President Biden's first term in office

[PointOfViewGun]

And requiring people to present proof of identification to vote is preventing them from voting ... how? it is required here in Canada. Every country that has elections requires it.

This has been pointed out countless times in this thread alone. Ignoring the realities on the ground will not make it go away. If requiring to present proof of identification comes with a cumbersome id acquisition process then yes, it prevents people from voting.

[Heathen Hammer]

I think the crux of the matter is that ID requirement isn't preventing anyone from voting, as pretty much any other activity requires ID in the first place. reasonable Impediment Declaration actually makes it easier for people with expired/inactive ID to vote. And encouraging more gun ownership is also a positive thing, the more people own guns the more truly democratic society is.

This has been pointed out countless times in this thread alone. Ignoring the realities on the ground will not make it go away. If requiring to present proof of identification comes with a cumbersome id acquisition process then yes, it prevents people from voting.

So given how acquisition of ID is neither cumbersome nor complicated, are you implying again that minorities are too inept and/or stupid to acquire an ID?

[PointOfViewGun]

I think the crux of the matter is that ID requirement isn't preventing anyone from voting, as pretty much any other activity requires ID in the first place. reasonable Impediment Declaration actually makes it easier for people with expired/inactive ID to vote. And encouraging more gun ownership is also a positive thing, the more people own guns the more truly democratic society is.

So given how acquisition of ID is neither cumbersome nor complicated, are you implying again that minorities are too inept and/or stupid to acquire an ID?

Is acquisition of ID easy and simple for everyone? Its not. Many examples have been given before. What was so confusing about understanding them?

[B. W.]

The objections to voter ID are baseless. Many of the so called "disenfranchised voters" are on welfare. How did they manage to sign up for welfare if they didn't have some sort of identification? They can make it to the welfare office but are unable to make it to the poll or even make a call, send in a mailed request for an absentee ballot? If people are that stupid it is reasonable to make the argument that they shouldn't be allowed to vote because they lack the ability to make a coherent judgment.

The others, who are presumably working or drawing unemployment, also would have to have an ID.

The arguments made by the left are convincing only to people who don't have the ability to think critically.

[Gaidin]

I think the crux of the matter is that ID requirement isn't preventing anyone from voting, as pretty much any other activity requires ID in the first place. reasonable Impediment Declaration actually makes it easier for people with expired/inactive ID to vote. And encouraging more gun ownership is also a positive thing, the more people own guns the more truly democratic society is.

I mean, getting a RealID is slightly tougher, but that just means you don't want to get on airplanes or have access to federal buildings if you choose not to take the extra step. Which is fine. But standard IDs in most states typically require the exact same documentation that Reasonable Impediment Declaration asks for. Which again, is ironic for those complaining about it.

PoVG does make the extra legit point that states in America do not allow you to bring someone to testify to your ID and vote based on that. So, Canada does make it easier.

[Heathen Hammer]

Is acquisition of ID easy and simple for everyone?

In short: yes, it is easy and simple for everyone. Getting an ID is easy for everyone, and there is a link above where they accommodate people who are a reasonable exception.

I mean, getting a RealID is slightly tougher, but that just means you don't want to get on airplanes or have access to federal buildings if you choose not to take the extra step. Which is fine. But standard IDs in most states typically require the exact same documentation that Reasonable Impediment Declaration asks for. Which again, is ironic for those complaining about it.

PoVG does make the extra legit point that states in America do not allow you to bring someone to testify to your ID and vote based on that. So, Canada does make it easier.

I think Impediment Declaration covers it a few exceptions, who have reasonable difficulty in acquiring ID.

[PointOfViewGun]

The objections to voter ID are baseless. Many of the so called "disenfranchised voters" are on welfare. How did they manage to sign up for welfare if they didn't have some sort of identification? They can make it to the welfare office but are unable to make it to the poll or even make a call, send in a mailed request for an absentee ballot? If people are that stupid it is reasonable to make the argument that they shouldn't be allowed to vote because they lack the ability to make a coherent judgment.
The others, who are presumably working or drawing unemployment, also would have to have an ID.
The arguments made by the left are convincing only to people who don't have the ability to think critically.

Since you're thinking critically, please helps us and show us statistics on the correlation between people that sign up on welfare and people that are most affected by voter id laws. Also, do show us where in the USA people are required to have an id similar to one required for voting.

Just to make it a little quicker, you don't need a photo ID to receive welfare benefits. You need a proof of identity which can basically be any document with your name. Since they're not as strict as DMV different types of names on different documents (which is the case with many people) doesn't stop people from getting their checks. Meanwhile, its a reality many people have to deal with when trying to get an ID for voting.

In short: yes, it is easy and simple for everyone. Getting an ID is easy for everyone, and there is a link above where they accommodate people who are a reasonable exception.

