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Thread: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

  1. #1
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    - The Art of War -
    Online battles HS


    For the first time on TWC, there will be a hotseat with fully implemented online battles, possible due to Engine Overhaul Project by youneuoy.

    We will also be using my newest TES Unofficial Patch 2.0.2 (FULL FEATURES version) with many brand new contents, see the link . If you are using the official download link, you have to use the switcher to change your version to FULL/EOP version.

    Online battles require additional toll on the admin and turn times, obviously the less battles the better. Hence kings purses will be set to zero, possibly combined with army upkeep script, to reduce the amount of battles. Will also not play in whole Tamriel, but only a significant part of it (to also reduce the amount of battles by having smaller realms), hence there will also not be many AI factons. (but possibly lot of rebels)


    Factions
    - Everyone will play one faction, claim 3 factions in order you wish to play the most. I will decide in which part of the map we will play based on your preferred factions. You can also state which campaign would you prefer from the ones offered (we will be definitely not be playing all factions).


    Tamriel Empire - Aexodus( Aexodus#9949 )
    Kingdom of Cyrodiil - REDBOOSTY
    ( REDBOOSTY#0839 )
    Kingdom of Wayrest - vaggelisraf( vaggelis#1407 )
    Kingdom of Pelletine - varrun.( Varrun658992#1687 )
    Kingdom of Wrothgar - Ural (Ural#6449)
    Hold of Eastmarch - Fubuky( Fubuky#6432 )
    Clan of Crowns - Isenbard(Isenbard#8697 )
    Kingdom of Sharnhelm - cowcow( renekton#9760 )
    Kingdom of Evermore - sluzavyblin( SluzavyBlin#0067 )
    Kingdom of Anequina - Xamax (Xamax#8838 )
    Kingdom of Valenwood - merlin( merlinxx#9652 )
    High Kingdom of Summerset Isles - Arya210( Jake El. Valar#6596 )
    Council of Thalmor - youneuoy
    ( youneuoy#3956 )
    Hold of Haafingar - Bane of The Undead(DaggerLord#5649 )



    Undead - unlayable (too OP)
    Daedra - unplayable (even more OP)
    Clans of The Reach - unplayable
    Akaviri Invaders - unplayable
    Maormer Invaders - unplayable

    Admins - Jadli, reaktornkern
    Co-admins - King Athelstan



    Map

    T1



    The Rules
    - Time for a player to play his turn is 24h, unless waiting for an online battle. The Admin may grant an extension occasionally, but only if you ask for it. Otherwise you will be skipped. You cannot ask for an extension if you are already late, If you will be skipped in two or more turns in row, your faction will be turned AI.
    - No exploits/bugs allowed: Posting defeats, making walls of units on map to disallow enemy agents to move and stomping/killing agents with units, surrounding armies/navies to deny retreat, intentionally spreading a plague with agents/units, stepping on a merchant to remove him from a trade resource, exploiting AI factions ( for example demanding/accepting money or settlements from AI factions), and more.
    - There are some AI factions. You may form alliance, trade rights and similar, but not asking for money/lands and so on.

    - Suiciding a faction you play is not allowed, and may result into a removal from all hotseats.

    - Diplomacy is allowed, the winning alliance may consists of maximally 3 players.

    - All ingame features are allowed/enabled (hence "mercenary armies", necromancy, declaring vampirism, special missions and so on).
    - If you declare for Vampirism or Manimarco script, you will "join the evil side". You will be enemy of everyone who hasnt declared for the evil side (no alliance or other diplomacy relations alowed with thosep players). The other players can declare for the evil without the script, once someone uses the script to "create the evil side"


    - List of known bugs:


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    1) The naval fort bug: No using ships to bypass a fort's or a settlement's Zone of Control.

    2) Ambush fort bug: No luring men in ambush position into ZoC of forts\settlement's as such robbing them of their movement points.

    3) Siege reinforcement bug: when the army is adjacent to a fort or a settlements that has been put under siege it cannot reinforce armies adjacent to him which he should have been able to reinforce on normal occasions. Attacking an army which the siege reinforcements bug applies to is not allowed
    Navy inside ports attacked bug: no using this bug to attack ships which are inside ports.

    4) Yoyo armies\forts bug: no attacking an army which the bug has been used on multiple times. You can see when this bug occurs, as the enemy army enters the fort and then leaves it.

    5) Attacking ships inside the port - Attacking ships that are inside ports is not allowed.

    6) Recruitment pool fill up - Quing up units in the recruitment sloots to increase artifically units/agents maximum number you can recruit in one settlement.

    7) Recruting mercenaries in forts with depleted movement points - Using forts to get illegal maximum movement points to mercenaries in a depleted army.

