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Thread: Another guess at the new potential factions

  1. #1

    Icon5 Another guess at the new potential factions

    Hey guys so I've been scrolling through the pages of the is formum to guess at what will be the two potential factions and I've come to the conclusion that one of those will definitly be a belgian keltoi faction, however I still ponder about the second one first some general statement from those multiple threads :

    - No more hellenistic factions
    - No African factions (Numidians, berbers or ethiopians )
    - no more Keltoi/Germanic/balto-slavic faction ( first one since one of the two new ones will be a keltoi one, and the others since they are already present)
    - Maybe no more steppe faction (This I concluded from checking around not sure tho for western/pontic steppe) Altough I always wanted to have scythian factions I think they're borderline in terms of QS rule for faction (will edit when quote found but IIRC : expansionist and not emergent) the second criteria works well but the first one I'm not sure, they "expanded" north-west black sea but is it enought? I always loved three ways free for alls which in my personnal experience works well both as a challenge for the player as well as interesting results for the AI (even tho it wouldn't be a hellas type three way and more of a scythiano-bosporus alliance vs the big bad sarmatians)
    - No eastern/central asian steppe factions (Might be too crowded and I agree with the modders as this region feels more like a place to prepare an invasion of baktria/persia/india rather than a place to set up the core of ones Kingdom/empire as it was the case for most of this region's history)
    - No india for obvious reasons
    - Maybe persian local statrapy (could work for proper persia I would personnaly love to see a satrapal persia with addition of anshan and parsagades but it doesn't fit in QS' rules (barely exists and not expansive for another couple of centuries if it can even be considered as the same "state?")
    - Media Astropatene : this one is also one that would be barely expansive except maybe through revolts but it did exist into the sassanis era even tho it turned into a subject/satrapy at some point after seeing the arsacids as a required allies while facing the encroaching romans (behing able to install a powerfull median state would be great) Big problem though : They might be redundant with the Saka rauka if those decide to go for asia as well as the phalava
    - Sataptîs : Illyrian tribe: good and differing roster, quite some place too expand (lots of eleutheroi around)

    What else do you think could be added as a faction in the future?

    P.S: will edit if my statements are wrong or if there are new statement to be able find that new factions

    Legend : QS stands for Quintus Sertorius (might have to edit for grammar too )
    Last edited by blackbirdgriffin; July 29, 2020 at 10:35 AM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    Are there are any unused faction slots left, to begin with?

    If yes, I think that Illyroi have enough going for them. They already have a complete factional roster and the elite sword-oriented Thorakitai who aren't really useful for any faction.


    Quote Originally Posted by blackbirdgriffin View Post
    I would personnaly love to see a satrapal persia with addition of anshan and parsagades but it doesn't fit in QS' rules (barely exists and not expansive for another couple of centuries if it can even be considered as the same "state?")
    Sassanids initially were pretty much the same state as the Arsacid kingdom with the switch of the ruling dynasty and the seven great Parthian houses were very influential through the entire Sassanid period... But that's what is making the Persian inclusion redundant. I didn't test it, but I think that you can even give the Potential Successor ancillary to a Persian ethnicity faction member, because this trait is available to regular FMs in the faction tree too (and not just to the client rulers).
    Last edited by Satapatiš; August 07, 2020 at 01:16 AM.
    Furthermore, I believe that Rome must be destroyed.


  3. #3

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    Yes that would be awsome, I always wanted to dwelve into ancient Parsi culture and have been wanting to do a mod about them for a long time now (been having a hard time know if I wanted to do a 612 BC ninveh or a 560 BC for the cyrus and cambyse campaign, even though 612 bc wouldn't exclude a persian campaign as Cyrus the first was ruling in anshan at that time already) Maybe that project could start with a submod for EBII for media atropatene or a Parsi alternate cut in order to get aclimated to modding, If you speak french I highly advise" The persian empire from Cyrus to Alexander" by Pierre Briand (there could be a translation not sure, otherwise don't get into it, since the book is extremly dense and already hard to understand for a native speaker such as me, it's more of an encyclopedia on the empire rather a book ) it really got me into a fascination for the region

