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Thread: Voter Fraud

  1. #41

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    I think this has gone on long enough, but yes.



    Those were just common anti-gun talking points I repurposed to push voter ID.
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  2. #42

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    There is a difference. "Outliers" and "statistical anomalies" in the gun debate end up with body counts. Voter Fraud on the other hand, ends with isolated incidents that have not changed election outcomes.

  3. #43
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    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Love Mountain View Post
    There is a difference. "Outliers" and "statistical anomalies" in the gun debate end up with body counts. Voter Fraud on the other hand, ends with isolated incidents that have not changed election outcomes.
    Except for the fact it did change the electoral vote count and cost the republicans a house seat. You obviously didn't read the information in post 12.

  4. #44

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by B. W. View Post
    Except for the fact it did change the electoral vote count and cost the republicans a house seat. You obviously didn't read the information in post 12.
    Nope.

  5. #45
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    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    800,000 inactive voters on registration rolls in Pennsylvania. What could possible go wrong.

    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...n-voter-rolls/

  6. #46

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    Except it's not.
    Then we will just disagree.

    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    By a conservative think tank, none the less. Why wasn't this last piece of information included in the link you provided?
    Except for Here:
    Conservative group files ethics complaint against voter ID judges
    and here:
    The conservative Civitas Institute in North Carolina
    This is in contrast to this:
    The Southern Coalition for Social Justice
    I'm sure they accidentally left off the "liberal" label from this group, but fortunately they caught it for the Civitas Institute.
    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    Ah, the old "soft bigotry of low expectations" meme; I guess I am the racist for thinking politicians would use laws to discourage voting, who knew?! In all seriousness though, don't you think that meme is a little passé by this point?
    You misunderstand me, and that would be mostly my fault for not expounding on it. I don't think there are many truly racist people, but people do say racist/bigoted things. I have no reason to think that you or the people in the video are racist/bigoted. I think the people in the video had what they considered the best interests of those they were speaking about at heart. But what they were saying was absolutely racist/bigoted. Minorities are people like anyone else, they have the same capabilities and the things that the people in the video were saying.....

    Finally on a last note, you may have been correct on the intent of those writing the law. It has to do with some research that was accredited to them, I hope it's not true. If it is true I hope they get shamed from office! I will try to find out what is behind this, hopefully by saturday.

  7. #47

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by B. W. View Post
    800,000 inactive voters on registration rolls in Pennsylvania. What could possible go wrong.

    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...n-voter-rolls/
    A conservative might write an angry article.

  8. #48
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    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Love Mountain View Post
    A conservative might write an angry article.
    And a leftist would write articles claiming "there is no voter fraud", and then other leftists would nod their heads in unison.

  9. #49

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by B. W. View Post
    And a leftist would write articles claiming "there is no voter fraud", and then other leftists would nod their heads in unison.
    Because you still haven't shown anything more substantive than a conspiracy theory. Nice try though.

  10. #50
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    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    More problems with mail in voting:

    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...due-to-error/#

  11. #51

  12. #52
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    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Love Mountain View Post
    Indeed, problem with Voter Fraud.
    Wow! Imagine that. Someone keeping an eye on the President to make sure he votes legally. Too bad all those other questionable votes are ignored by the press.

  13. #53

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by B. W. View Post
    Wow! Imagine that. Someone keeping an eye on the President to make sure he votes legally. Too bad all those other questionable votes are ignored by the press.
    Still haven't demonstrated that this is a problem worth pursuing.

  14. #54
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    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Love Mountain View Post
    Still haven't demonstrated that this is a problem worth pursuing.
    I guess 3,000,000 questionable votes ins't important to you.

  15. #55

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by B. W. View Post
    I guess 3,000,000 questionable votes ins't important to you.
    Always copy-pasting the party line.
    Last edited by Abdülmecid I; June 05, 2020 at 04:12 AM. Reason: Personal.