    8) Using ships to get more movement range - Using ships to give more movement range to armies on seas.



    Online battles
    (based on the experience from DAC discord online battles HS, still WIP)
    - Battles of players vs player will be fought online, UNLESS the defender or admin decides that there is no point in fighting the battle online. Then it may be autoresolved (no manual battles).
    - The main general will be dead if he is killed in the battle. Other generals will be dead, if they have 4 or less bodyguards left at the end of battle (healing doesnt count).
    - Admitting defeat or exiting the battle before the end is prohibited, unless all the participants agree.
    - If the besieged army sallies out of the settlement on the first turn of the siege, the besieger is not allowed to use his his siege equipment (rams, ladders, towers) to assault the walls/gates. A player can only sally out once per turn with the same army.
    - If there are more armies on the same side that are not full stacks, they ll be merged.
    - During a siege battle, you are allowed to have only one unit in the central square, until you are in danger of loosing control of the square.
    - No camping by the red line.

    - When initiating a battle against other player, you must post complete information about the attacker and defending armies (all units visible. If general has a custom bodyguard, that must be mentioned/shown as well) and notify admin and defender about the battle along with sending the pre battle save, so that the decision can be made asap. If the defender doesnt respond in 24 hours, the battle can be autoresolved.
    - Since the annoucement of the battle, there are two days to play the battle ( including the 24 hours for the decision) in case the defender wishes to fight the battle online.
    - At the end of battle, you must take pics of the battle results. (if you forget to generate results file or take a pic, there is availible battle replay in temp folder)
    - The battle scenario will be created by players. Battle results are saved by players (quite easy, more details on that later). To implement the saved results into the save, an admin is needed.
    - How to to create the battle and save the results, follow this ONLINE BATTLES GUIDE

    - Every player shall announce at least one person that would be allowed to fight their battle for them in case they are busy. That can be any other player (obviously not an enemy ) , not necessarily anyone from this hotseats though, as long as as they would be ready to play.
    - All turns and final battle results will posted in this thread. However, there will be a chat room in Hotseat Hub discord for organizing the battles (whenever a battle vs player is about to happen, post the required info, save and tag the admins and the defender(s))


    Military rules
    - Non online battles vs players are autoresolved. Screenshots must be posted with: odds and result screens, mouse over the odds bar to show the ratio, the armies involved with their banners visible on the campaign map, unit card of siege unit must be visible if used to directly assault settlement (samely for online battles. You are allowed to fight manual battles vs AI.
    - No one turn peace ( although you cannot attack land of the enemy alliance, if they hasnt played their first turn yet. You can cross lands of a faction that hasnt played its 1st turn yet, if your army doesnt stand in enemy territory after its movement).
    - Armies that are defeated in battle by a player that comes after them in the turn order may not move the following turn. This is to make it fair for people who are defeated by players that come before them in the turn list. Armies standing in a settlement when defeated are excluded from this rule.
    - Night battles not allowed! (to limit amount of online battles)
    - Heroic victories in autoresolve against players are not be allowed. However, occasionally it happens player cant get any other type of victory then heroic victory. In such cases heroic victories maybe allowed, but only if the odds are higher for the attacker than 1:1 and it is a navy battle.
    - You are not allowed to post a defeat (autoresolve)
    - You are allowed to fight a naval battle only if the odds are 2:3 or more.
    - Ships cannot leave blockaded ports. No attacking ships in ports using a game bug. It's not allowed to keep units/agents protected by placing them in ships docked in a port.
    -Not allowed to besiege a settlement to deny its garrison participation in battle.
    - You are not allowed to besiege a settlement to deny enemy retreat into it.
    - You are not allowed to lure an ambushing army a tile closer to bring it in range of more of your forces.
    - Not allowed to build forts.
    - Each unit of siege equipment can be used just once in each turn to take settlement.
    Ballistas can assault wooden walls and dungeons,
    catapults can also assault basic stone walls/castles,
    and trebuchets can also assault also large stone walls and fortresses.

    - Huge stone walls, citadels and starting capitals cannot be assaulted by any unit of siege equipment, only a regular siege.

    Agent rules

    - Spies are not allowed to open Gates on players, unless there is at least 60% (for capitals, huge stone walls, citadels its 80%) chance of entering into the settlement. If a spy was has been in city for several turns, you will have to leave the settlement and enter it again. If inside the settlement is at least 1200 soldiers (720 for capitals, citadels, huge stone walls ), than a spy may not open the gates anyway. Screenshots must be provided
    - Assassins cannot sabotage and are not allowed to kill family members or generals. Assassins need at least 60% chance to kill other agents, for enemy assassins/spies just 30% is required. Screenshots must be provided
    - However, if you receive a mission from Dark Brotherhood or Morag Tong, or similar, you are allowed to assassinate the target character. (the mission picture must be show upon assassination)
    - Merchants need 60% to acquire other merchant's assets. Only allowed in your own regions, Rebel Controlled Regions, or regions you have aquired Trade rights to. Screenshots required

    - Bribed units/agents cant move for one turn. You can bribe only settlements/forts that your armies can directly march into.