    Playing as the Pahlava I never managed to get a marriage proposal from a persian dynasty and the other contender for rebuilding the persian empire would be pontus anyway but it would make no sense since their dynasty would have more claim than other ones and are "Persian" in the first place anyway

    But that's off topic, any other idea except for Illyria as a potential faction? did they ever expand?
    Last edited by blackbirdgriffin; July 29, 2020 at 11:08 AM.
    "To pillage, to butcher and to despoil, they call the false name "Empire" and where they make a desolation they call it peace."
    Calgacus, leader of the Caledonians: C. Cornelius Tacitus, Agricola 30.5

  4. #4

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I'd be interested in a revival of Asia ton Barbarorum for the M2 engine but the elephant in the room is Rome. In the original mod they were emergent but I don't like emergent factions either. Yet it seems hard to imagine that general area without Rome's intervention.
    I wish I were an intelligent man.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    There has been a poll some time ago where the team asked if there should be 2 new factions or 1 new faction plus expanded scripting possibilities (which the second slot would be used for).
    IIRC the poll was slightly in favour for the scripting.

    And Belgae seem like a reasonable guess.

    (I personally would cry tears of joy if they included Kush (or Meroe, more precisely) but this has been ruled out for several reasons (technical ones, even) so many times that I do not have any hopes for that anymore.)

    EDITH says:
    Here's the poll https://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?791882-30th-Faction-slot-What-would-you-like-to-see&highlight=scripting
    Last edited by Shadowwalker; July 29, 2020 at 03:32 PM.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    Fair enough

    Not gonna do go further with it for off-topic reasons, but would I venture in such project, rome would be a scripted rebels faction at the most if any attention is ever devoted to it since it wouldn't be the focus of the mod, and if western medditerranea is even included (I would want to replicate the Phoenician vs greek colonisation, well we'll see )
    Last edited by blackbirdgriffin; July 30, 2020 at 01:27 AM.
    "To pillage, to butcher and to despoil, they call the false name "Empire" and where they make a desolation they call it peace."
    Calgacus, leader of the Caledonians: C. Cornelius Tacitus, Agricola 30.5

  7. #7
    Roma_Victrix's Avatar I am your sovereign now
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    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I agree with blackbirdgriffin and Satapatis, the Illyrians are the most obvious choice for a new faction given how they have tons of existing native units for an almost complete roster (minus a unique bodyguard, of course). They would provide the Western Greek factions with a real stumbling block for expansion north into the interior of the Balkans. It's also historically appropriate to add them to the game given their prominence as raiders and the wars they fought against both Epeirote/Macedonian Greeks and then the Roman Republic. Although she was either a small child or was not yet born at the start of the game in 272 BC, the reign of the Ardiaei Illyrian queen Teuta alone would justify the existence of their faction, in my humble opinion and estimation.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I know that Belgae are the most possible choice, but what's the fun of living in the Koinon Apeirotan without your charming Illyrian neigbours? Also, Illyria makes for a more "natural" faction to eliminate for the Epeiros victory condition than are the Getai.
    Last edited by Satapatiš; July 30, 2020 at 01:29 PM.
    Furthermore, I believe that Rome must be destroyed.


  9. #9

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I was meerly editing in my post the suggestion of Satapis, I have little knowledge on the adriatic sea and didn't really know much except pop culture about them beeing raider in war with rome as well as the Illyrian units I get from Epeiros' playthrough
    "To pillage, to butcher and to despoil, they call the false name "Empire" and where they make a desolation they call it peace."
    Calgacus, leader of the Caledonians: C. Cornelius Tacitus, Agricola 30.5

  10. #10

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I cast my vote for the Belgae. Second on that list would be a steppe faction, albeit I wouldn't know which nation best fits the role.

    I'm basing this vote off of how to make the game world a bit more authentic, I think the British Isles, Germania, and the Steppe are in need of an extra factor to break up the large empires formed by the Pritanoi, Sweboz, and Sauromatae. Granted, I believe 3.5 has solved the issue of a Pritanoi empire, and the Sauromatae are a lot less obnoxious than they used to be. The Sweboz are still in need of cutting down to size, because the AI Boioi rarely make it past the first few hundred turns.

