What do you think is missing in MTW2? Here we make update plans.

[youneuoy]

In this topic, we express our Wishlist and understand what makes sense to implement at the moment, and what is not.

If possible, please write the most detailed offers. It is also desirable that their be at least slightly related to already implemented functions or development plans. You must also be sure that there is no way to implement your idea with the help of game scripts, or it is very difficult. A discussion of your suggestions is welcome.

[youneuoy]

I decided to add to the project a list of modifications with which it will be forbidden to use the M2TW Engine Overhaul Project.
There is already one modification in this list:
Bulat Steel L.Y.N.V.O. Edition (all versions, 2.1.5, 2.1.4, etc.). The reason is that in this mod there is paid additional content, which, moreover, developers are actively imposing on players.

Hi Youneuoy,
It's possible to simulate naval battle in M2tw:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCFHdd32zlg
It's requires work, but improve how they work and the limitations seems worth, the mod is Hyrule total war.

It looks very interesting. And how can I help, what suggestions?

[nadalio]

I decided to add to the project a list of modifications with which it will be forbidden to use the M2TW Engine Overhaul Project.
There is already one modification in this list:
Bulat Steel L.Y.N.V.O. Edition (all versions, 2.1.5, 2.1.4, etc.). The reason is that in this mod there is paid additional content, which, moreover, developers are actively imposing on players.
It looks very interesting. And how can I help, what suggestions?

I do not see a way personally for naval battles to be done easily. This would be a very complex feature, far beyond the spell feature, 10 times as difficult I would estimate.

Those are faked sea battles, (they are really land battles similar to the mod which first implemented this in RTW). Mechanically, even if a way was found to upgrade the simulation, there would be problems with which units can traverse actual water on the campaign map and how they could be represented.


CA solved this by implementing transport ships as the default for units, however the problem then is that unit strength would not be represented correctly. In my opinion, it may be too complicated a change for memory modification or at least time that could be better spent on many more features.

Sure, it will be difficult but it's already partially possible. I agreed that there are much more features and interesting things to add before, but still an amazing goal that could be done in the future when we will have much experience on the memory modification.
In historical and custom battle it will work in the meantime, in campaign could be set condition for the movement of the unit? Naval unit could be limited only to siege equipment of coastline settlements for the attacker and a garrison unit for the defender.

So the idea is:
If attacker on a coastline settlement has siege equipment ships
Spawn garrison ships near the settlement.
We can use custom tile to have the right battlemap with water on coordinate (X;Y), if the attacker are in a normal tile, the siege will be normal.

In the first project of memory editing they were able to use ships but the pictures are lost:

https://www.twcenter.net/forums/show...=1#post6530917

[z3n]

I do not see a way personally for naval battles to be done easily. This would be a very complex feature, far beyond the spell feature, 10 times as difficult I would estimate.

Those are faked sea battles, (they are really land battles similar to the mod which first implemented this in RTW). Mechanically, even if a way was found to upgrade the simulation, there would be problems with which units can traverse actual water on the campaign map and how they could be represented.

CA solved this by implementing transport ships as the default for units, however the problem then is that unit strength would not be represented correctly. In my opinion, it may be too complicated a change for memory modification or at least time that could be better spent on many more features.

[leo.civil.uefs]

I know I already commented on this before but I'll do it again here for the sake of record.

It would be very interesting if we could activate the wall_level line in export_descr_buildings.txt

Its currently not working in med2 engine but the guess is that it relates to the entries in descr_walls.txt, there is a "level" line there for each wall type.

Currently, changing it in EDB has no effect.

The reason why making this work would be a good addition is because of the custom settlements.

Some of them are, for example, set as large castles, wich means the engine will assume ithey have 2 lines of gates, but they actually dont have even a single gate (As example, Dol Guldur).

This causes the AI to build siege towers and ladders during the siege while they should actually build nothing and be able to attack the settlement without the necessity of sieging, like when attacking a village with no gates. So the ideal would be to set Dol Guldur to have the village level of walls.

Another example is Barad Dur, wich is a citadel but actually has no walls, but still has a gate. So it should be set with the level of walls of a town. This way the attacking AI would build nothing but rams while sieging it.

Its really a bummer that armies build lots of towers and ladders that they will not use. Not only it causes sieges to last longer than what they should, but its also a immersion breaker to see the armies abandoning the siege engines built as soon as the battle starts, because they have no walls to use them on.

As a side note, in the .worldpkgdesc file of each settlement we can set the "type" of the settlement to define its level (town, large town, city etc), but there is also two other boxes that I never found out what they are for, and I guess that they are not working in med2 engine. They are "Size" and "fortificationlevel".

