Patronisation amendment:Civic awareness

[Garbarsardar]

I propose the amendment of the relevant section of the syntagma:

Supporters: imb39, Ozymandias, the Black Prince, silverguard, gigagaia.

Patronization
Any Citizen holding their rank for three months without warnings can Patronise a peregrinus for Citizenship at a rate of one per month (subject to requirements, section 1). The granting of Citizenship is determined by the Consilium de Civitate. The process for patronage works as follows:

1. The patron reviews the member before recommending him, ensuring the member has at least fifty posts, has been a registered member for at least one month and has no warnings in the last six months.
2. The nominee sends a private message to explain his duties, privileges, and contributions towards TWC to his patron and a summary of his understanding of our governance system in no more than 350 words. The patron then sends this paragraph (along with his own paragraph outlining why he chose this person for a client) to a member of the CdeC.
3. The CdeC member then opens a thread and vote in the Consilium de Civitate section and the proposed nominee is then discussed and voted on.
4. If the nominee achieves at least a 60% majority, the nominee shall become a Citizen. This must be concluded within 1 week.


If a nominee fails his Citizenship vote he must wait a minimum of one month before being put up for vote again. The nominating Citizen of a failed candidate may not patronise again for two months. Members of the CdeC must abstain from voting on those they wish to patronize.

All CdeC votes associated with patronage shall be concluded within one week (7 days) of the thread being opened in the CdeC.

Points 3 and 4 above are used for the promotion of Patricians nominated by an existing Patrician as per the requirements listed in Appendix A.

The reason for the above addition to the required material is the following:

A new Civitates or Artifex should be aware of the system he is about to participate in. This addition will give him the incentive of familiarising with the Syntagma and probably ask his prospective patron some questions which in turn will give the insentive to the patron to do so.

There is a poll (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=63205) which indicates a somewhat low level of awarness of our Syntagma. This is potential problematic for a community of involved and educated members.

Furthermore a bill re-enabling the Citizens to legislate and post in the Curia is about to become part of the Syntagma. With added rights should come a mimimum of added requirments.

[imb39]

200 words, heh... Not sure I could keep it that low. It must be said that CDC members do have very low attention spans...

I agree that if you are intending to take part in an organisation/group it is incumbant to try and understand the basics.

[Tom Paine]

Okay, I can understand what you are trying to do, but I've always seen candidates providing those anyway... but yes I guess so. Support. (Though 500 words or less might be a more reasonable limit, no?)

[Garbarsardar]

I made it 350 which is the average A4 page (at least my students think so...)

[Tom Paine]

Your students are, therefore, wierd, I must say... if they are writing with the latin alphabet and its their first language, anyway. I'd say more close to 500, and that 500 gives them more room, though 350 as a maximum forces them to self-censor a little, which is good discipline.

[Simetrical]

A single-spaced page is about 500 words, double-spaced is about 250. Or at least so I've always been told. It will be different, of course, if you fiddle with margins or font sizes.

But I disagree with this proposal. Becoming a Citizen should require only posting merit, not essays. Requiring a single paragraph of indefinite length is no big deal, but tacking on more and more requirements is Bad. Especially for modders, etc.

[Publius]

But I disagree with this proposal. Becoming a Citizen should require only posting merit, not essays. Requiring a single paragraph of indefinite length is no big deal, but tacking on more and more requirements is Bad. Especially for modders, etc.

I agree wholeheartedly with Simetrical on this. Your nomination and vote should be based on what you have done on the forums, not influenced by how well you can write an essay. And you cannot hold against someone their not being familiar with the Syntagma when the are outsiders to the entire process - where is their motivation as a basic member to do so?

This also seems biased towards the CC - you're not going to ask all Civitates how to mod, are you?

[Garbarsardar]

I agree wholeheartedly with Simetrical on this. Your nomination and vote should be based on what you have done on the forums, not influenced by how well you can write an essay. And you cannot hold against someone their not being familiar with the Syntagma when the are outsiders to the entire process - where is their motivation as a basic member to do so?

This also seems biased towards the CC - you're not going to ask all Civitates how to mod, are you?

No, I am going to ask modders to get involved in the decision making of the site. I am going to ask them to familiarise themselves with the Syntagma so when they decide to get involved they don't have to face all kinds of roadblocks.

If modding was a requisite to have a say as to how the community is run, then yes I would ask from anyone to read modding tutorials.

Where exactly this atavistic fear of written text comes from? Why 350 or 500 words on how someone understand the running of the site suddenly looks an unsurmountable task?

Why the Syntagma must be known to the "select few". Participation should not be a priviledge but a right.

If you consider that writing a paragraph is burden then indeed we have different views on civic duty.

You seem to be making Curial awareness part of becoming a citizen. It has never been before, and I'm not sure it should be know.

So what is the purpose of becoming a Civitates or an Artifex? To have a badge?
I thought that Citizenship is awarded so members can contribute to the site from a position of greater responsibility and exert influence upon the decision making process. If that is not the case and I am under a terrible misunderstanding, then probably I am in the wrong forum.

[Publius]

No, I am going to ask modders to get involved in the decision making of the site. I am going to ask them to familiarise themselves with the Syntagma so when they decide to get involved they don't have to face all kinds of roadblocks.

