Remake Crusades and papal system

**BuchVecny** · January 25, 2007, 01:53 PM

Well few days before i wrote how this mod is great etc etc. Now i see first major faults.

As biggest fault i see the Pope and Crusades.

If you pay pope some salary like 1000 (really joke amounth), the standing will improve. Thats too cheap way how to ,,control" Pope, because AI factions dont do it and its very easy. So you control pope... then u call a crusade to some enemy catholic but excomunicated faction. That means you can basically destroy any excomunicated faction with very few units (you hire the extremely cheap mercenaries, the crusade armies dont have upkeep also). Also when u hit the point of crusade (i.e. Jeruzalem), there are no unit garrisoned so u have very easy fight.

I think this can be easily improved. Either let AI make some diplomacy with Pope or somehow limit the crusading armies. I wrote an essay about Crusades few years ago so i know that the crusades were extremely expensive. Also excomunicated factions were extremely rare unlike in the MTW.

**mr.blonde** · January 25, 2007, 02:41 PM

Far as i know crusades are hardcoded, so i hope that the next patch will make them accesible. I think Lusted cant do much about crusades right now neither he changed them from vanilla.For me the letdown is to see in the holy lands crusader mercs hanging around

**Arksa** · January 26, 2007, 10:46 AM

One advice...don't bribe the pope. It will just make it quite easy to be his friend and control him. Just don't do it even if you can. It's your choice but i don't recommend.

**BuchVecny** · January 26, 2007, 02:11 PM

well i dont think it would need to hardcode. Just somehow make the AI to move their armies to specific settlement

**greengriffon** · January 26, 2007, 02:45 PM

Originally Posted by BuchVecny

As biggest fault i see the Pope and Crusades.

If you pay pope some salary like 1000 (really joke amounth), the standing will improve. Thats too cheap way how to ,,control" Pope, because AI factions dont do it and its very easy.

I really don't understand how people who see a chance to exploit the AI take advantage of that exploit, then have the nerve to complain about it. It's simple - if you feel like it's cheating and the AI isn't doing it, exercise some restraint and just don't do it.

Stop paying the Pope 1000 florins, and do what every other Christian nation needs to do in the game (fight Muslim factions, complete Papal missions, etc) to win his support. Easy enough?

That being said, I think the mod is terrific, and it has definitely breathed new life into MTW2 for me. No complaints here, and I hope to see the mod develop further.

GG

**Faust Gottes** · January 26, 2007, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by BuchVecny

excomunicated factions were extremely rare unlike in the MTW.

I seem to remember that the Holy Roman Emperors got themselves Xed pretty often. And the English managed it a few times too. Heck, even Robert the Bruce was Xed. I don't know much about the Italian penninsula's medieval history, but it probably wasn't that uncommon for kings to get into trouble with the Papacy. I do think the amount of money that you have to pay for your "indulgences" should be larger.

**BuchVecny** · January 26, 2007, 03:21 PM

well, but that was the leaders. not whole faction. Pope didnt dare to call crusade on HRE (in MTW he does it)

**Faust Gottes** · January 26, 2007, 03:43 PM

Excommunicated leader to Toulouse had a crusade called against him. Resulted in all sorts of fighting on French soil. Think of the crusade as being called against the king of the Xed faction. Of course, he's not going to just lay down and let himself be burned at the stake or hung, so he calls out his armies. And there you have it.

http://www.languedoc-france.info/1206_crusade.htm

**dutch81** · January 26, 2007, 07:47 PM

One thing I have a problem with is the Jihad, if recall correctly in MTW a Jihad could only be called against a formerly held muslim province much more realistic as Jihads were never carried out against Rome etc.

Ofcourse this is not a LTC problem and I don't know if it is currently moddable but if it can be changed it certainly should be ... if not CA need to change it or open it to the modders to do so!