Pikemen should not be able to drop their pikes in close combat

**chris2005** · October 20, 2020, 10:04 AM

Hi there,

Pikemen should not be able to 'drop' (deploy) their pikes in close combat. Is there a mod that does this for DEI?

Regards,
Chris

**Bestort1** · October 20, 2020, 12:00 PM

really,it interests me too: thumbsup2

**KAM 2150** · October 20, 2020, 02:41 PM

Why shouldn't they? This is exactly what they did, you cant do much with a 6 meter pike when someone is 1 meter away from you. Sources are pretty clear on that part, as they would draw swords at that point. You might be mixing it a bit with XV-XVIII pikemen, who used much shorter pikes and used them also a bit closer but they also carried swords as a backup weapon.

If you use my Alternative Pike Phalanx submod, they will have pikes at all times but they lose ability to attack at range.

**chris2005** · October 25, 2020, 06:41 AM

No I mean they should not be able to 'drop' them to engage the enemy with. Or in other words: They should not be able to use them if they are engaged before they have formed up their phalanx.

**KAM 2150** · October 25, 2020, 02:10 PM

Oh that is doable but would not work properly.

You can make it so that when phalanx is in combat, it can't form but the way AI handles deploying it and such...well if would make fighting them even easier then now.

**chris2005** · October 26, 2020, 10:49 AM

You think it is easy to fight them the way it works now?! I definitely disagree on that.

Nevertheless, it is not realistic either ...

**chris2005** · October 26, 2020, 10:54 AM

Pikemen run as fast as Hastati for instance and you need to charge them from the rear forever ...

**chris2005** · October 26, 2020, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by KAM 2150

This is exactly what they did, you cant do much with a 6 meter pike when someone is 1 meter away from you. Sources are pretty clear on that part, as they would draw swords at that point.

Here you agree that they should not be able to deploy their pikes in close combat

**PrimoTw** · October 26, 2020, 12:19 PM

No they dont. Play on Normal/Normal, they are very good defensive units frontally, crumble when charged from rear and have abysmal speed at least in pike formation.

**KAM 2150** · October 27, 2020, 09:05 AM

Pikemen are slower than hastati as hastati are 3 speed, pikes are 2 speed and when deployed in phalanx they go even below 2 speed. Only elite pikes get what looks like 3 speed but is actually 2.5 but game rounds it up. Once they enable phalanx, their speed also goes down.

If you play on normal, they get destroyed easily by rear charge or even if you just leave melee unit at their back.

Like AI phalanx is literally easiest non levy units to counter as a player.