A few observations regarding realism for Imperial Destroyer 6.3

[Axland]

but the ai needs to now how to use cavalry right , and that's it and can't you make opening campaign have money ?

I'm afraid I'm totally ignorant about how to manipulate the AI behaviour.

As for the money maybe something can be done, but I must consider the financial state of the nations in 1700. Research that needs some time.

But beyond that I'm revising the whole list of units, found inconsistencies around weapons, attack and defence stats and reloading skills. As an example, the rifles were far more precise than the flintlock muskets, but very slow to recharge. That means, I guess, the units with rifles must be penalized in the reload skill table.

But these modifications need at least one day of work...

[Axland]

I'm afraid I'm totally ignorant about how to manipulate the AI behaviour.

As for the money maybe something can be done, but I must consider the financial state of the nations in 1700. Research that needs some time.

But beyond that I'm revising the whole list of units, found inconsistencies around weapons, attack and defence stats and reloading skills. As an example, the rifles were far more precise than the flintlock muskets, but very slow to recharge. That means, I guess, the units with rifles must be penalized in the reload skill table.

But these modifications need at least one day of work...

Another example of how important is to balance correctly these stats come to my mind remembering the battle of Minden where allied infantry attacked three lines of cavalry. That means cavalry is good in offense but bad in defence, unlike the infantry...

[Axland]

Further tests are in course.

I'm revising the stats of all units in the mod, is a bit long to explain the changes and why. When I'm finished I will post a complete report with details. For the moment I only point that morale, armor, ammo, aim and reload skills are revised. Indians were too much buffed, also the russians. Cavalry firing was too much accurate and fast, artillery was not very coherent with calibers, accuracy and reload times. Elite guards stats were almost non human. I must note the cost of guards is not directly related with their quality, of course is well above average, but not twice as good in every stat. So, now the units tends to have less differences, specially in terms of armour because except some units with plate or mail there is no armour at all.

[Axland]

Further tests are in course.

I'm revising the stats of all units in the mod, is a bit long to explain the changes and why. When I'm finished I will post a complete report with details. For the moment I only point that morale, armor, ammo, aim and reload skills are revised. Indians were too much buffed, also the russians. Cavalry firing was too much accurate and fast, artillery was not very coherent with calibers, accuracy and reload times. Elite guards stats were almost non human. I must note the cost of guards is not directly related with their quality, of course is well above average, but not twice as good in every stat. So, now the units tends to have less differences, specially in terms of armour because except some units with plate or mail there is no armour at all.

I tried to modify the Projectile Tables in the BSM pack, but it was impossible (error when opening). So, I'm forced to modify the reload and accuracy stats for every unit in the game. For example, 3lbs cannons were not very accurate but with high rate of fire, around 8 shots per min. On the other extreme, 24Lbs cannons were much more accurate, but their rate of fire was also much lower, 1 shot per min. Also the type of ammo modifies the rate, but I cannot edit this trait in Units Stats. Another interesting example are sackers and demi-cannons, because their lower quality were less accurate than their "standardized" counterparts. Same history with rifles and smoothbore flintlocks. Light infantry et alli used frequently shortened flintlocks to be less encumbering and this also boost the reload times. On the contrary rifles are a different beast, their rate of fire is less than half of the rest, that's why is only used by so few units.

Well, more work to do.

[Munchausen]

I've gotten to personally modify the game files for my liking :

1. Increasing all the stats for each experience level for a unit, each upper level being marginally better than the previous with a big increase on 6th xp level (veterans) and 9th xp level (master elite). Experience always beats exuberance. For balancing reasons, it's now far more difficult to level up units thus having these 'master elites' is now a true sight to behold.