    In my Roma playthrough I actually had to spend a good chunk of time fighting the Sweboz in order to stop all of the Keltoi factions from getting stamped out early. Now, there's an issue with this in that any Belgae faction is better poised to make things worse for the Keltoi, but denying the Sweboz AI space should be valuable to keeping it in check, as I suspect their Tribal Migration buildings are the source of their power. Speaking of Roma, their AI is also in dire need of help. They rarely expand beyond Italia, and in some of my playthroughs have even lost significant chunks of it to Qarthadast. A fully fledged Illyrian faction might see SPQR getting wiped off the map entirely. Old Hellas also isn't in dire need of more excitement...


    That being said, the Illyrians aren't a bad choice at all. Glaukias tried playing kingmaker with the young Pyrrhos (assuming the Glaukias in Illyria Hellenike is the same one, he lived to regret that,) and IIRC they had decent odds of destroying Makedon before Phillip II came along.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    Quote Originally Posted by BailianSteel View Post
    Speaking of Roma, their AI is also in dire need of help. They rarely expand beyond Italia, and in some of my playthroughs have even lost significant chunks of it to Qarthadast.
    With the Roman AI it's a problem with their suicidal hate boner towards the Cisalpine provinces. They will ignore the Southern Italy and Sicily and will keep throwing their resources to the north no matter what. Until they first hit the Polybian, then the Marian, reforms and can finaly overrun the area. Anyone entering the peninsula from the south is going to have much easier time fighting the SPQR than it should be.
    I had a taste how sabotaging it has to be for their campaign when I had to pacify the region, except by then I had over 40 provinces and a period of peace with other factions. The Roman AI is self-destructing on this almost as much as the Anatolian AIs are hurt by the Galatian stacks.

    I don't think it's possible to force the factional AI into a predefined expansion direction, though.
    Last edited by Satapatiš; July 31, 2020 at 06:46 PM.
    Furthermore, I believe that Rome must be destroyed.


  12. #12

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    The AI has always preferred expansion by land, whereas Rome historically expanded by sea. Over short distances to be fair, but oceans and other waterways allowed much more intense and speedy travel and supply.
    I wish I were an intelligent man.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I've dabbled in trying to get the Romani to expand as they did historically by adding Cohors a century early through the console. After a while it took off, but they expanded along the interior of Europe. They actually seem to like Pannonia and the Bosporos just as much as they like Gaul.

  14. #14
    Morrowgan's Avatar Centenarius
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    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    One can complain about a lot of things in Rome: Total War but at least the Romans expand nicely.
    Member of the Beyond Skyrim Project

  15. #15

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    Quote Originally Posted by BailianSteel View Post
    I've dabbled in trying to get the Romani to expand as they did historically by adding Cohors a century early through the console. After a while it took off, but they expanded along the interior of Europe. They actually seem to like Pannonia and the Bosporos just as much as they like Gaul.
    I don't know what they're smoking in the pixelated Roma, but I don't think I'll ever understand what their AI is doing in my campaigns. They prefer to expand deeper into Gaul, but they do try invading Sardinia and Corsica. On the other hand they still consider Sicilia and Illyria the least priority targets even if these also are across the sea (and they are at war with the AI Epeiros, but nope... Usually it's KH or Makedon who's finishing the AI-led Epeiros).
    Last edited by Satapatiš; August 03, 2020 at 10:48 AM.
    Furthermore, I believe that Rome must be destroyed.


  16. #16

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    If only there was more hemlock to go around!

    Well, if you want to see AI Roma conclude their business in Northern Italy quickly, play Boioi. I once saw the SPQR conquer Felsina in 20 turns, and then the script sent me an invitation to try and liberate it...


  17. #17

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I also strongly agree with the Illyrians (and Delmatae). They were very active in the 3rd centuries against the Greeks, then Rome, which only subdued them for good under Augustus. It would make Roman position a bit more challenging when extending over the Adriatic, and the northern Greeks would not have "easy provinces" in the Balkans.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    I however thought the maximum amount of factions was hardcoded?

  19. #19
    Lusitanio's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Another guess at the new potential factions

    Quote Originally Posted by Guils View Post
    I however thought the maximum amount of factions was hardcoded?
    It is hardcoded at 30, EBII has 28 factions, so there is space for 2 more factions.

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