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Thread: 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

  1. #1
    Gigantus's Avatar I am thinking more about running away now then I did as a kid, but by the time I put my teeth in, my glasses on and find my car keys I forget why I am going.
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    Default 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

    By now I have started to play every available faction (with Odysseus at the bottom of enjoyment) and I am seriously getting put off by the interminable whack a mole play. Right now it's Achilles I am playing and I am at about turn 90. There isn't a single faction in the neighborhood, apart from the other three playable factions, that hasn't declared war on me during the course of the game. Well, those two 'saga' factions haven't, but only because of scripting I am guessing and they got confederated shortly after their events.

    I mean, seriously? A one region faction with mildly positive attitude and no negatives (and no allies) declares war on me when I hold second rank? They didn't even have a shared province, so what's the deal? One of them was actually allied with Mycenae (fourth rank) and they happily joined their side as I hadn't pushed for an alliance with them in true Achilles style. Needless to say that I loaded an older save...

    So between whacking them, thereby exterminating every faction in Greece except the 3 playable factions, and sending Achilles of to his duels I haven't been able to proceed with my 'saga' (defeat three Trojan armies at present) when my antagonist decides it's time to get into the mix as well. And does that with 6 full stacks within three turns of announcing so. So much for 'pax achillum'

    They all lump together nicely so no chance of sniping the odd stack and as I can only field 2 attacking armies against their 3 defending (fairly well composed) armies I am looking at massive losses of highly experienced units if I attack. Top that with me having just defeated the faction leader (Lycia) 4-5 turns earlier when he came on a lonely visit and now he's back with an even better stack.

    Did I mention that the antagonist is holding far less regions than me and that I simply cannot field more then 4 stacks? I nearly got caught with my pants down the first time Achilles went on a trip (removing his faction wide upkeep\food bonus) and the second time when he went into the scripted rage, which got immediately followed by the next white rage (the next 'saga' had already been completed and was queuing up) and resulted in 20 turns of 30% deduction of everything while I had to recapture regions on opposite sides of my empire. That included two vital food producing regions...

    While I appreciate an aggressive AI this whack a mole\kamikaze business simply doesn't make sense and I am starting to appreciate that I got the game for free because right now I am in no mood to continue playing.
    Last edited by Gigantus; August 27, 2020 at 10:27 PM.




  2. #2
    alhoon's Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

    Actually... try playing R2TW. Then, you will appreciate large armies stacking together and you would have been used to your protectorates and trade partners declaring war on you for the lulz. Yes, that one-region faction surrounded by 3 of your provinces and sharing the province with a two more of your vassals that will immediately move on to wipe them out... declares war.
    But unlike what you described, when you decide to take on that 25-region, 10-province empire... you find all their armies absent as you take settlement after settlement. Sure, sure, you may find a stack here and there as they start returning from the corner they've been for extended vacations or something. And so, you take down 10 stacks of Roman armies (or more, who keeps count!?) with great ease ... while their 1-province ally uses their 3 stacks well to harass you.


    I don't know what duels you're talking about (I have the game but I haven't even installed it yet as I wait for fixes, mods etc - no playing game on release for me after ETW in 2009). But what you describe sounds awesome.
    Including the scripted alliance that ensures there's some alliance.


    Back in S2TW, when the Emperor wakes up grumpy one morning and decides you are to fault and points the finger (realm divide) everyone goes against you. Factions you've not even seen, get in their boats and rush to finish you off. Long-time vassals that you have kept for 100 turns and given them money and shielded them and all, declare war within a few months from that fateful day that the Emperor woke up grumpy.
    Diplomacy becomes useless. Even if you DO manage to talk to someone, they will deny peace. If you liberate a settlement, the new owners you put in place will attack you the next turn.

