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Thread: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

  1. #21
    Live2sculpt's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Quote Originally Posted by legate View Post
    3K is a good game. However the battles feel a bit arcadey with troops flying through the air and just falling over. The campaign is good but again bits of it feel cartoonish/arcady. Its a good title but I feel that they could have captured the atmosphere a bit better.

    Anyone know of good realism mods for 3K?
    Well that's just the point, much of that sort of modding isn't as popular or up to date as one might expect. The only two contenders for re-balancing and slowing down combat is Three Dragons and Under a Red Sky.

    As for "capturing the atmosphere", I've been studying the matter a bit, and have concluded that CA have captured and embraced the unique cultural hooks of China's relationship to this part of their national history and mythology, very well. They clearly put much extra effort into their research from the concept phase forward.

    The problem is that what the Chinese want to prioritize in a 3K title isn't the same as what works for westerners.

    Were it for me, it would be more realistic, with a very calm Art of War, Sun Tzu, vibe. As a white male american, I'm confronted with the discomfort of NOT being catered to, for once. But that's my problem. Clearly not CA's.

    I'm mostly because I'm so spoiled for a vibrant modding resource, and finding it not being represented in places I'm used to.

  2. #22
    M2TWRocks's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Social media has changed the landscape dramatically. Ten years ago twcenter was constantly busy and each game forum was filled with posts. It's just now very few people use forums like they used to. I stopped coming here after realizing that. It's like a ghost town. I only recently came back to pick up some old mods for ETW and NTW.

    I miss the old days.

  3. #23
    Live2sculpt's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Indeed. The last big modding push was for Rome 2. The only remaining question is whether or not the franchise can maintain it's momentum in the market without the robust "underground" modding scene behind it. There are several titles I would not have bothered with if I didn't have modding to look forward to.

    We'll just see.

    Maybe the Steam Workshop and the advent of crowdfunding services will be fertile enough ground for modding to continue on.

  4. #24
    z3n's Avatar State of Mind
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Personally I see the past great gasp of modding as being the shogun 2 since the campaign map can still be changed with enough (relatively extreme) skill. Although I do not discount DeIs tremendous efforts or the Attila modding scene.


    S2 campaign map modding is over the top difficult compared to M2TW. I really do not see modding on a large scale ever continuing again on later titles. Only many small tweaks and modifications without truly massive game changing and era changing over hauls which made the modding scene so popular and the TW games have such longevity.


    Most of all I think people would want campaign map modding back but CA doesn't want their DLCs to be affected I would guess which more than anything is why the editor hasn't been released.
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  5. #25
    Live2sculpt's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Quote Originally Posted by z3n View Post
    Personally I see the past great gasp of modding as being the shogun 2 since the campaign map can still be changed with enough (relatively extreme) skill. Although I do not discount DeIs tremendous efforts or the Attila modding scene.


    S2 campaign map modding is over the top difficult compared to M2TW. I really do not see modding on a large scale ever continuing again on later titles. Only many small tweaks and modifications without truly massive game changing and era changing over hauls which made the modding scene so popular and the TW games have such longevity.


    Most of all I think people would want campaign map modding back but CA doesn't want their DLCs to be affected I would guess which more than anything is why the editor hasn't been released.
    Well z3n, you'd know better than most.

    I'll just try to reason that the end of big mods is not yet nigh, in spite of my personal belief that major overhauls require well coordinated teams of volunteers and communication like twcenter has facilitated in the past.

    Let's all hope that the next generation are just "going through some changes", and that "The kids are all right"
    Last edited by Live2sculpt; March 02, 2020 at 12:29 AM. Reason: David Bowie, The Who ;)

  6. #26
    Steph's Avatar Maréchal de France
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Don't be to disappointed, it's probably a lot more alive than the warhammer one.

  7. #27

    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Doesn't Warhammer have map mods for the Grand Campaign? Thats quite good. I think the same is possible for 3 kingdoms no?

  8. #28
    z3n's Avatar State of Mind
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Unfortunately those are battle map mods, which I hear are not too difficult to create compared to the extremes of IWTE (a custom built settlement tool by modders wilddog and makanyane). True campaign map modding for example is if someone was crazy enough to attempt to recreate third age (leaving aside the liscensing issue with that which nips the idea in the bud) the campaign map could not be changed to suit this new continent.
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  9. #29
    Steph's Avatar Maréchal de France
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    The campaign map is not moddable for Warhammer. Well, you could change the existing settlement a little (like add some slots), or change a region from a province to another, or change the "climate" of a region , but not move or add settlement, nor create region, change borders, and even less change the coastlines, forest, mountains, etc.

    There is however a battle map editor. Which I tink can be linked to the campaign (so taht when you attack a specific settlement, the battle is played on a specific map).

  10. #30
    Sigma's Avatar Ducenarius
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    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    I've watched the modding community and TW games for a long time and it was Empire TW when the modding community hit a brick wall and started its decline. The refusal of CA (and likely SEGA having a hand in it) to release modding tools and put more features behind hard code caused a massive decline in new mods and what new mods came about were minor compared to M2TW and Rome 1 mods. Their reasoning at the time was that it would just be too difficult to make good modding tools for the Warscape Engine, but it's obvious now that the reason was because Empire is when they started making DLC packs for the games, and mods would cut into that short term revenue, from there it's only gotten worse.

    Their business strategy over the years has evolved, if you look back at RTW and M2TW, when they initially gave modding tools and made the games more accessible to modders, the strategy seemed to be making a game that could be enjoyed for a long time, usually through modding, and turn a profit over long term sales. By ETW the strategy seemed to start to shift to making a game that would turn the most sales in a short period of time while using community managers to quell the anger caused by bugs and lack of modding, so the sales aren't hurt and release DLC to milk some more money, a lot of the DLC being campaigns and features that could have been done through modding back in M2TW and RTW.

    Now it seems the strategy is to find an already established fandom (Romance of The Three Kingdoms, Warhammer Fantasy Battle), make a total war game that caters to that fandom and tap into it, release a PR statement about how the game is their top selling of all time, rake in the money, and release DLC to rake in more money, and maybe release a battle map editor down the road.

    Now despite all this I don't think it's because CA caught the greed bug, I think it's because SEGA has been hurting for money for the past few years and because of that has changed up the strategy and are only green lighting games that will appeal to larger audiences and trying not to take major risks. So you're seeing the big teams at CA working on titles they know will generate money while sagas is getting a smaller team, smaller settings, and the less profitable ideas.

  11. #31

    Default Re: SURPRISED; WHY is 3K forums so DEAD relative to other TW titles?

    Sigma, I agree with everything you said. I still think CA acts really unfair to modding community, DEI mod not only improved the base game but literally saved that title for thousands of people and at some point ROME II included many ideas from DEI mod to a base game.
    If CA would have a class then we would have modding tools for a game which is 7 years old and still can be improved a lot. They have all the prove that great mods help them to sell their games and yet they pull off licence crap again and again.

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