Thread: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

  1. #2681

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    Texas attorney general threatens to sue Austin officials if they don't lift local mask mandates

    Texas' attorney general on Wednesday threatened to sue officials in Austin and Travis County if they did not lift local mask mandates. The announcement comes after Governor Greg Abbott signed an executive order last week to lift the statewide mask mandate, despite warnings from health officials about reopening prematurely amid the coronavirus pandemic.

  2. #2682

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    Both Austria and Denmark have suspended use of AstraZeneca vaccine for the Chinese Bat Cave Lab Lung AIDS virus:
    Austria suspends AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine batch after death
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN2AZ0AO
    Denmark suspends vaccine 'as a precaution':
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-56357760

  3. #2683
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    What a bunch of dangerous conspiracy theorists, if only the government had control of the passage of information to root out such misinformation.
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    The trick is to never be honest. That's what this social phenomenon is engineering: publicly conform, or else.

  4. #2684
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    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    You can not call for conspiracy theorists when several governements decide to suspend one type of vaccine. It can be for safety reasons, for political reasons and/or commercial reasons. But obviously not to please conspiracy theorists.
    Note that it says "suspends". It can be a temporary measure until the doubt is gone.
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  5. #2685

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    There is no legitimate doubt. In the context of the EU's poor vaccine rollout, various European governments are attempting to save face by shifting blame onto the vaccine itself (in this case the AstraZeneca vaccine). It's a way of excusing the delays. Aexodus' comment is satirical: he's pointing out the hypocrisy in governments accusing vaccine sceptics of being conspiracy theorists while they pour baseless doubt on the vaccine's efficacy.
    Last edited by Cope; March 11, 2021 at 09:36 AM.

  6. #2686
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    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    That's exactly what I'm saying. If you're right, then it's for a political reason.
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  7. #2687

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifthrasir View Post
    That's exactly what I'm saying. If you're right, then it's for a political reason.
    See my edit regarding Aexodus' comment.

  8. #2688
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    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    Your claim doesn't make sens to me tbh. The astrazeneca is efficient, obviously less against some variant but still it avoids death and severe symptoms, easier to store and cheaper than other according to this article.
    What would be the point for european governements to deny that one especially? Just to cover their mess? That sounds odd
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  9. #2689

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    "For an administration that prides itself on talking straight about the pandemic, the self-congratulation Wednesday went too far.

    President Joe Biden wrongly claimed the U.S. vaccinated a record 2.9 million people on Saturday while his special adviser on the pandemic exaggerated the share of older Americans who’ve been fully immunized."
    https://apnews.com/article/ap-fact-c...58228bbe52f099

  10. #2690

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifthrasir View Post
    Your claim doesn't make sens to me tbh. The astrazeneca is efficient, obviously less against some variant but still it avoids death and severe symptoms, easier to store and cheaper than other according to this article.
    What would be the point for european governements to deny that one especially? Just to cover their mess? That sounds odd
    The point of European governments casting doubt on the AZ vaccine is that they want to excuse their relatively poor rollout. As you say, the AZ vaccine is efficient (and also safe), which leaves only a political explanation.

  11. #2691
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Legio_Italica View Post
    The studies I cited have nothing to do with the Great Barrington Declaration.
    You should have signed the GBD, an open letter arguing against lockdown policies and for “focused protection”, and arguing for herd immunity.They say that basic epidemiological theory indicates that lockdowns do not reduce the total number of cases in the long run and have never in history led to the eradication of a disease. At best, lockdowns delay the increase of cases for a finite period and at great cost, lockdowns harm the “working class”,lockdowns are causing harm to both mentall and physical health worldwide etc,etc exactly everything you are saying
    -------------
    I know I'm wasting my time, but read attentively.
    The Lancet,2021. Herd immunity for COVID-19 - The Lancet Respiratory Medicine
    In early October, 2020, three epidemiologists convened in Great Barrington, a small town in Massachusetts, USA. Jay Bhattacharya (Stanford University Medical School, Stanford, CA, USA), Sunetra Gupta (University of Oxford University, Oxford, UK) and Martin Kulldorff (Harvard University, Cambridge, MA, USA) were there to draft an argument for a new strategy to combat COVID-19. They called it the Great Barrington Declaration.
    “Current lockdown policies are producing devastating effects on short and long-term public health”, states the declaration. “Keeping the measures in place until a vaccine is available will cause irreparable damage, with the underprivileged disproportionately harmed...our goal should therefore be to minimize mortality and social harm until we reach herd immunity.” The authors recommended policymakers adopt an approach they termed “focused protection”. This entails easing restrictions on low-risk groups, with the intention of allowing them to establish immunity to severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) through natural infection, while simultaneously stepping up the protection of high-risk groups. For example, governments could fund short sabbaticals for vulnerable workers in public-facing jobs and provide accommodation for individuals who cannot easily maintain isolation in their own home.

