Ptolemy, can't build settler cities (tier 3 colonies)

[The Computer Illiterate]

Hey,

What's are the requirements for building this? The guide says waystations/garrison, the epi hellenas government, and 45% hellenic but I have those and it still won't let me build the tier 3's. I don't know what pedion agoinon is but I could build the tier 2 so I figure I have it. This only happens in some cities.

Weirdest part is I built private land and was able to build the tier 4 but not tier 3.

[benfras]

Hey,

What's are the requirements for building this? The guide says waystations/garrison, the epi hellenas government, and 45% hellenic but I have those and it still won't let me build the tier 3's. I don't know what pedion agoinon is but I could build the tier 2 so I figure I have it. This only happens in some cities.

Weirdest part is I built private land and was able to build the tier 4 but not tier 3.

Both tier 3 and tier 4 Hellenistic settler colonies have hidden geographic requirements. For example you can build a tier 3 but not reformed in Alexandria, but a reformed and not tier 3 in Memphis.

[QuintusSertorius]

The helcol_three is only constuctible in a certain number of pre-defined places. Meeting the requirements isn't enough, you have to be in the right place.

The helcol_ref is available in a broader range of places, after the late Hellenistic reform. Beware it doesn't give "better" units than the helcol_three, for those places you've constructed it already, merely different.

[Roma_Victrix]

Since Quintus already sufficiently answered your question, I'll just chime in and say it's because "you have not enough minerals."

I'll see myself out now.

[Jervaj]

The helcol_three is only constuctible in a certain number of pre-defined places. Meeting the requirements isn't enough, you have to be in the right place.

The helcol_ref is available in a broader range of places, after the late Hellenistic reform. Beware it doesn't give "better" units than the helcol_three, for those places you've constructed it already, merely different.

I would really suggest to add something in game (or if not possible in the player guide that shows this in the new patch), similarly to what we have for convertible camps. Given both are recurring questions that often are confused as bugs. This is not the first or second time that what you just said had to be clarified. Similarly for polis levels as I believe some geographical limitations were introduced too.

I think from what you said before, the places that can have helcol_three are: Alexandreia, Memphis, Antiocheia, Mysia, Lydia, Syrakousai, Pella, Thessalia, Seleukeia, Ekbatana, Susa and Persis. Rather limited indeed.



Its only tangentially related, but II actually have a question popping up as this topic comes up once again. I know I have already asked before about it, and why it is this way. In fact you answered this:

Essentially, because the helcol_three represents a very specific set of well-developed colonies that only appeared in some specific places. Mostly in Anatolia, but a handful of others besides, where there developed the greatest concentrations of Makedonian settlers. The helcol_ref is much more flexible in fitting with the alt-history idea of colonising lots of places where historically, colonies never really reached a significant size.

My new doubt is, why dont have then in those places that helcol_ref is allowed, the possibility of an helcol_three but that doesn't increase the poll of phalangitai?

Historically I know the answer is that helcol_three is basically reserved for the places that actually managed to have great makedonian colonies. My question comes more from how do we rationalize the fact that mechanically, the current implementation means that to hellenize a place further (outside of the prior mentioned regions) phalangites dissappear? Even if we assume that the extra settlement and hellenization is done by other non makedonian hellenied peoples, shouldn't there be the possibility to at least keep the same amount of phalangites that there were prior?

I know that some of these places that were limited to helcol_ref lost their phalangites polls in the lower levels too. So there is no concern there. But I meant for those that still have it in helcol_one and helcol_two, yet can't have helcol_three. Its not like the hellenistic powers ever stopped encouraging and using phalangites, even after other types of troops evolved and appeared. The Antigonids and the Seleucids basically relied on them (arguably even more than the earlier makedonian armies in some cases) until they were crushed by the romans and basically dissapeared or started their disentigration. For the Ptolemiacs basically underwent the same. The main difference is they ran out of makdonian manpower to sustain their phalanxes earlier, and that they were propped up by the Romans which delayed their downfall. Even then they went out of their way to try and still field phalanxes (with natives).

So given that background, it still feels a bit weird that one of those powers remaining strong and hellenizing further would cause phalanxes to dwindle. It seems a type of troop very tied to a kind of system/government that rose and fell with it.