    Settlement rules

    - Destruction of buildings is not allowed. Only exceptions are churches of foreign religions, or buildings that dont belong to your culture/faction and have negative effects. They can be destroyed immediately after taking a settlement
    - Not allowed to exterminate settlements.
    - Two factions can trade maximally one settlement per turn. Such settlements musnt be in war zone.



    It is also highly recomended you check my TES Guide, minimally the part about Army Upkeep

    Last edited by Jadli; May 09, 2021 at 05:45 PM.

  2. #2
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    I might break rules a bit here and play myself as well ... will see yet

    The battle conversion from the campaign and back works very well, there are only a few minor things the program cant cover.

    I will explain some more things about the process later, generally you will not have to do much/anything special, except playing online battles on time (or having a friend to play it when you cant).

    It may seem that there will be lot of online battles, but as we saw in DAC HS, thats not actually the case, so dont worry

    Pick your factions for now, so that we can see what are of the map will we end up playing at. The Rules are ofc up to debate.
    Last edited by Jadli; April 19, 2021 at 01:43 AM.

  3. #3
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    I take summerset isles

    or Empire

    or Orcs
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus
    Quote Originally Posted by Himster View Post
    The trick is to never be honest. That's what this social phenomenon is engineering: publicly conform, or else.

  4. #4
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    DP I know, but I might prefer Stormcloak rebellion? or something like the ROTQ campaign
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus
    Quote Originally Posted by Himster View Post
    The trick is to never be honest. That's what this social phenomenon is engineering: publicly conform, or else.

  5. #5

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    I would take Summerset(better exactly this faction. And maybe when I write it, I mean Talmore. I forgot how Map looks like and not very well oriented in Lore.) or BlackMarsh or Anequina or Pelletine(or something else).
    Last edited by youneuoy; April 19, 2021 at 03:00 AM.
    M2TW Engine Overhaul Project


    People always have been the foolish victims of deception and self-deception in politics, and they always will be, until they have learned to seek out the interests of some class or other behind all moral, religious, political and social phrases, declarations and promises

  6. #6

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Xamax takes the kajits(Anequina).
    M2TW Engine Overhaul Project


    People always have been the foolish victims of deception and self-deception in politics, and they always will be, until they have learned to seek out the interests of some class or other behind all moral, religious, political and social phrases, declarations and promises

  7. #7
    Isenbard's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    I like Morrowind a lot, so two factions there

    Great House Redoran, Tribes of Ashlanders

    Clan of Crowns in Hammerfell as a bonus

    Not sure about campaigns yet, I'm fine with all, doesn't really matter

  8. #8

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    I would play Daggerfall or the tribes of blackmarsh

  9. #9

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Hi
    I would prefer the main map

    My Factions would be
    1. Aldmeri
    2. Skyrim
    3. The Empire

    And as a Question. What are the Balancing Changes for Units like Cavalry? And Can we get a look at the changes to the original map? because it would change maybe my decision of the faction

    Great Work!

  10. #10

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    I like kajiits, Anequina is a priority.
    Or Great House Telvanni

    there are no campaign preferences

  11. #11
    cowcow's Avatar Ordinarius
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    (updated)

    Prefer Septim Campaign as Summerset, Sharn, or Dagger. If we end up in Morrowind I'd prefer Telvanni, that or literally any other non-dunmer faction.
    Last edited by cowcow; April 23, 2021 at 02:42 PM.

  12. #12
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Seems we got plenty enough players already, though I expect that a few more people will join

    We will start between a week or two, because as I said I first have to release the minor hotfix, and also make sure the stuff for online battles is well set

  13. #13

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    I would like the following factions:
    High Kingdom of Summerset Isles
    Kingdom of Wayrest
    Council of Thalmor
    My discord is: vaggelis#1407
    There are no campaign preferences


  14. #14

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Hi i would like to play in this HS, but i cannot instill the game until in a few days, so i can tell my factions than.
    Greetings

  15. #15

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Hi, i would like to change my faction choices of before.
    I would still prefer the Grand Campaign Map.
    My Choices would differ in different maps :')

    1. The Empire
    2. Aldmeri
    3. Skyrim Haafinger (Solitude)

  16. #16
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Alright, no problem!