    Within weeks, an opposing group of experts, also numbering in the thousands, had put their names to the John Snow Memorandum. The document, named after one of epidemiology's greatest historical figures, defended the restrictions to slow the spread of SARS-CoV-2 as “essential to reduce mortality, prevent health-care services from being overwhelmed, and buy time to set up pandemic response systems to suppress transmission”. It described focused protection as “a dangerous fallacy unsupported by scientific evidence” and warned that “uncontrolled transmission in younger people risks significant morbidity and mortality across the whole population”.
    The memorandum concluded by asserting that “controlling community spread of COVID-19 is the best way to protect our societies and economies until safe and effective vaccines and therapeutics arrive within the coming months”.
    Massachusetts General Hospital's Rochelle Walensky is one of the original signatories to the John Snow Memorandum. “The Great Barrington Declaration is predicated on the idea that you know who is going to get sick and you can somehow isolate and protect them, but there is absolutely no evidence that we can do this”, she said.
    She pointed out that the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates that up to 40% of Americans have some kind of co-morbidity that makes them vulnerable to the ravages of COVID-19. Identifying all these people is not straightforward. “No-one is suggesting that lockdowns should be the default position. They are a last resort.
    But if we just let the virus run free without mitigation strategies, such as masking, our hospitals will overflow and that would mean we would no longer be able to take care of the population's health across the board”, Walensky told The Lancet Respiratory Medicine.
    Kuldorff and colleagues reckon a focused protection approach would lead to herd immunity some time between 3 and 6 months, after which the vulnerable could return to normal life. (1)
    Walensky retorts that the herd immunity point has not been established, nor is it clear how stable this immunity would be. She noted that the 11 million infections and 250 000 deaths from COVID-19 that have been documented in the USA only constitute a small fraction of the total population. “I am not willing to stand behind a policy that leads to 10 or 15 times more deaths”, said Walensky. She would prefer to wait for herd immunity to be conferred by a vaccine. Most experts believe the earliest this could happen would be the second half of 2021.
    (1) A faulty premise.

    Btw, someone has rightly said that the Great B. Declaration “most important omission is its failure to meaningfully acknowledge the disproportionate burden of this disease on persons of color”
    You know,those negatively impacted by systemic racism.
    Every single time I heard the adjective “Great”, I can’t avoid feeling spontaneous urticaria, figuratively speaking.
    Here- and across Europe - we are doing what should be done, right now Portugal 'on track for mid-March reopening'? february 28
    The study suggests that by March 14 the tally of people in hospital should be down to 1,400, 240 of which will be in ICUs. By this time the Rt (transmission) rate will be down to ‘less than 0.7’. Working on the basis (already outlined by the government) that the first sector to reopen will be the schools catering for the youngest pupils.
    Last year Sweden, sacrificed the elderly
    They didn't try to save their lives. They were scared that the intensive care units would be overwhelmed and you couldn't take care of young people,” says Anders Vahlne, a professor of virology at the Karolinska Institute
    Well, have they achieved herd immunity? nope. This is what they have achieved, 1/3/21 Restrictions and prohibitions
    Authorities in Sweden have extended a series of coronavirus disease (COVID-19)-related restrictions through at least Feb. 7 following a rise in the number of cases. Officials have urged all nonessential public services to remain closed through Feb.
    Within Sweden, authorities have banned public gatherings and events of more than eight people; funerals can occur with up to 20 attendees. Officials allow a maximum of four people per table at bars or restaurants, though they prohibit alcohol sales from 2000. Nonessential public buildings, including bathhouses, museums, and sports halls, are closed until Feb. 7. Authorities could reimpose, extend, further ease, or otherwise amend any restrictions with little-to-no notice depending on disease activity over the coming weeks.
    Ths is the harsh reality. Of course, there are always those who deny everything: the inevitability,usefulness and necessity of lockdowns, the existence of systemic racism, and who knows,the relevance of man-made climate change.
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  12. #2692
    Lord Thesaurian's Avatar Lost in Limbo
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    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    You should have signed the GBD, an open letter arguing against lockdown policies and for “focused protection”, and arguing for herd immunity.They say that basic epidemiological theory indicates that lockdowns do not reduce the total number of cases in the long run and have never in history led to the eradication of a disease. At best, lockdowns delay the increase of cases for a finite period and at great cost, lockdowns harm the “working class”,lockdowns are causing harm to both mentall and physical health worldwide etc,etc exactly everything you are saying
    -------------
    I know I'm wasting my time, but read attentively.
    The Lancet,2021. Herd immunity for COVID-19 - The Lancet Respiratory Medicine