  16. #56

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Love Mountain View Post
    Voter ID hurts voting access for millions, by eliminating a problem that is statistically nonexistent. And the GOP is regularly engaged in voting suppression efforts, Voter ID is just one part of that campaign. It provides little benefit while disenfranchising millions.
    There has been many studies on this, and as many opinions. I personally don't buy the millions, I believe that is an overstatement done by a liberal "think tank".
    This is from MSNBC:
    http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/how-many-...-texass-id-law
    There’s no question that some legitimate voters were disenfranchised by the law. But how many? Perhaps a large number — but the truth is, nobody knows.
    The article then goes on to write different papers on the subject, and makes this statement:
    A recent Government Accountability Office study found that voter ID laws in Tennessee in Kansas depressed turnout by around 2 percentage points each in 2012. But other analyses have found no significant impact. Perhaps the most authoritative report — a 2009 project that aimed to summarize the results of several existing studies — concluded that the available data just doesn’t allow for firm conclusions to be drawn in either direction.
    The article then comes to this conclusion:
    What’s clear now, though, is that the law deprived some voters — very plausibly a number in the tens of thousands, if not more — of their most basic democratic right. That’s a reason for enormous concern, no matter how many people, or election results, were affected.
    But this is not necessarily clear. Other articles have other statements:
    https://www.redstate.com/jeffc/2020/...voter-id-laws/
    Researchers also found that voter ID laws “do not decrease the participation of ethnic minorities relative to whites.” Well, it looks like the left’s whole “voter suppression” idea has gone out the window. Of course, most people were never buying this argument in the first place. It’s probably the reason why the majority of Americans favor voter ID laws. But it wasn’t just the left’s race-baiting claims that were debunked.
    This article also goes on to say:
    The study also revealed that requiring voters to show ID at the polls does not effectively curtail voter fraud. After the researchers investigated documented cases of voter fraud in states with voter ID measures, they found that these laws do not prevent certain people from defrauding the electoral system.
    This is a very interesting article, I think it's worth reading.
    Quote Originally Posted by Love Mountain View Post
    Still haven't demonstrated that this is a problem worth pursuing.
    Well here is where you fact check the fact checkers:
    https://www.justfactsdaily.com/polit...-non-citizens/
    Just Facts has documented a litany of cases in which PolitiFact has misled its readers on issues such as immigration and crime, child hunger, tax rates on the wealthy, middle-class income growth, income taxes paid by illegal immigrants, Obamacare, and whether Obama or Bush was responsible for withdrawing all U.S. troops from Iraq and allowing ISIS to come to power.In all of these cases, PolitiFact’s misinformation served a left-leaning narrative. In most of these cases, Just Facts notified PolitiFact of the errors, but PolitiFact has not corrected them.
    With that being written, here is the numbers from JustFacts:
    https://www.justfactsdaily.com/false...of-vote-fraud/
    In accord with scientific research methods, Just Facts fully accounts for the sampling error in its study, and this is why the results span a wide range of 594,000 to 5.7 million illegal voters.
    Of course the previous fact checker PolitiFact disagrees:
    https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...llegal-voting/
    PolitiFact wrote: “The number comes from a conclusion by Just Facts, a conservative/libertarian think tank. Just Facts’ numbers came from a study by Old Dominion University researchers. That study was based on a survey which showed that 38 people out 32,800 claimed to be noncitizens who had actually voted. Just Facts used data from the study and census estimates on the noncitizen population to come up with a national figure of noncitizen voters.“But other researchers and political scientists have said the small number is not a reliable source of data on noncitizen voters nationwide. We rate this claim False.”
    Furthermore from this article:
    PolitiFact, Snopes and liberals asserted that the Harvard researchers debunked ODU and Just Facts.PolitiFact points to Brian Schaffner, a political science professor at the University of Massachusetts at Amherst and an author of the Harvard study. It quoted his Politico column: “Survey respondents occasionally select the wrong response by accident — perhaps because they are rushing through and not reading the questions carefully, because they do not fully understand the terminology being used, or because they simply click on the wrong box on the page.”
    But JustFacts came back with this:
    Mr. Agresti said the Old Dominion policy analysts took the issue of sampling into consideration by “weighting” the data to match Census Bureau numbers.In addition, he said, 14 percent of self-declared noncitizens who said they were not registered to vote were in fact on voter rolls, according to databases.
    Of those, 8 percent answered, “I definitely voted” in 2008, and of those, 82 percent said they voted for Barack Obama.
    “Given the poor math skills of many adults, the arguments of Snopes and PolitiFact may sound convincing to some people, but these so-called fact-checkers are using mathematically illiterate notions instead of concrete, quantifiable facts,” Mr. Agresti wrote.

