Did you ever defend a city succesfully from an enemy army that outnumbered you just with the garrison troops?

[Alwyn]

Thanks for the link! This sounds like a good example.

You can post a YouTube video using this format:

[youtube]etrCWZJt05Q[/youtube]

- which gives you this:



Shankbot's Unofficial Guide is a good place for finding out about formatting issues.

[LuckyPistol]

Nice! That's an effective use of the limited units he had to work with.

[twgamer20197]

Thanks Alwyn! Now I know for next time how to post a youtube link.
The gamer lured the enemy into a trap: he ended up sandwiching the enemy units lol

[The Noble Lord]

Many times, and had many successes as well. Also had many defeats like that as well. Overall, I had more successes I'd say.

[twgamer20197]

Many times, and had many successes as well. Also had many defeats like that as well. Overall, I had more successes I'd say.

For example if you are forced to face an enemy army with just your garrison troops, that would depend on the quality of your troops. And on the enemy's troops quality as well. If the enemy army comes with a full stack and if all or almost all of their units suck, you stand some chance if your garrison is at least of medium quality.
Maybe that's the reason why you should build at least one military building ( better if you can build 2 ) for each settlement located in your frontiers and that the settlements are upgraded to level 3 at least. One military building provides a settlement with 2 to 4 extra military units ( besides the units provided by the settlement by default )

If your garrison has at least 2 decent cavalry units it is very helpful. In this case I'd try to keep my cavalry hidden until all the melee enemy military units are piled up in a choke point fighting my melee infantry units ( When they pile up, their range units tend to stay behind ). This is the moment to bring your cavalry to get rid of the enemy range units ( Meanwhile my cavalry doesn't get there yet, I'd fire with my range units ( keeping them behind my infantry units who are blocking the streets ) only at the enemy range units if they are within range.

[twgamer20197]

Can't answer for him, but for my Selecuid playthrough my most successful defenses was having my pike hold them off (and massacring cavalry), then move my skirmishers around to fire into their backs. My cheap infantry would then be used to charge his skirmishers and slingers from behind, making a sandwhich and causing a mass rout. (this may not work on higher than normal difficulty). And yes this was a fairly weak garrison against a full stack of Iranians.

That's why I currently use the tactic of militarily specializing my settlements located in my frontiers by building at least 1 military building in each settlement so that they provide with some extra garrison units ( specially cavalry it is very helpful if you are outnumbered in a city defense battle )

[twgamer20197]

One last example of a battle "completely lost" according to the autoresolve prediction but the gamer won the battle at the end:


The battle is from 6:06 to 15:00

[twgamer20197]

Defending the choke points would be harder if you're playing on smaller unit sizes (I play on large).

That's the problem with playing with medium or smal size units. It is recommended to play at least with large units so that you use only one unit to block a very narrow street

[Alwyn]

That's a great example, it's a nice moment at 8:00 when his skirmishers draw the enemy cavalry into his melee line. I'm impressed by how relaxed the player sounds at about 9:30, when there's a big column of enemy units marching around to another road into the city.

[twgamer20197]

That's a great example, it's a nice moment at 8:00 when his skirmishers draw the enemy cavalry into his melee line. I'm impressed by how relaxed the player sounds at about 9:30, when there's a big column of enemy units marching around to another road into the city.

Another smart thing the gamer did was deactivating fire at will on his range units. Specially when the enemy cavalry when to clash against his centuriae units who were blocking the front entrance to the city. Other players would just let their range units fire in that situation ( which you know it is a bad idea because it causes casualties to your units by friendly fire )

[Alwyn]

That's a good point!

[twgamer20197]

I recently won a battle defending a city without walls against heavy odds. Three armies came to attack. And I was outnumbered practically 3:1
But I think I won because I had elite units that could block streets for a long time.

[Alwyn]

Wow - a defence against three armies, that sounds like a very challenging battle. What faction were you playing, what was your army composition and what faction(s) were attacking?

I sometimes prefer defending unwalled cities (to walled cities), because walls don't seem like much of an obstacle, but the choke-points in unwalled cities can be devastasting for attackers (especially if the defenders have pikes, heavy spears heavy swords plus decent ranged units).

[twgamer20197]

Wow - a defence against three armies, that sounds like a very challenging battle. What faction were you playing, what was your army composition and what faction(s) were attacking?

It was a non-walled coastal city defense battle. My enemy were the Venetti. I played as the Samnites.

The enemy armies compositions ( In total the 3 armies had 4785 men )
- One of the armies was full stack: it had 3 elite melee cavalry units, 1 mercenary gallic horsemen ( armed with axe ), 4 missile venetian cavalry units, 4 weak gallic units ( it is like the gallic version of of the roman plebs ), 2 weak gallic spearmen, 3 slingers, 1 archer and 1 mercenary medium melee venetian cavalry unit

- The second enemy army was of full stack as well: 2 elite venetian cavalry units, 1 medium venetian calvalry, 1 mercenary gallic light horsemen unit, 3 missile venetian cavalry units, 8 units of weak gallic units ( both spearmen and swordsmen ), 5 slingers

- the third was a navy: the general was a elite swordsmen, 7 etruscan swordsmen, 4 archers, 6 slingers and 2 mercenary illyrian units ( axemen )

My army was full stack as well:
My general was a silver infantry unit, 2 silver infantry units, 2 elite spearmen ( I think it is the linen legion ), 2 lucanian swordsmen, 1 umbrian swordsmen, 1 umbrian basic spearmen, 2 ballistas, 2 mercenary gallic cavalry units armed with axe, 2 light samnite swordsmen units, 1 archer and 4 slingers. A total of 1709 men.

