesn't apply, I wonder if anyone experienced behavior like that before the AI changes or if it's truly a direct result of the update. I'm almost certain I've seen plenty of that exact sort of thing over the years (AI breaking sieges) but I couldn't remember a specific definite example to be satisfied that it's true myself. But I'm like... pretty sure. Idunno.

    Plus maybe they had a reason to reposition the army? Did you happen to see where it headed off towards in that different continent? Any enemy threats or other potential reasons for breaking siege and moving there (a new or ongoing war on that front, incoming enemies there, etc)? So much of this stuff is guesswork on our part, based on observations and assumptions and projection and who knows what else, often with incomplete information. It's hard to know what happens and why a lot of the time, and everyone has theories. Who knows. Hopefully some way to get the same good progression results and army positioning/use (far as taking into account relative strength and stuff is concerned) can be figured out with less drastic swings at some point.

  2. #22

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    I have more of a problem with hard or very hard ai at their last settlement. Because they will buy mercenaries and recruit endlessly even if their last settlement are some backwater region which means they shouldn't have the manpower or cash to spawn 3 stack if army in one sleepy town.

    After that i always play at normal.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    One could also mention that there were always long stretches of peace even between empires who were famous for fighting each other very often like the Seleucid and the Ptolomaic who in reality were only at war for 22 years between 272 b.c. and 172 b.c.
    Considering how much emphasis this mod puts on historical accuracy, the area of war is the most ahistorical.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    Cleitus the Pink, if that's truly the case, then EB Dev team, was there a deliberate change in the campaign ai to make them more amenable to peace (temporarily it seems)? I always play(ed) with Hard or Very Hard Campaign ai, and in my experience it takes AGES for any faction to shift to a stance of peace at all. The times when they suddenly declare war with me was usually due to them being allied with another faction that I was in constant conflict with. Also, it was nearly impossible to get them to give me anything, especially if it was the faction I was directly in conflict with (the ones who are in for the lols or more appropriately because of alliances are those that send a fleet to block a port of mine a few turns or so and could be bribed for a ceasefire). Point is, I could never milk anything out of anyone. They were the ones that got stuff out of my treasury...

  5. #25

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dooz View Post
    Cleitus, did you happen to load a save before ending the turn when the AI dropped their 1-turn siege? I think they "forget" or otherwise readjust their moves after loading, you can see by passing a turn as normal (after playing through at least one end turn), then loading the save from previous turn right before ending it and seeing how they behave. Pretty often, it's a different move than what they had done without the loading.

    That said, if this doesn't apply, I wonder if anyone experienced behavior like that before the AI changes or if it's truly a direct result of the update. I'm almost certain I've seen plenty of that exact sort of thing over the years (AI breaking sieges) but I couldn't remember a specific definite example to be satisfied that it's true myself. But I'm like... pretty sure. Idunno.

    Plus maybe they had a reason to reposition the army? Did you happen to see where it headed off towards in that different continent? Any enemy threats or other potential reasons for breaking siege and moving there (a new or ongoing war on that front, incoming enemies there, etc)? So much of this stuff is guesswork on our part, based on observations and assumptions and projection and who knows what else, often with incomplete information. It's hard to know what happens and why a lot of the time, and everyone has theories. Who knows. Hopefully some way to get the same good progression results and army positioning/use (far as taking into account relative strength and stuff is concerned) can be figured out with less drastic swings at some point.
    No, I didn't load the save before ending turns. I was playing as Epeiros and had made Pella my capital. The Getai were the ones doing this besieging thing. Then for some reason that army marched into Asia Minor, which doesn't make sense because they weren't at war with anyone else other than me and no one was threatening them at the moment. Not even Pergamon which held Byzantion and neighboured the Getai(Byzantion was barely garrisoned so even if they suddenly wanted to attack Pergamon, they naturally should've besieged Byzantion). Just kind of absurd. I've seen absurd army movement in previous patches as well, like the Pontic and Armenian armies just randomly taking strolls in the Balkans, but this is a whole new level. And, my bigger problem is with the bipolar diplomacy. I shouldn't be able to milk the AI no matter what.

  6. #26

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pooploop View Post
    Cleitus the Pink, if that's truly the case, then EB Dev team, was there a deliberate change in the campaign ai to make them more amenable to peace (temporarily it seems)?
    Right I think what people are seeing is the hardcoded AI fighting the script. Sometimes they seem to **really** want a particular settlement or something.

    Also I think I read once that the ships are completely independent of the rest AI and just will attack ports at random sometimes leading to war, or something along those lines. It would be nice if the dll injection mod, whatever it's called, would be able to disable this - ah - feature.

  7. #27

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pooploop View Post
    Please explain then the wars of the Diadochai, the wars of Carthage, the corpse-strewn fields where CONSTANT Gallic and Germanic raids occured.
    - talking about stable alliances.
    - Brings out Diadochi, Carthage and Celtic tribes as an example.

    Seems legit.


  8. #28

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    Floren...I'm not sure what you mean by that? I was bringing up the fact that there was no such thing in the time period as a nice "stable" alliance. At least, not to the point that you'd be confident enough to denude your border of garrisons just because of "good relations" with your neighbor. However, I have to concede that, as per the observations of others on this thread, the ai has become downright "buggy" in its cycle of war and peace, well beyond the standard backstabbiness, treachery, and bullheadedness of the era. I mean if you can consistently "scam" a couple of thousands of minai every other turn or so because of the rapid ups and downs in "mood" of the ai, it speaks more of a personality disorder rather than an opportunistic and calculating mind behind the ai factons' foreign policy.

  9. #29

    Default Re: Will there be a mini-release to neuter the new AI?

    Silly question - are CAI files tailored specifically to a mod, or can they be "transplanted" from one mod to another without any problems (do they just have different values or do they have some additional elements added which would crash other mods)?

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