Your Reasonable Impediment Declaration cop out is an arbitrary criteria left at the mercy of election officials. It's requirements (which can be read here for Texas in this link that you didn't provide) carry much of the same problems that stop people from getting a proper id in the first place.

Why Millions of Americans Have No Government ID

I talked with Rethel Frank(ph). She's 84 years old. She lives in Brokaw, Wisconsin, and she has an interesting story because she typifies what many seniors are experiencing. Many of them never had birth certificates to begin with, and if they did, they were incorrectly - their names were incorrectly put onto these documents. And if that's the case, then you're not going to get an ID. They will not accept discrepancies between your birth certificate and other forms of ID that you may have, like a Social Security card and those kinds of things.

While Ms. Frank died in 2017 many are experiencing the same problems. If someone like her couldn't get an id with her real birth certificate would the election officials in Texas accept it?

[Lord Thesaurian]

I think the crux of the matter is that ID requirement isn't preventing anyone from voting, as pretty much any other activity requires ID in the first place. reasonable Impediment Declaration actually makes it easier for people with expired/inactive ID to vote. And encouraging more gun ownership is also a positive thing, the more people own guns the more truly democratic society is.

So given how acquisition of ID is neither cumbersome nor complicated, are you implying again that minorities are too inept and/or stupid to acquire an ID?

It’s been empirically proven photo ID requirements don’t reduce turnout or voter registration among any legally protected demographic, and the issue has overwhelming bipartisan support. Leftist shills, continuing to insist the requirements are difficult in any discriminatory fashion, are only exposing the fact this was never about civil rights to begin with. It’s about creating a wedge issue by which the Democrats can follow the usual “anything that negatively impacts my political power, real or imagined, is racist” playbook successfully.

I propose another common sense reform that will illustrate this point further. Lower the drinking age to 18. This will not only prove popular, it will also ensure every living, breathing eligible voter in the US will magically be able to obtain an ID despite the “burdensome” difficulties. Then, there won’t be voters without IDs for the Democrats to co opt in the first place. Speaking of which:

Three Texas House Democrats have tested positive for the coronavirus in Washington, D.C., according to Texas House Democratic Caucus leadership.

They're among nearly 60 lawmakers who fled the state last week to break quorum in the House, part of an effort to block the passage of a GOP-led elections bill. Most members are staying in the same hotel.

One member found out about their positive test result late Friday evening, but they did not have symptoms, caucus officials said. All House lawmakers were alerted and received a rapid test immediately after the member's positive result.

https://news.yahoo.com/3-texas-democ...175929854.html

Bravely jet-setting around to spread Covid in the name of Democracy.

Take a peek at Texas' requirement. Then have a look at the photograph restrictions (the stumbling block) and from there move on to the 'Reasonable Impediment Declaration'. Then take a guess who will be affected by that and may simply not bother.

Ok, who? Appealing to people’s ability to be lazy doesn’t seem relevant. How hard is it to check a box that affirms one of the following reasons:

Lack of transportation
Disability or illness
Lack of birth certificate or other documents needed to obtain acceptable form of photo ID
Work schedule
Family responsibilities
Lost or stolen identification
Acceptable form of photo ID applied for but not received

Apparently legally owning a gun gets you to vote easily in Texas. Which simply re-enforces my previous observation albeit from the opposing angle. Pending legislation that encourages more gun ownership seems to be a convenient coincidence

What are you implying? You have to show government issued photo ID to legally buy a gun from a FFL dealer in Texas, and it’s illegal to sell to someone under 18.

[PointOfViewGun]

Unfortunately for some, "legally protected demographic" doesn't cover the entirety of citizens of USA.

[Lord Thesaurian]

Unfortunately for some, "legally protected demographic" doesn't cover the entirety of citizens of USA.

We agree it isn’t a civil rights issue, then. And anyway, who?

[PointOfViewGun]

We agree it isn’t a civil rights issue, then. And anyway, who?

How do we agree that it isn't a civil rights issue? Even Republicans themselves admit that the laws are made because they think it will help them in the election, not because its the right and just thing to do.

[Lord Thesaurian]

How do we agree that it isn't a civil rights issue? Even Republicans themselves admit that the laws are made because they think it will help them in the election, not because its the right and just thing to do.

You implied the issue is related to people for whom this is not a question of race, gender, etc. So who?

[PointOfViewGun]

You implied the issue is related to people for whom this is not a question of race, gender, etc. So who?

Where did I imply that?

[Lord Thesaurian]

Unfortunately for some, "legally protected demographic" doesn't cover the entirety of citizens of USA.

Here. Unless you don’t know what “legally protected demographic” means. In any case, for the third time, who?

[B. W.]

Since you're thinking critically, please helps us and show us statistics on the correlation between people that sign up on welfare and people that are most affected by voter id laws. Also, do show us where in the USA people are required to have an id similar to one required for voting.