    (1) A faulty premise.

    Btw, someone has rightly said that the Great B. Declaration “most important omission is its failure to meaningfully acknowledge the disproportionate burden of this disease on persons of color”
    You know,those negatively impacted by systemic racism.
    Every single time I heard the adjective “Great”, I can’t avoid feeling spontaneous urticaria, figuratively speaking.
    Here- and across Europe - we are doing what should be done, right now Portugal 'on track for mid-March reopening'? february 28

    Last year Sweden, sacrificed the elderly
    .
    Well, have they achieved herd immunity? nope. This is what they have achieved, 1/3/21 Restrictions and prohibitions


    Ths is the harsh reality. Of course, there are always those who deny everything: the inevitability,usefulness and necessity of lockdowns, the existence of systemic racism, and who knows,the relevance of man-made climate change.
    Quote Originally Posted by Legio_Italica View Post
    The studies I cited have nothing to do with the Great Barrington Declaration.
    Neither do they have anything to do with herd immunity. Wisecracks about denialism are probably ill advised given you’ve already said yourself you “don’t care” about the evidence I’ve provided because “what happens on the practical ground” is what’s important to you.
    Last edited by Lord Thesaurian; March 11, 2021 at 05:56 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    No, we don't care about your libertarian "evidence".

  13. #2693

    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    You should have signed the GBD, an open letter arguing against lockdown policies and for “focused protection”, and arguing for herd immunity.They say that basic epidemiological theory indicates that lockdowns do not reduce the total number of cases in the long run and have never in history led to the eradication of a disease. At best, lockdowns delay the increase of cases for a finite period and at great cost, lockdowns harm the “working class”,lockdowns are causing harm to both mentall and physical health worldwide etc,etc exactly everything you are saying
    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus
    Btw, someone has rightly said that the Great B. Declaration “most important omission is its failure to meaningfully acknowledge the disproportionate burden of this disease on persons of color”
    You know,those negatively impacted by systemic racism.
    Large scale physical distancing measures and movement restrictions, often referred to as ‘lockdowns’, can slow COVID‑19 transmission by limiting contact between people.


    However, these measures can have a profound negative impact on individuals, communities, and societies by bringing social and economic life to a near stop. Such measures disproportionately affect disadvantaged groups, including people in poverty, migrants, internally displaced people and refugees, who most often live in overcrowded and under resourced settings, and depend on daily labour for subsistence.

  14. #2694
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    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Infidel144 View Post
    Large scale physical distancing measures and movement restrictions, often referred to as ‘lockdowns’, can slow COVID‑19 transmission by limiting contact between people.


    However, these measures can have a profound negative impact on individuals, communities, and societies by bringing social and economic life to a near stop. Such measures disproportionately affect disadvantaged groups, including people in poverty, migrants, internally displaced people and refugees, who most often live in overcrowded and under resourced settings, and depend on daily labour for subsistence.
    The insult to injury here is that not only did lockdowns have such harmful, cascading impacts even beyond what was originally anticipated, but one of the studies I quoted found they weren’t even as effective as other voluntary or at least less restrictive measures. The same found lockdowns may have even contributed to higher death rates among the most vulnerable, relative to the general population, than under comparably less restrictive measures. (think mass nursing home quarantines). The more evidence that develops as we move further out from the earliest days of the pandemic, the more disastrous lockdown policies are proven to be. And it was a mostly predictable outcome. In the end all those defending lockdowns will have to hang their hat on is unfalsifiable appeals to the trillions of people who would surely have died without lockdowns, even though studies have already shown these policies “were not associated with statistically significant reductions in the number of critical cases or overall mortality.”
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    No, we don't care about your libertarian "evidence".