2. Making generals and admirals truly matter - i've added multiple boni to traits; for example the C_General_Good_Field_Commander_5 now provides chance to recover battle casualties, ambush ability, increase in all unit stas (melee, defence, charge, reload, accuracy and morale), decrease the risk of being assassinated , decrease the risk of premature/sudden death, increase the line of sight and lastly increase the campaign moving points. There's a change to spawn Bonaparte as a general for France (historic_characters tables) and he has this trait -- wanted to make his truly memorable, not so much for when I play as but against him or any other top tier leaders of men.

+Same for most high level traits and ancillaries for all agents - monarchs and ministers included - a good monarch may actually prevent a revolution, a prime minister will help prevent coalitions of all Europe against your ambitions, a chief of staff will allow for a greater land army (decrease recruitment and upkeep costs), same with a lord first admiral and so on. Nice boni became good, good became great. I get to contend with far greater enemies on the map now - both on land and on the sea because of those increases.

3. Increased the trigger chances for ancillaries; now I get to see Grizzly Adams, Actress, Personal Physician, Spymaster, Pamphleteer and all the other far more often.
+Successfully incorporated dormant traits like C_Honorable_Service (these provide management boni to ministers). It's actually a title of nobility ranging from knighthood to princedom for successful ministers.


4. I've changed the national specific traits : C_French_Elan_3 now provides a melee bonus at level 3, C_General_Prussian_Blue a reloading boni (might change it or add an infantry recruitment experience bonus for said prussians) and so on.

+ Made certain nations have a tendency for spawning specific kind of generals : the swedes will tend to be good attacking generals, the french - artillery general, the dutch will have their admirals go faster between the theaters etc. Following this change, i've futher modified the national roaster to match this - russians will have greater battalion size all around but worse statistics (this equals with the other nations for elite units in terms of unit size and stats), the british will have better accuracy on ships (giving them an advantage on ai vs ai naval engagements thus provinding a better chance GB will actually dominate the seas), winged hussars have the best charge of european cavalry yet are limited in number (on the campaign map), the french will sport more cannons in an artillery regiment and bigger cannons on ships and so on.

5. Battle statistics changes are mostly regarding accuracy (decreased it severely) and reloading speeds (increased them significantly). I've chosen the more arcade ammo count, the 1000 bullets from Imperial Destroyer 6.2. This way, line infantry will sit and fire and each other for whole minutes, slowly chipping each other whilst giving the chance for flanking manuevers, concentration of forces and artillery barrages etc.

6. I really like naval battles thus I modified the ships as well - bigger is now better in terms of firepower, resilience and auto_resolve results. The smaller vessels have increased reloading speeds, higher top speeds and generally better maneuverability - a pack of hyenas (frigates) albeit a large one may bring down an over 1st rate ship of the line. But watch out when the lion roars

+To better represent the barbary states, i've artificially inflated the xebec accuracy stat (auto_resolve advantage) thus making them quite fierce in the Mediterranean until civilized nations will sport 4th and 3rd ships of the line.

+ Decreased costs of recruitment and upkeep for naval units through tech and naval minister -- I get to see far greater and stronger fleets all around. The seas get quite terrifying yet a whole lot of glory and booty awaits the daring.

+ I've seen and somewhat implemented an idea found in the forum about diverse navies - the british having the best crew overall, the french having bigger guns to the points of unreliability on their 3rd rates for instance etc. Arguably, this is quite arcade but I really enjoy playing the russians and having greater armor on my ships even at the expense of maneuverability, really blitzing through with the frenchies or being the master of the seas with HMS Victory (best stats overall in the game, i sinked a whole french fleet with just it - autoresolve said it's madness, HMS said Victory )

+ Replaced the carronde frigate with a 3rd ship of the line with same stats except added carronades : same auto resolve advantage yet playing it right on the battle 'sea' it obliterates almost all opposition when positioning them close to other vessels -- now they truly have greater firepower than HMS Victory (as stated in the on campaign description). It's great seeing them massacre even larger vessels if one manages to get in close.