Just to make it a little quicker, you don't need a photo ID to receive welfare benefits. You need a proof of identity which can basically be any document with your name. Since they're not as strict as DMV different types of names on different documents (which is the case with many people) doesn't stop people from getting their checks. Meanwhile, its a reality many people have to deal with when trying to get an ID for voting.




Your Reasonable Impediment Declaration cop out is an arbitrary criteria left at the mercy of election officials. It's requirements (which can be read here for Texas in this link that you didn't provide) carry much of the same problems that stop people from getting a proper id in the first place.

You don't need a photo ID to vote in Texas.

Why Millions of Americans Have No Government ID


While Ms. Frank died in 2017 many are experiencing the same problems. If someone like her couldn't get an id with her real birth certificate would the election officials in Texas accept it?

This is just too funny. So she waits until she's 84 to realize she can't get an ID? Seriously? Presenting the most obscure case to make your point doesn't carry any weight at all.

I'm a fairly old guy and I live in Texas. I've only known one person who didn't have a birth certificate and didn't know how old he was. He died 30 years ago.

Now if you're talking about illegals, that's a different story. Many of them don't have a birth certificate and don't know how old they are. That just shows how different things are in Central and South America. Those people shouldn't be voting anyway, which has a lot to do with why the Dems are going on about the voter ID laws. They want the illegals to vote. That's a fact.

[PointOfViewGun]

Here. Unless you don’t know what “legally protected demographic” means. In any case, for the third time, who?

You do realize that there is no logic in what you're saying? What I said there implies the exact opposite. Why try to alter what people say at such basic level if your own position is so full of merit?

You don't need a photo ID to vote in Texas.
This is just too funny. So she waits until she's 84 to realize she can't get an ID? Seriously? Presenting the most obscure case to make your point doesn't carry any weight at all.
I'm a fairly old guy and I live in Texas. I've only known one person who didn't have a birth certificate and didn't know how old he was. He died 30 years ago.
Now if you're talking about illegals, that's a different story. Many of them don't have a birth certificate and don't know how old they are. That just shows how different things are in Central and South America. Those people shouldn't be voting anyway, which has a lot to do with why the Dems are going on about the voter ID laws. They want the illegals to vote. That's a fact.

Yeah, you do need a photo ID in Texas for voting... You seem to be deliberately ignoring facts of the matter to create a case for yourself to defend. Many old people simply don't have their birth certificates available. Many that do have don't have the exact same name on them. Sometimes even a maiden surname difference stops them from getting the id they asked for. We're talking about citizens of USA. Just because you had it easy at the DMV doesn't mean its easy for everyone. Then there is the economic cost of getting such an id.

[Lord Thesaurian]

You do realize that there is no logic in what you're saying? What I said there implies the exact opposite. Why try to alter what people say at such basic level if your own position is so full of merit?

Uh huh. So who then?

Yeah, you do need a photo ID in Texas for voting... You seem to be deliberately ignoring facts of the matter to create a case for yourself to defend. Many old people simply don't have their birth certificates available. Many that do have don't have the exact same name on them. Sometimes even a maiden surname difference stops them from getting the id they asked for. We're talking about citizens of USA. Just because you had it easy at the DMV doesn't mean its easy for everyone. Then there is the economic cost of getting such an id.

Your speculation has been undermined by the fact voter ID hasn’t negatively impacted voter turnout or registration, according to the previously cited study. So again, who?

[Pontifex Maximus]

Unfortunately for some, "legally protected demographic" doesn't cover the entirety of citizens of USA.

But I digress, please defend why you think ethnic minorities are either too poor or stupid to afford a free state issued ID card?
I'll go ahead and add my favorite counter to totally laughable and simplistic arguments you've raised in that if voting is one of muh fundamental rights, so is gun ownership. Should I be able to buy a gun if I have no ID? Come on now, at least bride logically consistent. I know you won't be.

[PointOfViewGun]

Uh huh. So who then?
Your speculation has been undermined by the fact voter ID hasn’t negatively impacted voter turnout or registration, according to the previously cited study. So again, who?

The Harvard study you linked to earlier? With the following part of the study's abstract absent from your quote?

However, the likelihood that non-white voters were contacted by a campaign increases by 5.4 percentage points, suggesting that parties’ mobilization might have offset modest effects of the laws on the participation of ethnic minorities. Finally, strict ID requirements have no effect on fraud – actual or perceived. Overall, our findings suggest that efforts to improve elections may be better directed at other reforms.

I don't know how one can conclude from raw numbers that the new requirements had no effect since they could not do a check at individual level. However, something tells me you would not use this study to argue for the trivialness of new voter id bills. Yet, whether these bills actually manage to hurt voter turnout doesn't really matter to me. The fact that they're made for that purpose does.

[Pontifex Maximus]

Why do you think black people are too stupid to know how to get free IDs? Honestly curious. The thought never crossed my mind at all. I think black people are just as smart as white people.