  15. #2695

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    More countries (Norway, Iceland,Estonia, Lithuania, Luxembourg and Latvia) suspend the AZ jab:
    https://torontosun.com/news/world/de...d-clot-reports

  16. #2696
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Legio_Italica View Post
    you “don’t care” about the evidence I’ve provided because “what happens on the practical ground” is what’s important to you.The insult to injury here is that not only did lockdowns have such harmful, cascading impacts
    No, we don't care about your libertarian "evidence".This what we across the world (not me, us) care about: the resurgence of COVID-19 and new variants before/during/after Christmas in Europe is showing how difficult it is to balance health and the so-called economic/social imperative Covid: How are European countries tackling the pandemic.
    While some are starting to ease restrictions, others are extending lockdowns or introducing new regional measures
    Here, and today 12/03 Portugal launches its progressive deconfinement plan
    ...in January Portugal was the country in the world hardest hit by the Covid-19 pandemic, compared to its population of 10 million inhabitants.This forced him to impose a second general lockdown in mid-January. Beating at the end of January daily records of deaths (303 deaths) and contaminations (nearly 16,500 new cases) and with a peak in hospitalizations, Portugal had to resolve to accept help from Germany, Luxembourg and France to relieve its saturated hospitals.Thanks to strict confinement, the situation quickly improved. On Thursday, Portugal recorded 18 deaths and 627 new cases in 24 hours, while the number of patients in intensive care fell to 273 hospitalizations, the lowest level since the end of October.
    The alert threshold is: Rt 1; new cases 120/100.000 inhabitants
    Today we are under the alert threshold: Rt 0.80 ; new cases 106/100,000 inhabitants. However, the Rt has been rising: 0,66 (10-14/2) ; 0,68 (17-21/2); 0.71 (24-28/2)
    The Rt helps to keep numbers of infections at an acceptable level, and provides the roadmap for the movement restrictions. This is crucial not only to to reduce mortality but also to keep hospitals and intensive care units from being overwhelmed.

    Now I quote,COVID Reference, page 173,updated summary -13 February,
    The more transmissible SARS-CoV-2 variants are now dominant in England (B.1.1.7), South Africa (B.1.351) and Amazonia (P.1). Data from the UK, Denmark, Belgium and Switzerland show that B.1.1.7 replaces previously dominating strains in a predictable manner, progressing from 20% to 80% of the circulating viruses in 4 weeks (Figure 1, 7 and 11). After another few weeks of enhanced transmission, new epidemic waves might build as early as midMarch. In most of continental Europe and the US, Easter 2021 (4 April) may be recalled later as a B.1.1.7 Easter.
    While ‘hard’ lockdowns are apt at controlling the new variants (see below: UK, Ireland, South Africa), ‘soft’ lockdowns may not be sufficient (Figure 2).
    Fig 2. See here, Corona-Mutante B.1.1.7: Eine unsichtbare Welle baut sich auf

    Israel

    Even with an extended vaccination program plus a national lockdown, the third COVID-19 wave is only slowly coming under control...Of note, with more than 2 million children who cannot yet receive the coronavirus vaccine, Israel will not reach herd immunity anytime soon.

    Ireland

    The reason for the sudden resurgence is probably linked to a combination of factors: Christmas, pubs, restaurants, relaxation due to having done so well (less masks, less distancing) … plus B.1.1.7. Good news also from Ireland: lockdowns are efficient against B.1.1.7. After a peak of the rolling 7-day average on 10 January, the numbers decreased rapidly.

    France

    B.1.351 and P.1 (first detected in South Africa and Brazil, respectively) now represent 4% to 5% of new cases. Over the last week, some 500 cases of B.1.351 and P.1 have been detected in local outbreaks in Moselle (Le Monde, 12 February). Various mayors of the region are considering a lockdown.
    Transmission
    The epidemiological consequences of B.1.1.7, B.1.351, P.1 and those variants to come are currently not predictable. It is acknowledged that they probably all have a substantial transmission advantage.
    --------------
    Of course, there is another way to keep hospitals and ICU units from being overhelmed when the Rt is rising: a compulsory Jewish Covid badge on the left side of the chest of those seriously ill, and voilà, send them home to die-emulating the Sweden example, How the elderly in Sweden are being neglected and murdered with a shot of morphine (2020)