    As background, Mr. Agresti points to a scientific survey by the marketing consultancy McLaughlin & Associates. In a poll of Hispanics for the California wine industry, 13 percent of noncitizens said they were registered to vote. Matched against the country’s noncitizen population, that means 800,000 to 2.2 million noncitizen Hispanics were registered to vote, Just Facts concluded.
    Again this plays into politics and what people want to believe:
    Mr. Agresti said that while Politifact cast him as an ideologue conservative and critics as politically pure, it failed to disclose that two of the quoted analysts contributed money to the Obama campaign. The third wrote an op-ed urging millennials not to vote for a third party because it would help Donald Trump.
    More information that is vital to this discussion:
    In 2013, the Social Security Administration found that 700,000 illegal immigrants were using Social Security numbers with fraudulent birth certificates and 1.8 million had cards that did not match their names.Democrat-led states are stonewalling the commission, and a leader of this resistance is Virginia Gov. Terry McAuliffe.
    He has vetoed a string of bills designed to weed out illegal voters. His appointees also broached the idea of making optional the citizenship question on voter registration forms but abandoned the idea amid strong opposition from Republicans.
    Meanwhile, the Public Interest Legal Foundation, a conservative grass-roots group dedicated to eliminating voter fraud, released a report in May that found at least 5,500 noncitizens were registered to vote in Virginia this decade and at least 1,852 had voted and had cast more than 7,000 votes.
    The foundation said the numbers are likely just part of a bigger figure because the 5,500 likely disclosed their noncitizenship status when acquiring driver’s licenses.
    The Public Interest Legal Foundation said Mr. McAuliffe’s administration repeatedly has blocked its access to records, forcing the group to file lawsuits.

    Mr. Agresti in his JustFacts article expounds on statistics and how they work:
    https://www.justfactsdaily.com/false...of-vote-fraud/



  17. #57

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Meanwhile on the issue of non-imaginary problems:

    Georgia election 'catastrophe' in largely minority areas sparks investigation

    Hourslong waits, problems with new voting machines and a lack of available ballots plagued voters in majority minority counties in Georgia on Tuesday — conditions the secretary of state called "unacceptable" and vowed to investigate.
    Democrats and election watchers said voting issues in a state that has been plagued for years by similar problems, along with allegations of racial bias, didn't bode well for the November presidential election, when Georgia could be in play.
    Last edited by Coughdrop addict; June 10, 2020 at 02:44 AM.

  18. #58

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Coughdrop addict View Post
    It is terrible and it's ridiculous how long people had to wait. But where could the problem come from? I know in the article the democrats blame the republican secretary of state. Here is the answer:
    https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/sta...eorgia-primary
    “That the Dekalb County CEO doesn’t seem to know that training poll workers and equipping polling places is a responsibility that Georgia law places squarely on the county goes a long way to explain the issues that we saw today in DeKalb. See OCGA 21-2-70 (Each superintendent within his or her county shall:… (4) selection and equip polling places…, (8) instruct poll officers and others in their duties, and to inspect systematically and thoroughly the conduct of primaries and elections in the several precincts of his or her county to the end that primaries and elections may be honestly, efficiently, and uniformly conducted). The Secretary of State’s office is tasked with providing training to the superintendents, who then train their poll workers and county election officials."
    Interesting, the CEO is a democrat. He is the one who is supposed to set up polling places and instruct poll officers and other such duties. And if you look at Fulton county you will see that it also is run by democrats.

    "The fact that the egregious issues we are seeing today seem to be limited to a few precincts in a couple counties suggests that the breakdown occurred at the county level. The other 157 counties faced the same difficulties of using a new system and voting during a pandemic, but they seem to have handled the issues that arose diligently and efficiently," Raffensperger stated.
    So the other 157 counties handled the situation, but the 2 run by democrats, well you know the results.

  19. #59

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Never been any evidence of voter fraud as claimed by Trump. There is however a mountain of evidence for voter suppression by the GOP and its allies.

    "As on other subjects, Trump’s “rigged election” rhetoric is merely the unvarnished version of ideas that have long been flourishing in conservative circles. For years, Republicans have used the non-issue of in-person voter fraud to promote laws that systematically disenfranchise minorities, young people, and the poor."
    https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixgo...u-s-elections/
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  20. #60

    Default Re: Voter Fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by chilon View Post
    Never been any evidence of voter fraud as claimed by Trump. There is however a mountain of evidence for voter suppression by the GOP and its allies.

    "As on other subjects, Trump’s “rigged election” rhetoric is merely the unvarnished version of ideas that have long been flourishing in conservative circles. For years, Republicans have used the non-issue of in-person voter fraud to promote laws that systematically disenfranchise minorities, young people, and the poor."
    https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixgo...u-s-elections/
    Pretty much. Republicans have their base locked down, but by itself it's not enough to win elections. There just aren't enough white supremacists, people who think billionaires should pay fewer if any taxes, people who think mass shootings are false flags orchestrated by Obama to take their guns away, or people who would be happy to have no access to healthcare as long as their neighbor didn't either. If Republicans tried to expand their voter base by adopting positions that were popular with the majority of Americans, they'd just be playing catch up to Democrats and risk losing their base. So they've given up on trying to expand their voter base and now spend all of their efforts in search of new ways to gerrymander, suppress voting, and cheat. It's the only way they can have a say in politics.

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