sumskilz,
No matter how deep you go into what is written there are those that still will never accept the true meaning and why is also there in what is written.
sumskilz,
No matter how deep you go into what is written there are those that still will never accept the true meaning and why is also there in what is written.
Old chap you're calling me the son of Satan? I'm sad your argument has devolved to name calling. My father was actually a man known for his honesty and integrity, indeed Her Majesty declared him a most trusty servant. Its clear to me you know as little of him as you seem to know of scripture.
Your post hasn't managed to resolve the question of how the serpent of the garden is both Satan and Satan's son. You're talking about Satan and Satan's son, and somehow both share the "Spirit of Satan", you seem to be straying blasphemously close to some sort of cruel mockery of the Trinity? I have never heard of any Christian daring to utter such a thing.
Yes its an interesting point for an interesting debate, although less relevant for those who adhere to the view the Authorised Edition is the inerrant word of God. That's the text under discussion here.
I do agree many passages in the KJV are far from perfect translations.
Last edited by Cyclops; April 23, 2022 at 06:01 AM.
Jatte lambastes Calico Rat
Makes sense for the kind of dualism he ascribes toYou're talking about Satan and Satan's son, and somehow both share the "Spirit of Satan", you seem to be straying blasphemously close to some sort of cruel mockery of the Trinity?
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
Cyclops,
My Father is God and your father is Satan is what the Bible teaches of our differences. Why that is, is because all creation was put under the curse of sin at the fall of Adam and Eve. That you don't believe nor accept that is because of your position before God, not because basics made it up nor enjoys telling you. If you can read anywhere that Jesus Christ did not die on a cross for the sins of all them that He died for then that is not a Bible and so cannot be the inerrant word of God.
Your dad is bigger than my dad? That's a childish schoolyard comeback, please lift the tone.
You've stated the serpent of Eden is Satan but also the son of Satan. Which is it? I've asked but I have not received an answer. Its important not to misrepresent scripture.
As for liars being the sons of Satan, Matthew 12:34 has Jesus calling the Pharisees "O generation of vipers", no mention of Satan once again, not even the same word as the one used for the serpent in Eden. This is plainly nothing to do with Satan.
As for your curse, I'll remind you again, the word "sin" does not appear in the Eden narrative.
I don't take offence at the silly jibes about my father being Satan, its not as though they are serious statements from an authoritative source.
Jatte lambastes Calico Rat
And that bothers you not at all to type the illogical nature of it?My Father is God and your father is Satan is what the Bible teaches of our differences. Why that is, is because all creation was put under the curse of sin at the fall of Adam and Eve.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
Cyclops,
Yes, God the Father is bigger than anyone or anything.
Whether the serpent was just a serpent yet acting for Satan or was actually Satan himself is immaterial because both have the same objectives from what we read. Scripture is therefore not being misrepresented at all.
As for Jesus' remarks to some Jews try John 8:44.
Sin is an immoral act considered to be a transgression against divine law.
"a sin in the eyes of God" What Adam and Eve did was a sin and that sin was passed on to all creation. Sin doesn't appear in the narrative but disobedience and disbelief do and since they were what led them to be cast out of the garden the word easily applies.
The Authoritive source is the Gospel of Jesus Christ our Creator and God.
Kinda missed him in the OT last I read it. It almost like you are following a faith made up by Paul and Augustine.Jesus Christ our Creator and God
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
You have now given three versions of the Serpent: 1. Serpent is Satan 2. Serpent is Satan's Son 3. "Its Immaterial". You really don't seem to be able to keep your story straight. If its immaterial if the serpent is Satan doesn't that have implications for your statement that its a prediction about Jesus crushing Satan? It really seems as though your ideas about God don't match scripture at all.
Jatte lambastes Calico Rat
Cyclops,
Oh I personally believe that the serpent is Satan and what God said about the " seed " and Satan to be correct just as I believe the garden was a figure of heaven. Why it is immaterial is because we know that Satan was in heaven before the garden scene became factual and that he tried and failed to replace God. Therefore it follows that the creation was going to be attacked which happened through the serpent being Satan, or acting for Satan to bring about the fall of man. Now all the arguments in the world cannot change what is written as taking place, why? Because God intended it to be just so as it is an integral part of why we were created in the first place.
Well of course you believe a poor translation and understanding of the text. But as a follower of Augustine whose views on orginal sin are based a defective translation of Paul (and a selective interpretation in other cases) that kinda makes sense.what God said about the " seed " and Satan to be correct
Only via a the vaguely canonical book of the NT certainly not organic to the OT.Why it is immaterial is because we know that Satan was in heaven before the garden scene became factual and that he tried and failed to replace God
Which basically implies god is cruel.Therefore it follows that the creation was going to be attacked which happened through the serpent being Satan, or acting for Satan to bring about the fall of man. Now all the arguments in the world cannot change what is written as taking place, why? Because God intended it to be just so as it is an integral part of why we were created in the first place.
Last edited by conon394; April 26, 2022 at 09:21 AM.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
conon394,
God is Sovereign and has well warned us what to expect if we disobey Him so how is that cruel?
Because you keep dancing aside the issue. If things happen as god intended than the 3 had no free will there for it is cruel to punish them. He is playing with toys. If they had free will than find but it also makes god a lair since his punishment is not what he said.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
conon394,
Well the last news I heard was that people are dying everyday across this planet so how was His punishment a lie?
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
conon394,
Being saved doesn't stop dying in this body yet guarantees a new one fit for the place a born again believer is going. There's no problem in the Old Testament for as we can read that those who were accounted righteous before God their accounts for their sin was cleared by the blood of Christ at the cross which brought in the New Testament.
That is only your implied assumption via the NT and the version you hold to . Not at all clear from the OT at all.There's no problem in the Old Testament for as we can read that those who were accounted righteous before God their accounts for their sin was cleared by the blood of Christ at the cross which brought in the New Testament.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
conon394,
Well, since the New Testament reveals what the Old Testament holds dimly one has to appreciate that the Two go together like your best Sunday suit.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
conon394,
Of course we are a minority for did Jesus not say that the path to heaven is so narrow that few get in?