If this gets interest, I will make a thread and provide the files and specific changes to them.
All in all, this mod is great and I really appreciate it for the hours of fun it provided; as with any grand strategy game having a story line going, some constraining house rules will truly bring the best of one's experience. Imagination rules the world, to quote the aforementioned historical figure.

[Looser General]

Poland are most non realistic. Old version had good polish modmod.

[Sir_Aggelos_GR]

I've gotten to personally modify the game files for my liking :

1. Increasing all the stats for each experience level for a unit, each upper level being marginally better than the previous with a big increase on 6th xp level (veterans) and 9th xp level (master elite). Experience always beats exuberance. For balancing reasons, it's now far more difficult to level up units thus having these 'master elites' is now a true sight to behold.

2. Making generals and admirals truly matter - i've added multiple boni to traits; for example the C_General_Good_Field_Commander_5 now provides chance to recover battle casualties, ambush ability, increase in all unit stas (melee, defence, charge, reload, accuracy and morale), decrease the risk of being assassinated , decrease the risk of premature/sudden death, increase the line of sight and lastly increase the campaign moving points. There's a change to spawn Bonaparte as a general for France (historic_characters tables) and he has this trait -- wanted to make his truly memorable, not so much for when I play as but against him or any other top tier leaders of men.

+Same for most high level traits and ancillaries for all agents - monarchs and ministers included - a good monarch may actually prevent a revolution, a prime minister will help prevent coalitions of all Europe against your ambitions, a chief of staff will allow for a greater land army (decrease recruitment and upkeep costs), same with a lord first admiral and so on. Nice boni became good, good became great. I get to contend with far greater enemies on the map now - both on land and on the sea because of those increases.

3. Increased the trigger chances for ancillaries; now I get to see Grizzly Adams, Actress, Personal Physician, Spymaster, Pamphleteer and all the other far more often.
+Successfully incorporated dormant traits like C_Honorable_Service (these provide management boni to ministers). It's actually a title of nobility ranging from knighthood to princedom for successful ministers.


4. I've changed the national specific traits : C_French_Elan_3 now provides a melee bonus at level 3, C_General_Prussian_Blue a reloading boni (might change it or add an infantry recruitment experience bonus for said prussians) and so on.

+ Made certain nations have a tendency for spawning specific kind of generals : the swedes will tend to be good attacking generals, the french - artillery general, the dutch will have their admirals go faster between the theaters etc. Following this change, i've futher modified the national roaster to match this - russians will have greater battalion size all around but worse statistics (this equals with the other nations for elite units in terms of unit size and stats), the british will have better accuracy on ships (giving them an advantage on ai vs ai naval engagements thus provinding a better chance GB will actually dominate the seas), winged hussars have the best charge of european cavalry yet are limited in number (on the campaign map), the french will sport more cannons in an artillery regiment and bigger cannons on ships and so on.

5. Battle statistics changes are mostly regarding accuracy (decreased it severely) and reloading speeds (increased them significantly). I've chosen the more arcade ammo count, the 1000 bullets from Imperial Destroyer 6.2. This way, line infantry will sit and fire and each other for whole minutes, slowly chipping each other whilst giving the chance for flanking manuevers, concentration of forces and artillery barrages etc.

6. I really like naval battles thus I modified the ships as well - bigger is now better in terms of firepower, resilience and auto_resolve results. The smaller vessels have increased reloading speeds, higher top speeds and generally better maneuverability - a pack of hyenas (frigates) albeit a large one may bring down an over 1st rate ship of the line. But watch out when the lion roars

+To better represent the barbary states, i've artificially inflated the xebec accuracy stat (auto_resolve advantage) thus making them quite fierce in the Mediterranean until civilized nations will sport 4th and 3rd ships of the line.

+ Decreased costs of recruitment and upkeep for naval units through tech and naval minister -- I get to see far greater and stronger fleets all around. The seas get quite terrifying yet a whole lot of glory and booty awaits the daring.

