[HS] The Rise of the Beggar King

[Alkoholger]

I dont have a problem with stopping the hs

[keldo52]

Time jump sounds like it’d be really interesting so I’m down for that, I’m also down for continuing (to be clear I’d pefer the jump)

[blue1924]

Apologies for not being on top of this, life/work has been crazy.

First off, I want to get an answer from most (if not all) of the HS Players before we move forward with anything. So if am going to send everyone this post to look at.

Alert and I had a short discussion about this, I had an idea for a short (say 6 month) time jump, while he wanted to do something longer. My thought is that it is important to maintain the feel of this hotseat, while trying to maybe provide for some more unpredictability and interesting things that could happen.

Before I list my idea, I want to remind everyone (especially the Lannister, Tully, Stark alliance), if you guys would rather just keep playing here, thats fine with me.

But, this was my kind of first idea as top what I potential short time jump could look like:

The remainder of the Baratheon controlled Crownlands are given to Targaryen.
Stannis, Renly, and what is left of the Baratheon forces at sea escape to Braavos. Shireen remains a captive of now King Viserys.
Lannister, Tully and Stark are given options to bend of knee or become rebels of the throne.
As a reward for his work, Petyr Baelish is granted his own lands and named New Lord Paramount of the Stormlands and Lord of Storms End. A Council is developed to help Robin Arryn lead after his mother's death and Petyr's depature.
In exchange for his new Lord Paramountcy, Baelish turns over Tommen Lannister to King Viserys (Joffrey remains in Winterfell, Myrcella in the Riverlands)
Mace Tyrell dies due to his poor health. leaving New Lord Paramount of the Reach Willas a decision to make. Does he stand with his father's new King (and sister's husband), or with his wife (Sansa's) family?
Stannis Baratheon makes it known to all potential allies that he plans to return for his throne, but he needs money for a new army and fleet. (Players will be given the option to donate money to support Stannis. Once a set amount of gold has been collected, and a set amount of turns have passed, Stannis and his forces will set sail for Westeros).

Now that I have written that up, a few notes:
1) If players want a time jump, we don't need to do this idea. This was just the first amalgamation of ideas I came up with that seemed interesting to me.
2) Even though I know you guys believed and wanted to keep fighting, I feel like if we do a time jump of sorts, there needs to be significant "nerfs" to the Targaryen alliance. But, the way I am trying to do it is just to provide more interesting opportunities. I feel that leaving Targaryen directly controlling all of the Crownlands along with the Stormlands, along with all those Dothraki troops was just too strong. So that was one of my first ideas to make a new LP of the Stormlands and the Baelish idea seemed interesting to me.
EDIT 2.5) Forgot to mention. The idea if for everyone to stay in their rolls, but Arpy would be the exception if he wanted to switch to Baelish that would be fine too given the decisions he made here.
3) If you guys like this general idea and have ideas to improve it, would love to hear them.
4) This would likely require me to create a new small submod in order to set up the new faction, but really shouldn't be an issue. I could have it done probably by Monday if I get responses by tomorrow.

Really looking to get everyone's input here. Just trying to help foster a fun continuation of this game for all parties.

[AdmiralThrawn]

I'm happy to call it quits here, but if it is decided that we are continuing I like the new submod idea.

Only side note: whomever rules the Stormlands would probably need to marry Shireen to secure legitimacy. I doubt Baelish would have a problem with that (I assume the marriage would not be consumated).

[Mergor]

My opinion is that if nothing else, the time-skip is good but I have some problems with the ideas

- While I think that Targ would definitely conquer the Stormlands, these settlements (and armies) should be greatly weakened. After all, Tully and Stark will likely remain hostile, and what would make the lords there rebellious, especially after Petyr Baelish rules some of the land... Also, you can't pay mercenaries forever, and Targ mostly had those (Some Unsullied should remain)

- it should be decided beforehand if Lannister - Stark - Tully remains hostile, because if they do, most of their armies should already be concentrated on the borders at the start of game. They should also get a small advantage not in overall strenght, but positioning.