The"fortificationlevel" looks specially appealing for me, though this is just a guess.

[makanyane]

I know I already commented on this before but I'll do it again here for the sake of record.

It would be very interesting if we could activate the wall_level line in export_descr_buildings.txt

Its currently not working in med2 engine but the guess is that it relates to the entries in descr_walls.txt, there is a "level" line there for each wall type.

Currently, changing it in EDB has no effect.

The reason why making this work would be a good addition is because of the custom settlements.

Some of them are, for example, set as large castles, wich means the engine will assume ithey have 2 lines of gates, but they actually dont have even a single gate (As example, Dol Guldur).

This causes the AI to build siege towers and ladders during the siege while they should actually build nothing and be able to attack the settlement without the necessity of sieging, like when attacking a village with no gates. So the ideal would be to set Dol Guldur to have the village level of walls.

Another example is Barad Dur, wich is a citadel but actually has no walls, but still has a gate. So it should be set with the level of walls of a town. This way the attacking AI would build nothing but rams while sieging it.

Its really a bummer that armies build lots of towers and ladders that they will not use. Not only it causes sieges to last longer than what they should, but its also a immersion breaker to see the armies abandoning the siege engines built as soon as the battle starts, because they have no walls to use them on.

As a side note, in the .worldpkgdesc file of each settlement we can set the "type" of the settlement to define its level (town, large town, city etc), but there is also two other boxes that I never found out what they are for, and I guess that they are not working in med2 engine. They are "Size" and "fortificationlevel".

The"fortificationlevel" looks specially appealing for me, though this is just a guess.

Agree with leo that would be VERY useful if the "wall level X" that's already used in vanilla EDB (but seems ignored) actually worked to refer to a chosen level in descr_walls.txt, which sets the strength of walls and type of siege equipment required.

There's a complication... the 'village' (city tree) level doesn't have an entry in EDB it's just the default for nothing being built yet - and it's the only thing the game expects to have no walls. Wall level 0 in descr_walls.txt is set for "siege_tower_size too_small" which triggers the 'only build a ram' level attack, but I'm not sure if you can tell it that level 0 actually means no wall - that would be an interesting experiment for someone *cough* leo!

.worldpkgdesc - the size - is the 32x64 type, not really a size but a text field - that's used to match up techtree slots with the correct available pkg for techtree models - I don't recommend trying to hi-jack that one!


"fortificationlevel" - didn't we decide that did work to an extent? Only the extent of the stone forts using fortification_level 3, and that differentiating the siege equipment from the ram only setting used on the default timber fort??? Though I might be dreaming that, and had just hoped it did... It definitely doesn't work at present to affect the settlements/level/versus seige equipment issue.

________________________________________________________

There's an obscure one from me on walls - there's an attribute against walls in the .world file for settlements - IWTE reads it as type '96' (which is probably a misread bit indicator!) for standard walls, which have a breach that can be accessed by destroying the wall and they can also be assailed by ladder/tower, that's standard setting and works fine. An attribute '32' gives a wall where the breach is blocked (destroying the wall isn't designed to give walk through access to the interior) - this is lovely, if you have a wall with a big rock behind it you can use that to tell the AI not to use all its ammo destroying the wall - trouble is it also stops it recognising that it can still use the ladder docking points Human player can use ladders/towers fine. (The other indicators in that field read as 111 = default object and first level of arrow-towers, and 79 for subsequent levels of arrow-towers that are built via EDB upgrades with the tower_level 2 and tower_level 3 capabilities)

Can you tell if there is anything that can be set as "this can be targetted with ladders" for AI purposes?

[youneuoy]

I do not see a way personally for naval battles to be done easily. This would be a very complex feature, far beyond the spell feature, 10 times as difficult I would estimate.


Those are faked sea battles, (they are really land battles similar to the mod which first implemented this in RTW). Mechanically, even if a way was found to upgrade the simulation, there would be problems with which units can traverse actual water on the campaign map and how they could be represented.


CA solved this by implementing transport ships as the default for units, however the problem then is that unit strength would not be represented correctly. In my opinion, it may be too complicated a change for memory modification or at least time that could be better spent on many more features.

Yeah thanks. The idea of sea battles is really interesting, I think sooner or later it will be possible to do something like that. Be sure to check it out.


About sieges (I think I already answered this message):
I think I understood what you want to do, but I don’t think it makes sense to me to understand how it works in the game’s files and what it is looking for there. Apparently makanyane is very familiar with this, I don’t think that I should go all this way from the very beginning.
Nevertheless, I believe that it is quite possible to carry out the mandatory assault on the gathering of settlements with built walls and I will definitely check this when I deal with settlements in more detail. So far I have been dealing with them only a little, in order to automatically record them in descr_battle.txt, in the end I postponed this matter until later.
Unfortunately, it takes a lot of time to reverse, at the moment I want to spend this time implementing some things that I already know how to implement and really can do it.


