Azerbaijan-Armenia war over Nagorno Karabakh

[Cookiegod]

Wrong. Russia's relations with Armenia aren't cold. Armenia gets to buy Russian military hardware at preferential rates, which the Azeris do not. But Armenia is poor and has nothing, both of which cannot be said about the Azeris, and Russia gains nothing from losing Azerbaijan as friends as well.

This whole new attack by the Azeris was at least prepared in coordination with the Turks, if not even orchestrated by the Turks in the first place. Hence the Bayraktar drone strikes and the Jihadis from Syria fighting on their side. "Counteroffensive" my . That was also the excuse the last time.

[Drtad]

This whole new attack by the Azeris was at least prepared in coordination with the Turks, if not even orchestrated by the Turks in the first place. Hence the Bayraktar drone strikes and the Jihadis from Syria fighting on their side. "Counteroffensive" my . That was also the excuse the last time.

Yes this was definitely orchestrated by Turkey or at least in cooperation with them. They're attacking at a time that pretty much aligns with the 1920 Turkish invasion of Armenia. Also, they knocked out pretty much every good Armenian news website when the attack began, though now many of them are back up and running. Their online propaganda has been quite strong (as in this thread). This also comes at a time when there have been Azeri attacks on Armenian communities worldwide, such as their burning of a church building in San Francisco and vandalism of the school in the past month:

https://www.kqed.org/arts/13886652/s...eSNtwXTBTKxql4

Thomas de Waal spoke on a podcast discussing the recent escalation: "Armenia lacks incentives to launch military action now, Azerbaijan moved in first, and here are the reasons" Spotify dlvr.it/RhV75X

It's sad that anybody would want this conflict to escalate and become another all out war (and who "wins" exactly here in that scenario?). The violence must stop.

[PointOfViewGun]

Azeris claim Armenians attacked first around 6:00 while Armenians claim Azeris attacked first around 8:00. Is there evidence for either being true? I have seen none. Let's not forget though that regardless of who attacked first the attacks are happening on Azeri lands. Both sides accuse each other of having being supplied by Russia or Turkey.

The accusation revolving around Turkey moving Syrian elements to Azerbaijan is ridiculous though. Why would they even do that? Azeris don't need that. Looks like whenever there is a conflict that remotely involves Turkey there is the same accusation. Next time Turkey has a crisis with USA I bet they'll show random people on boats claiming that they Syrian proxy elements Turkey sending to Florida...

[Tureuki]

The fact that so many people bring the Syrian mercenaries issue as a long proven fact shows whose side has the stronger online propaganda. The Armenian diaspora was always effective anyway.

It's not a secret that Turkey is involved, so far only direct involvement is the handling of Bayraktar uavs i think, those hits in videos were likely conducted by the Turkish personnel. It wouldn't be surprising for certain ground elements to get involved as well, likely within Azerbaijani ranks with Azerbaijani uniforms, if Turkey wanted to provide ground support, that would be the way, not that dumb idea of transfering Syrians.

[Drtad]

There have also been bombardments in the Republic of Armenia itself, not only in the NKR.
https://armenpress.am/eng/news/1029207.html

Regarding Syrian mercs:

https://www.syriahr.com/en/185859/

[Cyclops]

Is Russian coldness to Armenia related to the recent revolution?

Also, what of Iran? I seem to recall an Iranian I knew mentioning Tehran supports Armenia and not just to annoy Ankara.

[Nebaki]

Last time I checked Armenia had the backing of Russia.

Well last time Armenia was ruled by a Guy who was Pro-Russia and not Anti-Russia.

Also, what of Iran? I seem to recall an Iranian I knew mentioning Tehran supports Armenia and not just to annoy Ankara.

Well Iran supports Armenia while Israel is supporting Azerbaijan. Iran of course don´t wants to loose his only transit by land to Russia.

[Vardano]

Is Russian coldness to Armenia related to the recent revolution?

Also, what of Iran? I seem to recall an Iranian I knew mentioning Tehran supports Armenia and not just to annoy Ankara.

Yes, it is another reason. Even though Kremlin did not show any signs of direct disrespect, head of Russia Today and chief of Russian propaganda Margarita Simonyan (she is Armenian herself) keeps arrogantly relating new political power in Armenia to Soros and US in general and keep on having huge confrontations with prime minister. Knowing that anything she says can't be far from what Kremlin thinks, you get the point.

Iran have been good friend to Armenia in last 30 years. They were the only country who helped Armenia during the conflict in early 90s by sending food and supplies. There about 17 millions of Azeri people who live in the north of Iran. Local bully Aliev have even made claims that those lands are part of Azerbaijan, which no one appreciated in Iran. I dare to remind that country of Azerbaijan was created less than 100 years ago and they still searching for their national identity.
Iran does not support Armenia directly and neither indirectly, its main interest to not let Turkey get stronger near its borders and do not spread pan-turkism ideas in their country. Just yesterday they banned all Azeri TV channels in Iran, so to speak.

[Vardano]

Turkey continues to publicly support Azerbaijan's aggression. Even after calls by the United States and Russia not to intervene in the conflict.

President Erdogan stated that "Armenia must immediately withdraw from the Azerbaijani lands, which it is invading."
He also noted that "the time has come to end the occupation of the territory of Azerbaijan by Armenia."

I should add there is no single evidence that Russia supports Armenia in this war. Armenia stated they won't be requesting official help in CSTO. It is about you if you want to take my word for it but even though Armenia have 59 soldiers dead, it absolutely controls the situation on borders and attacking side takes huge losses. The terrain is all about hills and mountains.