- Also, Targ alliance could be weakened if Lannister already controlled some of Tyrells lands due to an invasion, and then they would need to decide about either changing sides or trusting Targ help. This, based on my last victory is logical and would spice things up. The admin is free to check what I would have against Tyrell and what their position is. I was confident I could take their northern settlements after that victory

- There is also the question of Greyjoy and Martell. Greyjoy is the harder with the timeskip, since they basically declared war on everyone.

[Alertoverlord]

I originally intended for Aegon to rule the Stormlands while Viserys held court at King's Landing. Given that circumstances change and I have Shireeen, I'm sure something interesting could be conjured up. But to be clear, I never intended on Baelish receiving the Stormlands, while I think it would be impossible for Stannis to escape through the Narrow Sea given the previous Baratheon player throwing away naval superiority permitting Dragonstone to fall. The only feasible route to flee is heading North, plenty of lands along the Wall, and it could make the HS more interesting given the White Walker faction would only need to be turned on. It'll give Stark an excuse to have Jon Snow, a purpose for the Baratheon faction (given there are no viable settlements elsewhere) and perhaps freshen up the coming conflict.

[AdmiralThrawn]

- Also, Targ alliance could be weakened if Lannister already controlled some of Tyrells lands due to an invasion, and then they would need to decide about either changing sides or trusting Targ help. This, based on my last victory is logical and would spice things up. The admin is free to check what I would have against Tyrell and what their position is. I was confident I could take their northern settlements after that victory

I think you overestimate your hand. You killed one army, I have plenty more. Sure, you are positioned to take a couple castles, but I doubt you can hold them for long. Regardless, wars should be decided by battles, not admins.

[keldo52]

I most definitely like the idea of weakening Targ, I think the golden company was a bit excessive,

The Baelish idea seems fantastic, though I’m sure lord wise he’s going to be a bit lonely (maybe transfer a few lords from Stormlands and Targ to that faction)

I’m assuming most of the remaining Bara gens are going to either be moved to other factions, or to Braavos with Stannis

(I’m also going to get this cleared up a bit lol, if Jon hasn’t taken his vows yet then Ned would try and get him to return to winterfell to defend his children that are there: also of course he’s aware stannis might not make it back to Westeros sooooo options)

also, any battles can be decided by the admins (as-well as new positioning of armies: with input from players)

also: I am 100% for the Others showing up at some point, at least we’ll have better logic than the show

[Alkoholger]

https://mega.nz/file/xNMEWBhB#YI3Z-G...f54erlOzaVL8Jc targaryan turn

[Alertoverlord]

Where do we go from here then?

[keldo52]

Great question

[Jadli]

Well, up to blue...

[Riverknight]

[Jadli]

Well, seems blue is no longer interested in this.... I definitely am not up to to creating a custom modfied spin off hotseat as I dont have that much time.

However, if you guys want to finish the HS, I have no issue with admining that (or I assume restart would be fine as well...). I think there are still definitely many options on what to do, and we can still see some interesting diplomacy for sure. Though, some factions would likely have to be subbed by allies, or possibly turned AI. Post here if you are interested (and suggest some solutions on what to do with the missing factions/players - Gimli for sure, Baratheon could be deal with kinda easily as they are dying...)

[Mergor]

I am happy to continue, but I don't think its much fun for the others to fight me and Riverknight at this point. Its a HS that died (dying) where they (Targ alliance) have the obvious upper hand. Why change their diplomacy to risk losing? So I'd understand if we would just let this one be closed with a Targ victory.

[Jadli]

BTW, regarding the restart, there was recently released a new huge version of Fire and Blood, so possibly we could use that... one of the scenarios is fairly similar https://www.moddb.com/mods/na37972/d...reandblood-v23

[keldo52]

That could be fun, I’d be down

[AdmiralThrawn]

I think I'm done with this one, so I'd appreciate it if you could find a new Tyrell player. Personally I'm not a big fan of games with enforced RP rules, as in my experience the best RP is "emergent" from the player's own actions. Regardless, I hope you all have fun and I wish you all the best!

[Alertoverlord]

It was certainly a fun HS for while it lasted - but once a hotseat loses its motion? There's not much chance of getting things moving again. I had a great time! Despite the few turns played. Lot's of intrigue put to use and careful planning!

[Jadli]

Moved to the archive!