Emperor of the Great Unknown offers are quite interesting. Here, similar questions have already been written, having implemented all this, it will be possible to make Crusader Kings 2 from MTW2. The changes to implement these ideas look pretty minor, but before that I will need to spend a lot of time researching the game code. Of course, I will try to implement something similar as soon as I really can do it efficiently and conveniently.

Regarding Jadli's suggestions:
I planned to move away from scripts and try to 100% replace them with something else, but apparently it would take too much time, so yes, I'm going to expand the use of scripts (but do not wait for new commands).
What am I doing for this now:
since for many teams only the name or label of the character is suitable, I decided that I need to be able to give the same label to different characters.
Technically, it looks like this:
according to different criteria (you can see their list in the available features of the program) characters are assigned a label. The condition, label and priority for it are specified in the file. I think you can give the opportunity to set several conditions at once.
When these conditions are true, the character is given this label with a certain number (it’s easier because the game does not like if the labels are the same). But during the label check in a script or any other command, if the checked label = label specified in the configuration file, then its number is discarded and only the main part is compared. That is, this label may not be unique, but at the same time for several characters, while dynamically changing depending on various conditions.
The conditions will be added: the coordinate area defined by points (not necessarily a square) and label.

With this feature, some of your offers are resolved automatically; you can implement this with scripts.

[leo.civil.uefs]

"fortificationlevel" - didn't we decide that did work to an extent? Only the extent of the stone forts using fortification_level 3, and that differentiating the siege equipment from the ram only setting used on the default timber fort??? Though I might be dreaming that, and had just hoped it did... It definitely doesn't work at present to affect the settlements/level/versus seige equipment issue.

Nope.

I once was mistaken and though it worked for forts, but it does not. Nor for sttlements.

Meanwhile...

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to youneuoy again."

[(:Baktra:)]

Is it possible to remove the seige weapon attribute from elephants. The AI thinks they are seige weapons but the elephants don't actually have the ability to break down gates or walls. I believe it is a vestigial peice of code from RTW.

[AntonisTheGreek]

Is it possible to remove the seige weapon attribute from elephants. The AI thinks they are seige weapons but the elephants don't actually have the ability to break down gates or walls. I believe it is a vestigial peice of code from RTW.

Or, alternatively, reenable the ability of the elephants to break down the gates (EDIT: and possibly the walls too)

[leo.civil.uefs]

Or, alternatively, reenable the ability of the elephants to break down the gates

Or even bring this ability to infantry so trolls could hit gates too.

[Gebilde]

This a pipedream i know but a dedicate culturemeter simliare to religionmeter so you could have both.
A culture meter could be used similare effekt than religion but also for example for unit, wihle religion for puplic order.
Don´t thing it will be worth the effort but still

[tedster1995]

This is lookimg incredible, do ypu think adding additional culture might be a possibilty, would be great to have more flexibility with tech trees and ui

[Emperor of The Great Unknown]

Reasonable wishlist.

-Editing the value of the battlemap general's stats (HP, armor, attack) Also editing the cap of the + hitpoints a general can get from traits
-Editing the effects of XP, armour and attack upgrades to fit with any mod's stat system.
-Editing the threshold for xp upgrades for units
-Editing the effects of general/agent attributes (Example, remove morale effects of dread/chivalry to repurpose them to a different system)
-Editing the ideal ratio of family members to settlements.
-Disabling man of hour/adoption for AI
-Making AI only create armies led by family members instead of captains
-More than 4 children showing on the family tree
-Ability to click the portrait of the spouse of one of your princesses to show the foreign family tree
-Allow non king/prince daughters to become princesses
-Allow underage children to become faction heir/leader
-Allow changing of CURRENT faction heir/leader with a trait
-Allow family members to switch agent type with trait (son goes from general to priest example)
-Make functional the city -> fortress and large city/huge city -> citadel settlement conversion
-Allow net negative effects in the EDB (for example a build with -1 to pop_growth now subtracts from pop growth properly)
-Make the non functioning effects in the EDB work.
-Adjust the increments of the effects (growth rate at something other than 0.5%, happiness at something other than 5%)
-Adjust the deadliness of plagues, natural disasters and riots

[(:Baktra:)]

Would it be possible to allow M2TW to be run using a mulit core processor?

The game is hard coded to run on a single processor. So even if you had the fastest computer, large mods would still run with a lot of lag.