[Nebaki]

New footage from the Azerbaijani Armed Forces:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Well if they gonna going to release more T-72/T-90 Series destruction at this speed then there will be no Tanks left in the armenian Army.

[Drtad]

New footage from the Azerbaijani Armed Forces:
Well if they gonna going to release more T-72/T-90 Series destruction at this speed then there will be no Tanks left in the armenian Army.

I think posts celebrating destruction and death are horrible. The Armenian army has also posted several videos, but I don't think it's tasteful to post it here. Celebrating destruction is horrible.

I should add there is no single evidence that Russia supports Armenia in this war. Armenia stated they won't requesting official help in CSTO. It is about you want to take my word for it but even though Armenia have 59 soldiers dead, it absolutely controls the situation on borders and attacking side takes huge losses. The terrain is all about hills and mountains.

This is true, Russia has not done anything or made any statement that's pro-Armenian during the present conflict.

You are correct about the information regarding the border and casualties.

[Nebaki]

I think posts celebrating destruction and death are horrible.

The Azerbaijani Armed Forces are just showing that their claims are facts nothing else. There are already several posts that the Azerbaijani statements are not true but these Videos are showing something different. They are also not like the armenian ones which are obviously more weird then the Azerbaijani ones.

[Vardano]

Who calls for peace to this moment:

Guterres
Putin
Trump
Merkel
Macron
The EU
NATO
CSTO
OSCE

Who calls for war:
Erdogan

[Drtad]

The Azerbaijani Armed Forces are just showing that their claims are facts nothing else. There are already several posts that the Azerbaijani statements are not true but these Videos are showing something different. They are also not like the armenian ones which are obviously more weird then the Azerbaijani ones.

Nobody said there are no Armenian casualties - just that Azerbaijan's numbers are of course inflated (as if it's a good thing to claim to have killed more people, just horrible).

The Armenian videos are not "obviously more weird". They are grizzly and depict the absolute horror of war (the most horrific videos have been deleted by youtube and uploaded elsewhere). The violence must stop and cannot be celebrated.

[Tureuki]

Those who call for "diplomatic" solution have absolutely no viable suggestion. Peacefully solve how? There are two ways that this ends without a conflict, either Karabakh is unconditionally returned to Azerbaijan, or the Armenian authority in Karabakh agrees to be an autonomous region of Azerbaijan, allowing dislocated Azerbaijanis to return and Azerbaijani administrations and military to take control in exchange of a series of guarentees for the Armenian population, the latter would give the Armenians an actual moral ground and perhaps actually force Azerbaijanis to halt the military approach, but i don't see either of these options being acceptable to the Armenian side, so what diplomatic solution should Azerbaijan wait for? It's been almost 3 decades. Like it or not Turkey's approach is the only realistic one, this tension will never end as long as Azerbaijan doesn't gets Karabakh back, only after that a healthy relationship between Azerbaijan/Turkey and Armenia can be a matter of discuission.

[Alastor]

It's been almost 3 decades. Like it or not Turkey's approach is the only realistic one, this tension will never end as long as Azerbaijan doesn't gets Karabakh back, only after that a healthy relationship between Azerbaijan/Turkey and Armenia can be a matter of discuission.

Aka only after Azerbaijan/Turkey win can there be peace. Hmm.

[Drtad]

Those who call for "diplomatic" solution have absolutely no viable suggestion. Peacefully solve how? There are two ways that this ends without a conflict, either Karabakh is unconditionally returned to Azerbaijan, or the Armenian authority in Karabakh agrees to be an autonomous region of Azerbaijan, allowing dislocated Azerbaijanis to return and Azerbaijani administrations and military to take control in exchange of a series of guarentees for the Armenian population, the latter would give the Armenians an actual moral ground and perhaps actually force Azerbaijanis to halt the military approach, but i don't see either of these options being acceptable to the Armenian side, so what diplomatic solution should Azerbaijan wait for? It's been almost 3 decades. Like it or not Turkey's approach is the only realistic one, this tension will never end as long as Azerbaijan doesn't gets Karabakh back, only after that a healthy relationship between Azerbaijan/Turkey and Armenia can be a matter of discuission.

So you're basically admitting that for Turkey and Azerbaijan, war is the only viable solution. Got it.

[Tureuki]

This isn't unprovoked aggression, stop trying to portray it that way, Armenians forced Azerbaijan into this, feel free to share your so called viable peaceful solutions so we can see how war is not made to be the only solution, don't twist my words.

[Alastor]

So you're basically admitting that for Turkey and Azerbaijan, war is the only viable solution. Got it.

That's on one hand. On the other hand, don't forget... Armenia attacked first.

[Nebaki]

How you came from that:

Those who call for "diplomatic" solution have absolutely no viable suggestion. Peacefully solve how? There are two ways that this ends without a conflict, either Karabakh is unconditionally returned to Azerbaijan, or the Armenian authority in Karabakh agrees to be an autonomous region of Azerbaijan, allowing dislocated Azerbaijanis to return and Azerbaijani administrations and military to take control in exchange of a series of guarentees for the Armenian population

to this:

So you're basically admitting that for Turkey and Azerbaijan, war is the only viable solution. Got it.

So in your opinion Azerbaijan should just accept their split between Nakhchivan and rest of Azerbaijan? I don´t think that any logic is behind this conclusion.