    If you play with a mod that increases the settlements to a couple hundred, you HAVE to have RD modded, else by the time you have 15 settlements you would be done for.
    Last edited by alhoon; August 27, 2020 at 10:57 PM.
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  3. #3
    Gigantus's Avatar I am thinking more about running away now then I did as a kid, but by the time I put my teeth in, my glasses on and find my car keys I forget why I am going.
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    Default Re: 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

    Ah yes, realm divide - the reason why I haven't bothered to play total war much since shogun2. Did give R2 a spin - and believe me, that back stabbing was nothing in comparison to what's happening in Troy. Although there isn't much backstabbing involved to be honest (getting alliances other then with your 'group' is close to impossible, no vassals). It's way simpler than that - "I want to get into your face, no matter what"

    Duels is that special faction function for Achilles - as a reward you get cheaper army upkeep and instant recruiting of top tier units (still need to pay for them). It's three challengers at a time and some of them simply don't run away but want the fight - that's when Achilleus goes on a trip and with him his bonuses (WTF if I am going to be honest). And no, those factions weren't allied, they just didn't join the fan club of 'I really need to declare war against you' despite below average attitude. The first I forced into confederation and the second as option when completing the 'saga' step (of simply entering the main region).

    Total regions are somewhere around 240 I think.
    Last edited by Gigantus; August 28, 2020 at 12:28 AM.




  4. #4

    Default Re: 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

    Yeah, it's quite disappointing. The campaign at the start is so promising. The battles are fresh and the campaign map is lovely with several intriguing mechanics to use. Then the agent spam and endless stacks from an AI overtuned to be aggressive and focus on the human player start arriving and sap all enjoyment away.

    There were similar problems with the Rise of the Republic DLC for Rome 2 from the same studio.

  5. #5
    alhoon's Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

    Well, aggressiveness can be modded down. So, that's not a big problem for me.
    DIE: Diversity, Inclusion, Equality (Pun on SJWs, I am not far-right)
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  6. #6
    Gigantus's Avatar I am thinking more about running away now then I did as a kid, but by the time I put my teeth in, my glasses on and find my car keys I forget why I am going.
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    Default Re: 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

    Yeah, let's mothball the game until the code can be accessed properly and someone has a clue how to tweak the right number.




  7. #7
    valky's Avatar Ducenarius
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    Default Re: 'whack a mole' seriously dampening my enthusiasm

    The lack of armies, thanks to the ever increasing supply-line mechanic plays a huge or I'd even dare to say massive role, in how many war-declarations you are getting early on.
    I currently use slightly down-tuned values (9% food on VH - it's more than 'slightly') and that is actually a joy. I am still restricted, but not to such extent, that I can't afford another army prior 20-30 turns.

    Other tables are sadly not accessible to mod in other changes - but the supply-stuff is still stupid. I don't mind 'cheats' for the AI, which have been reduced compared to WHII/3K..but now CA just puts on the middle-finger and punishes the player even further. I honestly want a little bit more freedom in my doing - they can give the AI 100% upkeep reduction or whatnot for all I care, but they should really start to think of how they should balance that mechanic or even restrict the army limit according your Empire-size, like they used to. (DeI anyone?)

    Getting a Commander or Archer Trickster (I was about to write Arcane trickster) with Veil of Nyx and a reasonable starting trait is friggin' hard...at least I got one with one hell of an awesome trait [minus for ransom or peace-treaties = lol]
    He alone does have such a huge impact in my campaign (night attack) and the commander abilities are semi-decent as well.

    As far as I know and even compared the tables, they did change the player-only focus in WarhammerII a while back and removed it, but the troy-tables ain't decoded yet. Removing or reducing that alone, had such a major impact and even tiny factions, did not send their armies all across the world, but actually started to defend their territory. Was like playing a complete different game....

    edit: I haven't used that phrase in ages, but the player is forced more and more into a "can-of-whoop*ss-situation" or Korgoth of Barbaria used to say: a world of pain!
    Last edited by valky; August 28, 2020 at 08:03 AM.
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