    Your ideological brothers - the Libertarian Koch brothers - have assembled a network of allies to promote their agenda, and this is especcialy the case concerning climate denial-and now they have turned their attention to the COVID crisis - Koch & COVIDenial
    The GBD declaration was sponsored by the American Institute for Economic Research, funded by the Koch brothers.Here's a look at the three authors of the GBD at the American Institute for Economic Research
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 





    I can't avoid thinking that the libertarian pandemic policy relies on an amazing formula:” Confinement is a dictatorship. What am I? your mother?”
    Libertarian Candidate Jorgensen Shares Views On COVID-19 ...
    During her remarks at Hart Park, Jorgensen reached out to conservatives by encouraging citizens nationwide to challenge state-ordered business restrictions aimed at reducing the spread of COVID-19. "This is the land of the free home of the brave”.
    Contrary to what libertarian luminaries may think...A Libertarian Analysis of the COVID-19 Pandemic | Mises Institute
    “the governments of most nations have wildly overestimated the threat to human life posed by this disease. They have used scare tactics to vastly inflate their power. COVID-19 does indeed pose a serious threat to the elderly and the seriously ill, but to virtually no one else... If I had to choose sides, I would choose the side that says that COVID is relatively harmless. Why? That is the view opposite that of most governments”
    ...the infection fatality rate of the virus is several-fold higher than that of seasonal influenza, and this multisystem infection/ inflamatory disease Covid-19: a complex multisystem clinical syndrome - The BMJ can lead to persisting illness (long covid) including young, healthy people. Nature News 04 March 2021. US health agency will invest $1 billion to investigate 'long covid.
    -----------------------
    Leaving aside the libertarian utopia, if you were prime minister or president ( an impossibility for a libertarian), what would you do?
    Last edited by Ludicus; March 12, 2021 at 03:24 PM.
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    Every human society must justify its inequalities: reasons must be found because, without them, the whole political and social edifice is in danger of collapsing”.
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  17. #2697
    Lord Thesaurian's Avatar Lost in Limbo
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    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    No, we don't care about your libertarian "evidence".This what we (not me, us) care about.
    ------
    The resurgence of COVID-19 and new variants before/during/after Christmas in Europe is showing how difficult it is to balance health and the so-called economic/social imperative Covid: How are European countries tackling the pandemic.


    Here, and today 12/03 Portugal launches its progressive deconfinement plan

    The alert threshold is: Rt 1; new cases 120/100.000 inhabitants
    Today we are under the alert threshold: Rt 0.80 ; new cases 106/100,000 inhabitants. However, the Rt has been rising: 0,66 (10-14/2) ; 0,68 (17-21/2); 0.71 (24-28/2)
    The Rt helps to keep numbers of infections at an acceptable level, and provides the roadmap for the movement restrictions. This is crucial not only to to reduce mortality but also to keep hospitals and intensive care units from being overwhelmed.

    Now I quote,COVID Reference, page 173,updated summary -13 February,

    --------------
    Of course, there is another way to keep hospitals and ICU units from being overhelmed when the Rt is rising: a compulsory Jewish Covid badge on the left side of the chest of those seriously ill, and voilà, send them home to die-emulating the Sweden example, How the elderly in Sweden are being neglected and murdered with a shot of morphine (2020)

    Your ideological brothers - the Libertarian Kock brothers - have assembled a network of allies to promote their agenda, and this is especcialy the case concerning climate denial-and now they have turned their attention to the COVID crisis - Koch & COVIDenial
    The GBD declaration was sponsored by the American Institute for Economic Research, funded by the Kock brothers.The three authors of the GBD at the American Institute for Economic Research
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 





    I can't avoid thinking that the libertarian pandemic policy relies on an amazing formula:” Confinement is a dictatorship. What am I? your mother?”
    Libertarian Candidate Jorgensen Shares Views On COVID-19 ...


