USA elections 2020 - 2021

[B. W.]

Trump stokes culture wars, but low turnout mars Tulsa campaign rally



Ouch. So much for those million ticket requests his campaign was crowing about.

As I understand it, there was a large viewership on u-tube.

[Aexodus]

Can someone explain to me why some Americans hate America’s past Presidents such as Jefferson, or Washington, Adams, or Roosevelt.

Do they really feel they have the authority to judge these men without a societal consensus. Are they that convinced of their beliefs. Speaking of their wider beliefs, what is their agenda, and how will it affect the election in November. No doubt Trump will try to beat Biden over the head with this issue.

[Coughdrop addict]

If polls are unreliable then wouldn't any polls showing Trump winning be just as unreliable as one's showing Biden winning?

They always reply with "but 2016" because they don't understand how polling or probability works. The last polls showed Clinton with a 2-4% popular vote lead. She won that vote by 2%. Trump pulled a straight flush in three states by 77k votes, which gave him the victory.

As I understand it, there was a large viewership on u-tube.

That doesn't deflect from the fact that Trump's campaign and supporters were proudly braying about a million tickets, and Trump ended up ranting to more empty chairs than people. Even the fake reservations can't explain the empty seats since admission was first come first serve, so fake reservations wouldn't have actually cost anyone a seat.

Trump failed to fill that arena because not enough people want to hear him speak.

[Sar1n]

And I'm asking again. Besides the two clowns that compete in which one is falling apart due to senility slower, who else is running? US need a break from the established two party system, and there's no better time like the present.

[Cope]

It would take decades and millions - if not billions - of dollars to build the infrastructure and networks necessary for a third party to break the duopoly. You have 4 months. It isn't going to happen.

[Knight of Heaven]

That doesn't deflect from the fact that Trump's campaign and supporters were proudly braying about a million tickets, and Trump ended up ranting to more empty chairs than people. Even the fake reservations can't explain the empty seats since admission was first come first serve, so fake reservations wouldn't have actually cost anyone a seat.

Trump failed to fill that arena because not enough people want to hear him speak.

I lot of people watched him speak on Youtube and yahoo during the stream, and probably other platforms.
230k in the youtube stream at its peak.

I can tell you Biden stream speech in Darby the highest i could find has 40k views in Youtube. This after a few days later.

Tulsa rally right now on fox news channel on youtube has 2 million views, after one day.

Taking aside the background noise expected during election times, who gives a crap about what trump supporters or its propaganda say?

Look at the two candidates, and compare the two, its that easy.

Right now seems to me the focus is more on Trump then on Biden imo. But i tell you, i wouldn't put my hands on the fire for any of them, in this race.

It would take decades and millions - if not billions - of dollars to build the infrastructure and networks necessary for a third party to break the duopoly. You have 4 months. It isn't going to happen.

US Democracy probably would be better served with a parliamentary system of sorts.

And I'm asking again. Besides the two clowns that compete in which one is falling apart due to senility slower, who else is running? US need a break from the established two party system, and there's no better time like the present.

Is Sanders going independent? Sooner hell would freeze over i think. No one wants to take voters from the main Dem candidate i suppose.

[Sar1n]

It would take decades and millions - if not billions - of dollars to build the infrastructure and networks necessary for a third party to break the duopoly. You have 4 months. It isn't going to happen.

Isn't that about average span of US electorate's memory?

A third candidate who could make a big splash on social media in the moment both Trumpet and Bidet show weakness-like during these riots-could just about get enough recognition. It would have to be a costly blitz campaign, but I think it could work.

@Knight of Heaven: it doesn't matter if it's parliamentary or presidential, as long as there are effectively only two parties at play, it's more cost-effective for them to play the polarizing blame game while keeping status quo than actually effectively govern the country.

[Aexodus]

In the UK we have UKIP, Greens and Lib Dems nipping at the heels of the big two to keep them straight. Are there American equivalents?

[Sar1n]

In the UK we have UKIP, Greens and Lib Dems nipping at the heels of the big two to keep them straight. Are there American equivalents?

Nope. From time to time, other parties get a chair or two in Congress, but they're largely inconsequential.

[tgoodenow]

"Yes, I think the statues of the white European they claim is Jesus should also come down. They are a form of white supremacy. Always have been," King tweeted on Monday.
"In the Bible, when the family of Jesus wanted to hide, and blend in, guess where they went? EGYPT! Not Denmark. Tear them down," he added.

"Yes. All murals and stained glass windows of white Jesus, and his European mother, and their white friends should also come down," he explained in a second tweet.
"They are a gross form [of] white supremacy," he added. "Created as tools of oppression. Racist propaganda. They should all come down."

https://www.theblaze.com/news/black-...the-white-ones

Left-wing Democrat activists are going to be a thorn in Biden's side.

[Gaidin]

Can someone explain to me why some Americans hate America’s past Presidents such as Jefferson, or Washington, Adams, or Roosevelt.

Do they really feel they have the authority to judge these men without a societal consensus. Are they that convinced of their beliefs. Speaking of their wider beliefs, what is their agenda, and how will it affect the election in November. No doubt Trump will try to beat Biden over the head with this issue.

The people you reference literally made a Constitution that can be amended.

The idea that our mythology would last forever is laughable.

[Pontifex Maximus]

Can someone explain to me why some Americans hate America’s past Presidents such as Jefferson, or Washington, Adams, or Roosevelt.

Ahahaha, more silly European lack of perspective. Let me shed some light on the issue for you:

REEEEEEE RACISMMMMMM REEEEEEEEE

THEY OWNED SLAVESSSSSS REEEEEEEEEE

REEEEEEEACISTSSSSSSS STATUESSSSS

[Lord Thesaurian]

Well in at least one case they didn’t even own slaves. They just “represented colonialism.” Whatever that means.