Observation: The 3 armies didn't come simultaneously. Only 2 came simultaneously. Only after a while the third army appeared. I think it is because that's the way the game it is: If one of the sides has more than 2 full-stack armies, only 2 can appear at the same time.
RESULT:
Phyrric Victory. I lost 1170 men
Enemy losses: 3995 men

[twgamer20197]

I have a tip for you when it is about a walled city defense battle against a enemy full-stack army ( the tip applies only against the AI ) by having only the garrison at your disposal or the garrison plus a single general unit at the most ( as an extra unit ). And if the enemy army doesn't have any ballista or onagre but only ladders/siege towers, battering rams. Pay attention before battle what type of range units the enemy has. If it has no archers but just slingers and skirmishers or only one of them, just keep your units very close to the walls so that the enemy range units get no opportunity to shoot at your units ( Slingers can't shoot over the walls ). Don't put any of your units on the walls ( they would likely be slaughtered by the enemy slingers from outside while they are engaging in melee combat on the walls ). Just block the gate, also block the two small entrances next to the gate ( I mean the small entrances that are used to go up the wall from inside the city and to go down inside the city from the wall ). And if you can, try to also block another small entrance to the city that is bit further from the gate ). If the enemy slingers go up the walls and just stay there, then use your range units to fire at them. And if they just stay outside the city, just let them stay there. It is much better . Or sometimes the enemy slingers/skirmishers end up trying to get inside city as well and end up in melee combat with your melee units. That's a good thing, too. They won't get any chance for shooting.

However, I hope when a city of you is attacked by a full stack army, your garrison has at least a few strong melee units and that the enemy army has no elite unit ( Just from crap to medium quality units ). It would be more difficult to win if the enemy brings at least some strong units.

[Alwyn]

That's a good tip, thanks! Defending a city with just the garrison (or, as you said, the garrison plus a general) can be an enjoyable challenge. As you said, whether this will succeed depends on the composition of the armies, and some factions have better garrisons than others.

Maybe different tactics work when defending settlements with some factions (for example, Royal Scythian garrisons of light spear infantry and ranged units are very different from the sturdy sword infantry of post-Marian Roman garrisons)?

[♔Greek Strategos♔]

I mean a battle in a campaign where an enemy army ( that outnumbers your garrison troops 2:1 or 3:1) attacks your city ( either walled or not walled ) and you have only the garrison troops at your disposal to defend the city ( or at the most what you have is a single general unit in the city plus the garrison troops ).

In my case I always try to keep at least a single general unit in a province where it is likely to be attacked by invaders. So when they come, I recruit some mercenaries if I can afford it. But what if in case you can't afford to hire mercenaries?

In that case, what would be your advice on how to defeat an enemy army that outnumbers your garrison troops greatly?

Kinda late to the party, but still...
In real life, yes. In Rome 2 not for a long time

PS
I'll have to get back to the game at some point, I know

[twgamer20197]

That's a good tip, thanks! Defending a city with just the garrison (or, as you said, the garrison plus a general) can be an enjoyable challenge. As you said, whether this will succeed depends on the composition of the armies, and some factions have better garrisons than others.

Maybe different tactics work when defending settlements with some factions (for example, Royal Scythian garrisons of light spear infantry and ranged units are very different from the sturdy sword infantry of post-Marian Roman garrisons)?

It would be great if the enemy slingers/skirmishers just stay outside and if your garrison has at least one cavalry unit or if your general is a cavalry unit. You just wait for all enemy melee units get busy fighting your melee units and then go with your cavalry outside the city from another gate to get rid of those enemy slingers or skirmishers. But don't go if there are other types of units outside ( such as enemy calvalry or the general unit )

And as to putting units on the walls before the battle starts, it is not worth it. Not even your range units. They wouldn't cause significant casualties to the enemy units that are approaching either to climb the walls or to destroy the gate

[twgamer20197]

What do you do if an enemy army besieges a walled city but it doesn't start the battle yet? Specially if the garrison is outnumbered by the enemy army. In that case I think it is a mistake to sally out to attack the enemy army because your chances of winning are remote. I'd rather wait to see if the enemy army attacks in the next turn. And if I have an army that can reach the city in 1 or 2 turns, I'll wait for the help to arrive before attacking the enemy.

[LuckyPistol]

Never sally out unless you have a healthy numerical advantage or if you need to counter the enemy infantry (sword units, mostly) with a large dose of cavalry. In the case of only having a garrison for defense, this is even more crucial to follow. You are right that you should wait it out and wait for reinforcements. Though I've never had the AI hold my settlements under siege; they always attack immediately.