+ I've seen and somewhat implemented an idea found in the forum about diverse navies - the british having the best crew overall, the french having bigger guns to the points of unreliability on their 3rd rates for instance etc. Arguably, this is quite arcade but I really enjoy playing the russians and having greater armor on my ships even at the expense of maneuverability, really blitzing through with the frenchies or being the master of the seas with HMS Victory (best stats overall in the game, i sinked a whole french fleet with just it - autoresolve said it's madness, HMS said Victory )

+ Replaced the carronde frigate with a 3rd ship of the line with same stats except added carronades : same auto resolve advantage yet playing it right on the battle 'sea' it obliterates almost all opposition when positioning them close to other vessels -- now they truly have greater firepower than HMS Victory (as stated in the on campaign description). It's great seeing them massacre even larger vessels if one manages to get in close.

If this gets interest, I will make a thread and provide the files and specific changes to them.
All in all, this mod is great and I really appreciate it for the hours of fun it provided; as with any grand strategy game having a story line going, some constraining house rules will truly bring the best of one's experience. Imagination rules the world, to quote the aforementioned historical figure.

Sound as good proposals

[coolgit]

I tried to modify the Projectile Tables in the BSM pack, but it was impossible (error when opening).

This problem exist in Darthmod too. I have fixed it awhile ago and fixed the BSM, ID too.

Open PFM and extract the file. (not TSV)
Open file in Notepad ++ and view in hex and scroll to the bottom.
You will see i m p a c t _ l i g h t €. The € is wrong.
69 20 6d 20 70 20 61 20 63 20 74 20 5f 20 6c 20 69 20 67 20 68 20 74 20 80 change the last 2 number 80 to 00 like this
69 20 6d 20 70 20 61 20 63 20 74 20 5f 20 6c 20 69 20 67 20 68 20 74 20 00 and save the file.

Go to PFM add file and it will work.

The game (Dartmod) for me no longer crashes in 3 months using different factions and conquering every nations.

A query.

Is the Lord_buildings.pack in use? It has URR_building_faction_variants ?

The pack file wouldn't open. To fix it.

Open pack file use hex editor.
first 4 number groups 50 46 48 4F - the 4F is capital letter O which is wrong.
replace 4F with 30 which numerical 0 as in when extracted as TSV the table is version 0.
Save new file and it will work.

[Axland]

Hello everyone!

I was playing with mods in my Skyrim last months, but I have still to finish this cumbersome revision.

Tonight I marked with false moral (numbers in arithmetic order) ALL the land units in the tables to identify which units are used by the mod. In total around 2.000 - 2.500 lines...
I found that the units are linked to different lists and some are common for some factions. That mean I must note the number for every unit ingame and adjust the stats when located. I'm really scared.

[Axland]

This problem exist in Darthmod too. I have fixed it awhile ago and fixed the BSM, ID too.

Open PFM and extract the file. (not TSV)
Open file in Notepad ++ and view in hex and scroll to the bottom.
You will see i m p a c t _ l i g h t €. The € is wrong.
69 20 6d 20 70 20 61 20 63 20 74 20 5f 20 6c 20 69 20 67 20 68 20 74 20 80 change the last 2 number 80 to 00 like this
69 20 6d 20 70 20 61 20 63 20 74 20 5f 20 6c 20 69 20 67 20 68 20 74 20 00 and save the file.

Go to PFM add file and it will work.

The game (Dartmod) for me no longer crashes in 3 months using different factions and conquering every nations.

A query.

Is the Lord_buildings.pack in use? It has URR_building_faction_variants ?

The pack file wouldn't open. To fix it.

Open pack file use hex editor.
first 4 number groups 50 46 48 4F - the 4F is capital letter O which is wrong.
replace 4F with 30 which numerical 0 as in when extracted as TSV the table is version 0.
Save new file and it will work.

I tried, but failed to extract.

[Axland]

Well, to the matter...