[Gaidin]

Well in at least one case they didn’t even own slaves. They just “represented colonialism.” Whatever that means.

No they lived in their time. And I think if I know who you're pointing at it's more naturalism.

Take what you want for your finger pointing for advantageous internet debates.

[Cope]

Well in at least one case they didn’t even own slaves. They just “represented colonialism.” Whatever that means.

The ever shifting goal posts are evidence enough that this was never about Floyd, slavery or even racism; as Gaidin let slip, this is simply about the destruction of America's so-called "mythology". And I'm sure we'll all be much happier when the monuments dedicated to towering historical figures like Washington, Jefferson and Roosevelt are replaced with woke alternatives like Trayvon Martin, Kim Kardashian and Greta Thunberg.

[Lord Thesaurian]

The ever shifting goal posts are evidence enough that this was never about Floyd, slavery or even racism; as Gaidin let slip, this is simply about the destruction of America's so-called "mythology". And I'm sure we'll all be much happier when the monuments dedicated to towering historical figures like Washington, Jefferson and Roosevelt are replaced with woke alternatives like Trayvon Martin, Kim Kardashian and Great Thunberg.

There are certainly multiple levels of toxic opportunism playing out here. I’m frankly still shell shocked and nauseated by the whole affair, despite all precedent. Teddy’s own words are a testament to what it is that’s being erased:

We Americans have many grave problems to solve, many threatening evils to fight, and many deeds to do, if, as we hope and believe, we have the wisdom, the strength, the courage, and the virtue to do them. But we must face facts as they are. We must neither surrender ourselves to a foolish optimism, nor succumb to a timid and ignoble pessimism. Our nation is that one among all the nations of the earth which holds in its hands the fate of the coming years. We enjoy exceptional advantages, and are menaced by exceptional dangers; and all signs indicate that we shall either fail greatly or succeed greatly. I firmly believe that we shall succeed; but we must not foolishly blink the dangers by which we are threatened, for that is the way to fail. On the contrary, we must soberly set to work to find out all we can about the existence and extent of every evil, must acknowledge it to be such, and must then attack it with unyielding resolution. There are many such evils, and each must be fought after a fashion; yet there is one quality which we must bring to the solution of every problem,- that is, an intense and fervid Americanism. We shall never be successful over the dangers that confront us; we shall never achieve true greatness, nor reach the lofty ideal which the founders and preservers of our mighty Federal Republic have set before us, unless we are Americans in heart and soul, in spirit and purpose, keenly alive to the responsibility implied in the very name of American, and proud beyond measure of the glorious privilege of bearing it.

https://teachingamericanhistory.org/...orum-magazine/

....and even alluded to the problem of our own time, and our fate:

One may fall very far short of treason and yet be an undesirable citizen in the community. The man who becomes Europeanized, who loses his power of doing good work on this side of the water, and who loses his love for his native land, is not a traitor; but he is a silly and undesirable citizen. He is as emphatically a noxious element in our body politic as is the man who comes here from abroad and remains a foreigner. Nothing will more quickly or more surely disqualify a man from doing good work in the world than the acquirement of that flaccid habit of mind which its possessors style cosmopolitanism.

Americanism means the virtues of courage, honor, justice, truth, sincerity, and hardihood—the virtues that made America. The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living and the get-rich-quick theory of life.

[Gaidin]

The ever shifting goal posts are evidence enough that this was never about Floyd, slavery or even racism; as Gaidin let slip, this is simply about the destruction of America's so-called "mythology". And I'm sure we'll all be much happier when the monuments dedicated to towering historical figures like Washington, Jefferson and Roosevelt are replaced with woke alternatives like Trayvon Martin, Kim Kardashian and Greta Thunberg.

The minute you really think that will happen is the minute you think that families will tolerate questions being asked by historians about their lives while their grandparents are still alive.

[pacifism]

And I'm asking again. Besides the two clowns that compete in which one is falling apart due to senility slower, who else is running? US need a break from the established two party system, and there's no better time like the present.

There were several third-party candidates that served to ease the conscience of some six million voters in the 2016 presidential election, which was almost three times as many votes cast for third-party candidates in 2012. The Greens and Libertarians even ran the same candidate in both elections. This sentiment isn't new, and I cannot sympathize more with the feeling that we should have better presidential candidates. Trump, Clinton, and Biden were my last picks for the party nominee each time, and by a long shot.

But, due to the plurality, winner-takes-all voting style in America, any third party is going to be a spoiler by varying amounts, with Ralph Nader as Exhibit A. I'm deeply critical of this system. It's what makes third party a catchall term for hopeless cause, something that strikes me as the root of a lot of our divisive, identity-based politics (not saying that identity politics never happens in more representative voting systems). However, now is not the time to take a third option and let the greater evil win because of reservations I have with the lesser evil.

[Cope]

It is easier for alternative (non-conventional) candidates to operate through the existing party structures than it is for them to found new parties. Trump effectively operated(s) as a third party candidate within the the Republican ecosystem, as did Sanders within the Dems' party framework. In a first past the post election, adding in additional candidates wouldn't achieve much other than reducing the vote share of the winner.

[Vanoi]

It is easier for alternative (non-conventional) candidates to operate through the existing party structures than it is for them to found new parties. Trump effectively operated(s) as a third party candidate within the the Republican ecosystem, as did Sanders within the Dems' party framework. In a first past the post election, adding in additional candidates wouldn't achieve much other than reducing the vote share of the winner.

I mostly agree with you there though this mostly applies to a federal level. Third parties wouldn't have a hard time winning local or state elections than national ones. If a third party could entrench itself locally and go beyond that ypu could definitely shake up the system.