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Thread: The (new) Shogun series

  1. #1

    Default The (new) Shogun series

    A trailer for this series was released recently:



    As you can already see there, they thought they had to "modernize" Mariko's role (she wasn't a "warrior chick" in the original story).

  2. #2
    mishkin's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Quote Originally Posted by Pinarius View Post
    As you can already see there, they thought they had to "modernize" Mariko's role (she wasn't a "warrior chick" in the original story).
    couldn't you have just said "warrior" or woman with martial skills or anything else that wasn't absolutely sexist? And is that the only thing worth commenting on? And is that the only change they have made to the original, undoubtedly a masterpiece that should not have been touched?

    A couple of years ago I watched the original series again because I had loved it as a child, I shouldn't have done it, the memory was much better than reality. Back to the topic, did Mariko have some degree of depth in the old series or the novel or was she nothing more than a pretty Japanese face?

    Edit: The only interesting thing about the trailer seems to be the character of the "warrior chick".
    Last edited by mishkin; November 07, 2023 at 07:39 AM.

  3. #3
    Roma_Victrix's Avatar Call me Ishmael
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Looks pretty cool, the trailer definitely hypes it up. I would definitely give it a chance and at least watch the first episode, given the legendary status of the previous TV series based on the novel.

    It has some great actors too, especially Hiroyuki Sanada. He has starred in films such as Rush Hour (1, 2 & 3) The Last Samurai, The Wolverine, Bullet Train, John Wick: Chapter 4, etc. He is perfect for the role as the daimyo-turned-shogun Yoshi Toranaga, based on the historical Tokugawa Ieyasu.

    As for the warrior woman thing, that is of course ahistorical, but the series is based on a fictional novel by James Clavell, so I can see how some liberties are being taken with the original plot. It would be different if this was a historical documentary about the Tokugawa clan, which is clearly not the case.

  4. #4

    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    There is also a teaser with new scenes:


  5. #5
    Flinn's Avatar His Dudeness of TWC
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Looking forward for this. I've read the novel from Clavell long ago, I'm curious to see how the adaptation has worked out.
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    Lord Oda Nobunaga's Avatar 大信皇帝
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    What the heck was wrong with the original? I get that everyone's introduction to Japan was either James Clavell's Shogun, Tom Cruise in Last Samurai, or Fast & Furious Tokyo Drift but honestly I find both Last Samurai and Shogun to be really overrated. Last Samurai is what gaijin think Japan is, but honestly it is just full of tropes that were never true to begin with. Where as Shogun is an alright story but wholly inaccurate and honestly kind of underwhelming. Go watch 1990 Heaven & Earth, it has battles, political drama, and samurai actually shooting people with guns, plus it is kind of historically accurate even if it is itself a Japanese mythos of sorts. The battle scene is pretty amazing I must say. Honestly that and the music are what does it for me.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex-h3f2peqE


    EDIT: Fast & Furious Tokyo Drift is actually underrated. I don't get why people hate it so much, even among the Fast & Furious franchise. Is it cause Vin Diesel and Paul Walker aren't in it? Is it cause they ripped it off from Initial D? Calm down there Truffaut this isn't Rashomon this is just a movie about racing cars.
    Last edited by Lord Oda Nobunaga; November 13, 2023 at 12:04 AM.

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  7. #7

    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    The final trailer:


  8. #8
    Flinn's Avatar His Dudeness of TWC
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Looks brutal enough to be of my liking
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    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Oda Nobunaga View Post
    What the heck was wrong with the original? I get that everyone's introduction to Japan was either James Clavell's Shogun, Tom Cruise in Last Samurai, or Fast & Furious Tokyo Drift but honestly I find both Last Samurai and Shogun to be really overrated. Last Samurai is what gaijin think Japan is, but honestly it is just full of tropes that were never true to begin with. Where as Shogun is an alright story but wholly inaccurate and honestly kind of underwhelming. Go watch 1990 Heaven & Earth, it has battles, political drama, and samurai actually shooting people with guns, plus it is kind of historically accurate even if it is itself a Japanese mythos of sorts. The battle scene is pretty amazing I must say. Honestly that and the music are what does it for me.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex-h3f2peqE