  17. #17

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    And i have some questions:

    1. Do all rules count for the AI too? (Apart from the specific once in "rules")

    2. Will there be changes in the rebellion stack size for the HS or will they be normal "big"?

    3. This is no Diplo HS right?

    4. Will there be changes in Upkeep etc until the HS?

    5. Will there be changes for (just my opinion) OP units like "Hand of Almalexia" "Vivec" etc?

    Thanks for your attention :3

  18. #18
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Can we AR anything we have more than 1:2 odds in
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus
    Quote Originally Posted by Himster View Post
    The trick is to never be honest. That's what this social phenomenon is engineering: publicly conform, or else.

  19. #19
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    Quote Originally Posted by Arya210 View Post
    And i have some questions:

    1. Do all rules count for the AI too? (Apart from the specific once in "rules")

    2. Will there be changes in the rebellion stack size for the HS or will they be normal "big"?

    3. This is no Diplo HS right?

    4. Will there be changes in Upkeep etc until the HS?

    5. Will there be changes for (just my opinion) OP units like "Hand of Almalexia" "Vivec" etc?

    Thanks for your attention :3
    Hey,

    1. There will be minimal amount of AI, likely just rebels. As I wrote, based on factions you guys choose, we will be playing in one part of Tamriel (maybe someones's fation wishes will not be possible to fulfull). For several major reasons - the bigger map area = the larger and more powerful player realms = the more online battles = the hotseat gets much longer and time consuming.
    But partially yes, against AI (rebels, possibly an AI fation or two) some rules fully apply (especially as the majority of rules is enforced by players checking each other's moves). Stuff like spy percentages and so on will not be required against AI (and you dont have to mention or show pics of battles against AI, unless you want to). I later add into the rules, which parts apply against AI, to make it clear.

    I will give it a few more days, as some ppl are still flowing in, and then i announce the are we will be playing in (based on your guys choices)

    2. Not entirely sure you mean. You mean the ones that spawns when a settlement rebels? or the generic rebels that spawn outside? Im not entirely sure how to mod the size of the stacks. I think it has more to do with how large the rebellion is (how much are ppl unhappy), religion and so on

    3. as is written in the beginning of the rules, Diplomacy is fully allowed, you are free to backstab or ally anyone

    4. No, unless before releasing the hotfix I discover that some units have incorrect upkeep/price vs their tier. Its intentionally relatively high (as I assume thats what you are referring to), to make it harder for player and it also works well for us, because we need the amount of battles to be relatively small (each online battle could delay us by a day or two). Also, if you had too many armies, there would be battle of for example 2 of your armies vs 2 other enemy armies, which could be problematic, as you would need to find allies/admins etc to play the other armies (as you can control only one in an online/custom battle). Hence I will likely also set kings purse to zero, possibly also use the army upkeep script (as is written in the OP - the introductory post).

    If you noticed (or anyone) any inconsistency in upkeep/prices, definitely let me know (or any other bugs), so that I can include it in the hotfix. We will of course not be able to change things in the mod once we start-

    5. Well, no, they are meant to be OP . They are usually almost impossible to recruit, so its not a huge issue for us. Starting units/bodyguards of such type might be removed/replaced, but I will see yet (depending what factions we play) ... So that god like characters are still special in some way, not just a generic general? Up to you guys mostly, I can easily replace them for the campaign.

    Also, we could discuss whether we allow mages... But they are especially hard to get, and all factions can get access to them (via mages guild), so I would allow them. But starting mages will likely be removed from the armies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Can we AR anything we have more than 1:2 odds in
    What do you mean? I assume this question is somewhat related to when online battle takes place, and when autoresolve takes place? Whether a battle is to be fought online is primarily decided by the defender, based on whether there is a point of fighting the battle (or admin can decide as well). If he wants to fight the battle, then the battle must be fought manually, otherwise you are not allowed to fight him (unless he fails to show up for the battle in the time given). If the battle is not fought online, then you can always autoresolve.

    Based on exp from DAC online HS it worked pretty well... There wasnt actually that many battle as it may seem that there might be, because generally players dont want to spend the time and effort to fight the battle that they expect to loose... (plus combined with weak economies ofc)

    Of course quick communication (regarding the battles) will be essential, so I hope no one will have issues with that
    Last edited by Jadli; April 23, 2021 at 05:00 AM.

  20. #20

    Default Re: [Online Battles HS][TES - Unofficial Patch 2.0.2] The Art of War

    For the Second one:
    I meant the starting rebell and fort factions (there are a lot of settlements with full stack / 3/4 stacks)

    And another Question, how do we make the map smaller? Or we just play factions on one site and the other sites are not allowed to enter? (if we are 20 players we play full map? :'))

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