    Contrary to what libertarian luminaries may think...A Libertarian Analysis of the COVID-19 Pandemic | Mises Institute


    ...the infection fatality rate of the virus is several-fold higher than that of seasonal influenza, and this multisystem infection/ inflamatory disease Covid-19: a complex multisystem clinical syndrome - The BMJ can lead to persisting illness (long covid) including young, healthy people. Nature News 04 March 2021. US health agency will invest $1 billion to investigate 'long covid.
    -----------------------
    If you were prime minister or president, what would you do?
    Again, categorically dismissing peer-reviewed studies and empirical evidence from global cross-country data as “libertarian” or “political” doesn’t make it so just because you don’t like what the evidence says. I fully addressed the one (1) relevant cross-country study you provided this entire time. Based on both your flippant mischaracterization of its findings and your habitual lack of relevant response, it seems that yet again, you have nothing to offer but seething, libelous rhetoric and strawmen. It also appears your latest round of random links is a compilation of news articles and blogs. If you’ve provided any academic studies or quotes from actual papers, you should provide coherent quotes and links, and skip the rest. As is, there’s nothing to discuss.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    No, we don't care about your libertarian "evidence".

  18. #2698

    Default Re: Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

    It looks as though Frau Whitmer, beloved of totalitarians who demand lockdowns, is refusing to release the Chinese Cave Bat Lab Lung Aids virus related death in nursing homes data:

    "Whitmer signed an executive order on April 15 demanding long-term care facilities “must not prohibit admission or readmission of a resident based on COVID-19 testing requirements or results,” and renewed the policy several times until it was rescinded in September. New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo passed similar orders last year and engaged in a cover-up which has left the governor in the fight for his political life against calls for impeachment.

    Whitmer, who now faces potential criminal charges of her own, appears to be engaging in a cover-up as her administration heads to court to keep state death data on nursing homes hidden from public view."
    https://thefederalist.com/2021/03/10...id-death-data/

  19. #2699
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Legio_Italica View Post
    Again, categorically dismissing peer-reviewed studies and empirical evidence from global cross-country data
    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    Leaving aside the libertarian utopia, if you were prime minister or president ( an impossibility for a libertarian), what would you do?
    Our deconfinement plan was made by epidemiologists, public health specialists and specialists in health economics. The reason I'm asking you this is because it seems that they have forgotten to invite our libertarians and far right populists.For example, from the post above,
    totalitarians who demand lockdowns,
    In Brazil Covid: Bolsonaro tells Brazilians to stop 'whining' as deaths as Brazil’s already dire Covid situation deteriorated and its average daily death toll rose above that of the United States. “How long are you going to keep on crying?”
    Bolsonaro has consistently opposed quarantine measures introduced by governors, arguing the collateral damage to the economy will be worse than the effects of the virus itself.
    How many of you think that sounds familiar?
    You still haven't answered my question: if you were an European or Israelite prime minister or the French president, what would you do?
    Bil Gates has a plan to save the world. What about you?
    Last edited by Ludicus; March 12, 2021 at 04:21 PM.
    Il y a quelque chose de pire que d'avoir une âme perverse. C’est d'avoir une âme habituée
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    Every human society must justify its inequalities: reasons must be found because, without them, the whole political and social edifice is in danger of collapsing”.
    Thomas Piketty

  20. #2700
    Lord Thesaurian's Avatar Lost in Limbo
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    Default Re: The Potential Lab Origin of COVID-19

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    Our deconfinement plan was made by epidemiologists, public health specialists and specialists in health economics. The reason I'm asking you this is because it seems that they have forgotten to invite our libertarians and far right populists.For example, from the post above,


    In Brazil Covid: Bolsonaro tells Brazilians to stop 'whining' as deaths as Brazil’s already dire Covid situation deteriorated and its average daily death toll rose above that of the United States. “How long are you going to keep on crying?”

    How many of you think that sounds familiar?
    You still haven't answered my question: if you were an European or Israelite prime minister or the French president, what would you do?
    Bil Gates has a plan to save the world. What about you?
    Continually invoking Godwin’s Law to avoid response is lazy and boring. I’m not interested in rhetorical questions, and it doesn’t matter what I would do. We already know proven methods to reduce transmission risk that don’t involve trying to lockdown countries in return for minimal proven benefit at immense human and economic cost. And there are countries that did so.
    Social distancing should be adapted and used alongside other strategies to reduce transmission, such as air hygiene, involving in part maximizing and adapting ventilation to specific indoor spaces, effective hand washing, regular surface cleaning, face coverings where appropriate and prompt isolation of affected individuals.

    https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/what-i...-transmission/
    Click here to learn how you can publish Total War news, reviews, history and much more for TWC community publications.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    No, we don't care about your libertarian "evidence".

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