SEA


I revised only slightly the naval combat, because my main problem is the rhythm of battles, and I found the culprit. Is not the speed of the ships, which are strangely accurate, but the acceleration. Empire deals with acceleration like if the ships where combustion powered, and any knowing a little about sail navigation can conclude that is not the case. Deploying and specially folding sails is not instantaneous. And, after that, the ship needs some time to get full speed. So I nerfed acceleration to simulate these operations.


Reminder I must took a look on the range of cannons because heavy cannons have longer range and accuracy... that's why 1st class was created.


Note that the plus speed for french is related with reforms after 7 Years War, when new sleeker designs where introduced.


LAND


I have here my reference proposal for the "standard" stats in european armies. They are more, of course and I will comment some below.





MEA: Melee Attack
CHAR: Charge
AIM: Aim
REL: reload Speed
MOR: Morale


As you can see I nerfed everything punishing specially elite units. Why? Well the quality of the unit is not related with tehir class or name, but the training and war experience. Elite units were composed mainly by nobility, that explains why were so expensive. One exemple is the French Household, with a top notch Swiss Guard and a bit lacking Gardes Françaises. In fact the stats of the Gardes must be compared to standard swiss line infantry. So this guide is for the average unit, mostly useful for the majority of units, only some exceptions for whatever reason:


Prussia and England had money to give a proper training to the troops. +5 to aim and reload for all infantry units.
German and Italian states, except Saxony and Hannover, were lacking in all senses, so -1 moral applied.
French and Austrian artillery had the best plannings tendent to the standarization of this branch. +5 AIM/REL for late units.


Imperial Destroyer detach some line units with their regimental name. A bit of bonus applied, but mostly morale. They have pretty uniforms, you pay for them.


I have a problem with swedish Varvade units, because if fact were the regular units, not milita. The Indelta was an special way to recruit line regiments.


Another problem I have is with polish units. I know they had a good cavalry but not much more. Guess here the main problem is the lack of standarization.


Also the experience requirements to upgrade chevrons is changed. Now first steps are easy because green units can adquire some degree of battle readiness easily, but only very veteran units can reach the top tiers.


Guess the stats for melee defence are the sum of their number plus the armor of the units. Empire applies an arbitrary number to each unit which that make no sense at all. I only add armor if the unit is using shields or armor like Indian units. Horses because their natural robustness have 2, 3 and 4 armor each type.


In relation to the AIM/REL stats I must note that cavalry has severely nerfed because no training can overcome the difficulty of shooting and reloading when mounted. Rifles have an special stat where reloading is halved but substantially increased accuracy, like real life. Light infantry et alli use short bore muskets, that increases reloading times, but also their aim is better because specific training (+5/+5).


Cavalry tends to ease differences. Light cavalry is quite similar to medium cavalry because dragoons were the main unit and light was more specialist unit. Heavy cavalry and Guards are the top tiers but no so far. In fact some elite units were light or medium horses. British dragoons are problematic because despite their name were in fact line/household cavalry downgraded because money.


Ottoman Monster Gun. I've not tested Their 64Lb, but don't expect more than some shots for the battle.


Ammo. There is a debate because more ammo reduces the possibility of historical reproduction of battles where charges suited 2-3 shots. But because some battles were not linear, like using trenches or natural defenses (hello Von Daun) or in colonial scenarios I firmly believe we must respect historic numbers. 20 shots for regular infantry and cavalry, 40 for shooters (In fact some austrian grenzers carried 80!). Artillery varies wildly because disparity in calibers.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------


My main concern is that I need to check hundreds of units scattered in more than 60 lists and I have no idea how much time this can require, but I suspect several days...

[Axland]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1HSB...ew?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wA-...ew?usp=sharing

Imperial Destroyer changes 06-24-2021

Greetings to everyone.
After trying to make the changes to my tastes, I realized not having time nor desire to deep revision. But I opted to make the most important changes which the player will feel immediately.