If modding was a requisite to have a say as to how the community is run, then yes I would ask from anyone to read modding tutorials.

Where exactly this atavistic fear of written text comes from? Why 350 or 500 words on how someone understand the running of the site suddenly looks an unsurmountable task?

Why the Syntagma must be known to the "select few". Participation should not be a priviledge but a right.

If you consider that writing a paragraph is burden then indeed we have different views on civic duty.

Your intentions, Garb, are good, but I think its not the most practical of 'solutions.' I would never forgive myself if I made a blanket statement for the modding community, but I think in general you will find a modder cares much more about his work than a forum badge - they're nice, don't get me wrong, but they arent losing any sleep over it. And I think you'll also find that many modders hold something of a contempt for site politics - this has been my experience, at least. So you can see, forcing them pour over a political internet document so they can partake in a political internet system many of them are less than enthusiastic to is ... not the best road to take, perhaps.

I agree it would be nice to have the modding community more active in deciding where this site goes, but this is not the way to do so in my eyes. We want people interested in the Curia etc. of their own volition, not turn the entire system into an obligation.

If we want to get the modders involved, how about we try giving them more responsibility instead of more tasks?

[Fabolous]

So what is the purpose of becoming a Civitates or an Artifex? To have a badge?
I thought that Citizenship is awarded so members can contribute to the site from a position of greater responsibility and exert influence upon the decision making process. If that is not the case and I am under a terrible misunderstanding, then probably I am in the wrong forum.

It is awarded for contributions to TWC. It comes with the privildge to exert influence upon the decision making process if they care to do so. I don't think inputting to the Curia should be required of a citizen.

[Silver Guard]

350 words? Thats (for me) 17.5 lines of writting, I say we should cut it down a little. Of course we could all fill an A4 sheet, but could they? And is it realy neccissary to write such a large amount? I say max 350, guideline 200.

[Tom Paine]

If I read correctly the 350 words is actually a maximum as it is, so bsaically you support it

[the Black Prince]

i think it will taste nice

[Fabolous]

There is a poll (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=63205) which indicates a somewhat low level of awarness of our Syntagma. This is potential problematic for a community of involved and educated members.

Are you looking at the same poll I am? If you count the peopel who claim to "read it before bed every night" as being atleast "somewhat familiar" with the Syntagma, you have 81% of the voters claiming to be "somewhat familiar" or more. Thats stunningly high civic awareness. Take any real world country and ask them about their consitution, I bet it is nowhere near 81% being familiar with the text. (Though probably they are vaugely aware of it)

Now look at the non-civitates. 64% are either "somewhat familiar" or "know it by heart" 64% of non-citizens! That is a very high number.

I propose the amendment of the relevant section of the syntagma:



The reason for the above addition to the required material is the following:

A new Civitates or Artifex should be aware of the system he is about to participate in. This addition will give him the incentive of familiarising with the Syntagma and probably ask his prospective patron some questions which in turn will give the insentive to the patron to do so.

I don't see the need for the word limit... I couldn't possibly explain our governance system in 350 words. Or 500. I'm also not sure I agree with your aims. You seem to be making Curial awareness part of becoming a citizen. It has never been before, and I'm not sure it should be know.

[Halie Satanus]

I don't like this either. I would agree to this if it was a requirement of Patricians though, depending on what direction the rank is taken in.

[Halie Satanus]

I would be even happier if the members did that for themselves. If Halie, Teleklos,you or Atterdag bring forth measures to promote the wellbing of moodders for instance.

I haven't forgotten this but I've been to busy modding to push it though, also I'm waiting for Gigsy to bring out his Curial offices proposal out and tie them together.

I am disappointed the council of war was brushed aside so easily, we did some great work and could probably have worked the registry to a workable part of the site by now.

[gigagaia]

I'll support this bill.
Assuming that the Citizen's bill passes, then we will suddenly have citizenship with responsibilities which should not be handed on a platter. If the curia is to be capable of shouldering the burden coming its way in the next while, we have to stop being so cozy with notions of entitlement and start asking people to make accept some responsibility.

[Rolanbek]

Okay, the proposal seems fair enough, however is this just to strengthen the universal sufferage cause?

R

[Garbarsardar]

Okay, the proposal seems fair enough, however is this just to strengthen the universal sufferage cause?

R

I can say that it was in anticipation of the suffrage bill. The haste can be attributed as usual to the ethnic characteristics of the proposer...

[Simetrical]

Where exactly this atavistic fear of written text comes from? Why 350 or 500 words on how someone understand the running of the site suddenly looks an unsurmountable task?

Because we want to encourage members to be Civitates in every way possible. There should be no roadblocks other than the requirement of adequate contributions to the community. I would even discard the current requirement of any written submission at all, although it could be optionally allowed. If even a single good member so much as contemplates not bothering with Citizenship because it's annoying or looks silly or anything at all, that is a serious failure of the system.

Why the Syntagma must be known to the "select few". Participation should not be a priviledge but a right.

Participation should indeed be a right, not a burden. And yes, reading and understanding a rather poorly-written and disorganized document a few pages long can be a burden, especially for people with mediocre English skills. A small burden, but becoming a Citizen is a small benefit, so even a small burden can potentially discourage people.