    EDIT: Fast & Furious Tokyo Drift is actually underrated. I don't get why people hate it so much, even among the Fast & Furious franchise. Is it cause Vin Diesel and Paul Walker aren't in it? Is it cause they ripped it off from Initial D? Calm down there Truffaut this isn't Rashomon this is just a movie about racing cars.
    Err never saw the last two can vaguely recall falling asleep during the first when it aired my Grandmother had the book in her basement same effect falling asleep. In terms of movies Godzilla (obviously given the time the Raymond Burr cut in one) and than Seven Samurai and The Hidden Fortress because well they were on the UHF movie show that I could get sometimes with luck at night.
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    Kyriakos's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    I will pass, since I never liked samurai movies/the setting :/
    Though I have read a few stories by Tanizaki, who in the later half of his career was into presenting that era. The trailer has too little sex to be Tanizaki-like, though
    Λέων μεν ὄνυξι κρατεῖ, κέρασι δε βούς, ἄνθρωπος δε νῷι
    "While the lion prevails with its claws, and the ox through its horns, man does by his thinking"
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  11. #11
    alhoon's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyriakos View Post
    I will pass, since I never liked samurai movies/the setting :/
    Though I have read a few stories by Tanizaki, who in the later half of his career was into presenting that era. The trailer has too little sex to be Tanizaki-like, though
    You are commenting on the thread about the series to tell us you are neither interested in the genre, nor you will watch it. You could have simply skipped the thread, Kyriako.


    For everyone else, do we have more information than "this February!" about when this will air?
    alhoon is not a member of the infamous Hoons: a (fictional) nazi-sympathizer KKK clan. Of course, no Hoon would openly admit affiliation to the uninitiated.
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  12. #12
    Kyriakos's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Hey, Mishkin didn't exactly like the trailer either
    Λέων μεν ὄνυξι κρατεῖ, κέρασι δε βούς, ἄνθρωπος δε νῷι
    "While the lion prevails with its claws, and the ox through its horns, man does by his thinking"
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  13. #13
    mishkin's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Even though I'm a newcomer to this site, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that all the posts in this discussion, except maybe for this one, are acceptable.

    Edit: ridiculous to say "he did it too", but I love you anyway, Kyriakos
    Last edited by mishkin; January 31, 2024 at 01:48 PM.

  14. #14

    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Quote Originally Posted by alhoon View Post
    You are commenting on the thread about the series to tell us you are neither interested in the genre, nor you will watch it. You could have simply skipped the thread, Kyriako.


    For everyone else, do we have more information than "this February!" about when this will air?
    Shōgun: Limited Series (2024) debuts on FX and Hulu on Tuesday, February 27.

  15. #15
    Kyriakos's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    [Can't give rep currently (too lazy to go on a round and refill) but thanks, Mishkin ^^]
    Λέων μεν ὄνυξι κρατεῖ, κέρασι δε βούς, ἄνθρωπος δε νῷι
    "While the lion prevails with its claws, and the ox through its horns, man does by his thinking"
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  16. #16
    Roma_Victrix's Avatar Call me Ishmael
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyriakos View Post
    [Can't give rep currently (too lazy to go on a round and refill) but thanks, Mishkin ^^]
    Hey, maybe the real shoguns and warrior chicks were just the friends we made along the way.

    I'm with Flinn, the trailer makes it look decent enough and action-packed, so I'll give it a chance. There's a decent chance the writing is okay (at least not entirely braindead) and adds something refreshing to the old story. If it has good production values, special effects, dialogue, character building, and an engaging plot, I'll watch beyond the first episode.

    Just a shame that we can't have a decent show about Alexander the Great.

  17. #17
    Halie Satanus's Avatar Emperor of ice cream
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Loving this so far. Cosmo Jarvis (John Blackthorn), is an absolute scene stealer. Remember that old video of the guy who was arrested for running out of resturants, the 'Succulent Chinese meal' guy. Pretty sure that's who Cosmo based his speach and humour on for this role and it's funny AF. Looks stunning too.

  18. #18
    mishkin's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    pleasantly surprised not to have found the romance cringe af. congratulations to those involved

  19. #19
    Kyriakos's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Quote Originally Posted by Halie Satanus View Post
    Loving this so far. Cosmo Jarvis (John Blackthorn), is an absolute scene stealer. Remember that old video of the guy who was arrested for running out of resturants, the 'Succulent Chinese meal' guy. Pretty sure that's who Cosmo based his speach and humour on for this role and it's funny AF. Looks stunning too.
    Getting dishonored for what? Enjoying a Nanjing massacre? :\
    Λέων μεν ὄνυξι κρατεῖ, κέρασι δε βούς, ἄνθρωπος δε νῷι
    "While the lion prevails with its claws, and the ox through its horns, man does by his thinking"
    Anaxagoras of Klazomenae, 5th century BC










  20. #20
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: The (new) Shogun series

    Just a shame that we can't have a decent show about Alexander the Great.
    What a AH where Theagenes runs him through at Chaeronea and the overall Macedonian army is routed.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

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