-Armour: removed from all units except cuirassers and old fashioned units in plate or mail armor. As a passive substitute of melée defence is an unrealistic buff to elite units, if needed new stats of melée defense would be introduced.
-Ammo: 20 shots infantry and cavalry. 40 shots light and sharpshooter units. 50 shots artillery. Tested in long battles, units, can run out of ammunition.
-Unit Morale: Standard Russian, British and Prussian line infantry morale reduced from 8 to 7. Reduced price accordingly, except for the british. Their training is reflected in aim/reload stats.
-Morale: Changed modifiers for several factors, mainly because loses, but also fatigue. Green troops will break easily. Battle overall loses reduced considerably, the destruction of an army is much more difficult.
-Fatigue: More severe punishment for tired troops. Walking actually tire troops, but very mildly.
-Ships: Reduced acceleration and speed in some cases, specially in lighter ships.

Notes:
The overall increase of moral penalties by loses try to reflect the reality of greener recruits, so until an unit gains some chevrons it is unwise to try frontal attacks or sustain fire without flank support. Normally, the unit breaking will be not recovered for the rest of the battle.
The morale and fatigue changes make harder to be in attack, in contested battles is advised to be in defensive unless you are a true genius.
The ammo can be spent in a battle, but normally are not that long as one side will break. Persecution is mandatory because with less casualties will be more difficult to wipe an enemy stack.
The mod was tested with the following options: Increased income (for larger battles), Less accurate shots (for less casualties), Square formation (cavalry is deadly in rear charges), Religion conversion (without churches or agents), All diplomatic options (exchange of regions was a feature of XVIIIth diplomacy)

[Mr.Fable]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1HSB...ew?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wA-...ew?usp=sharing

Imperial Destroyer changes 06-24-2021

Greetings to everyone.
After trying to make the changes to my tastes, I realized not having time nor desire to deep revision. But I opted to make the most important changes which the player will feel immediately.

-Armour: removed from all units except cuirassers and old fashioned units in plate or mail armor. As a passive substitute of melée defence is an unrealistic buff to elite units, if needed new stats of melée defense would be introduced.
-Ammo: 20 shots infantry and cavalry. 40 shots light and sharpshooter units. 50 shots artillery. Tested in long battles, units, can run out of ammunition.
-Unit Morale: Standard Russian, British and Prussian line infantry morale reduced from 8 to 7. Reduced price accordingly, except for the british. Their training is reflected in aim/reload stats.
-Morale: Changed modifiers for several factors, mainly because loses, but also fatigue. Green troops will break easily. Battle overall loses reduced considerably, the destruction of an army is much more difficult.
-Fatigue: More severe punishment for tired troops. Walking actually tire troops, but very mildly.
-Ships: Reduced acceleration and speed in some cases, specially in lighter ships.

Notes:
The overall increase of moral penalties by loses try to reflect the reality of greener recruits, so until an unit gains some chevrons it is unwise to try frontal attacks or sustain fire without flank support. Normally, the unit breaking will be not recovered for the rest of the battle.
The morale and fatigue changes make harder to be in attack, in contested battles is advised to be in defensive unless you are a true genius.
The ammo can be spent in a battle, but normally are not that long as one side will break. Persecution is mandatory because with less casualties will be more difficult to wipe an enemy stack.
The mod was tested with the following options: Increased income (for larger battles), Less accurate shots (for less casualties), Square formation (cavalry is deadly in rear charges), Religion conversion (without churches or agents), All diplomatic options (exchange of regions was a feature of XVIIIth diplomacy)

Hi, love the idea of the changes you've made, the vanilla mod is a bit too gamey imo and these changes you made sound great and much more realistic. But your two links here do not seem to work? Are there back ups somewhere?

[Sir_Aggelos_GR]

reupload the files

[Axland]

reupload the files

Ops, sorry, I was in absence all these months!

https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...d0?usp=sharing