If this feature could be fixed then you possibly never have to worry about lad again.

[Jadli]

[Crociato78]

Hi youneuoy!

Currently armor upgrades can give a maximum of 3 points.

Can you possibly exceed this 3 points limit for updating armor?

Did you manage to take a look at it?

[youneuoy]

Is it possible to remove the seige weapon attribute from elephants. The AI thinks they are seige weapons but the elephants don't actually have the ability to break down gates or walls. I believe it is a vestigial peice of code from RTW.

Great idea, I'll see later. I will also probably see if it is possible to make them(or infantry, cavalry, etc.) really break the gates.

Hi youneuoy!

Currently armor upgrades can give a maximum of 3 points.

Can you possibly exceed this 3 points limit for updating armor?

Did you manage to take a look at it?

Hello!
No, there is no such possibility. I have a couple of ideas on how to implement something that includes this function, but I don’t have time to check it now.

[Lord Baal]

Hi pal! I made the following list sometime ago. I'll edit the quote with the pertinent remarks in bold dark blue.

I would basically love a Medieval 2 remake with the following addons:

Technical:
- Work on 64bit systems only for the memory issues. I'm sure this is beyond the scope of what you are doing. It's this compatible with the more ram patch?

Strategic map:
- Removed the limit on factions, units, buildings, religions and cultures, or at least increased to hundreds for everything, thousands for the units. The default question everyone does.
- Being able to build several buildings at the same time in the same city. Would this be possible? And limit the amount to the size of the city or population or other factors? If you need me to expand this please say so.
- Even better scripting, with more options that allows for killing specific characters (or characters with specific traits) and many other things. With this I mean specifically a script or a way to make characters from different factions or "races" to have different natural lifespans. A character with the trait human would live around 70 or 80 years with ever increasing chances of dying, the trait dwarven up to 400, elve or vampire would give the character immortality, and so on. You mention being able to set ages according to levels of a trait, this could be interesting in the case of necromancers. Also this could give means to provide a script were a character gains the vampire or necromancer trait and has it's life extended (like having an elector count or one of your generals becoming a vampire).

Battle map:
- Naval battles. Would love to see them.
- Amphibian battles. Pretty sure it's way beyond possibilities.
- Every mounted unit can dismount. Could it be possible, if not in mid battle (can't see it happening), at least like it was on Med 1 pre-battle option?
- Control of at least 40 units per battle. Might need also UI modifications. Could it be possible?
- Units being able to "broke up" like in Cossacks games for sieges or street battles. Perhaps not into individual units but squads of 10/20/30 or so soldiers. Out of scope.
- Garrisonable buildings, like towers, gates and keeps. Towers and gates not working unless you have soldiers in them (this works in context with the option of separating units). Out of scope.

The following is optional but would be great: (And also probably all impossible)

Technical:
- Employ scalable multi threading.
- Updated graphics, but I would be content with Med2 quality anyway.
- The engine capable of taking custom animations besides the custom models and textures. (dunno if Med2 actually takes new custom built animations made from 0, if that's so then this point is moot)

Strategy:
- More than one city per province.
- Logistic and supply system for armies.
- Manpower and more deep population system.

EDIT:
Being a remake this should be naturally on the game anyway, so I removed it from the list and put it here.
- No building slots, keep the original Med 2 system. Before yelling imbalance or everyone building everything everywhere, building should be a very expensive enterprise, tied to resources, manpower and upkeep, so it would be naturally nonviable (is that the right word?) to build everything everywhere.

[youneuoy]

Lord Baal:
Hello
most of these questions have already been asked here, I agree that it would be great to see this, but I think it makes no sense to do it all. Something can happen by itself, as a side effect of other changes.
About the patch for using 4 gb of RAM:
everything will work if you patch the .exe file yourself. It changes only 1 byte, which is not used at all while the application is running, it is needed only at startup (therefore, I cannot include it in this program, it is impossible to do this in runtime).
Farther:
The simultaneous construction of several buildings is a good idea, but we'll see sometime later if it makes sense. Now it would be a waste of time and the result would not really change much. It seems to me that the existing construction system is very good. Well, it's probably better than in the newer parts of the series)
As for the killing of characters: a future update will allow you to do this and much, much more. In a neighboring topic, I wrote about this and posted a couple of videos.
I can realize different life durations for different races, but not now. Unless it is required for some modification and I will be very well asked about this and argued about the need for this.
Immortality, depending on various conditions, has already been implemented; you can make such "vampires".


Logistics and supply system will be, you can join the implementation planning in the next topic.
The new mechanics of the population are also affected.