Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

[tgoodenow]

I haven't seen one article claiming the Germans were upset over it.

Do you need daddy to fetch you some articles or do you want to use google?

[Vanoi]

Do you need daddy to fetch you some articles or do you want to use google?

You could always just back up the claims you make.

[Gigantus]

If Americans are banned from traveling to the EU, does that apply to American soldiers as well? If so can we ship them all home or do you guys still need baby sitting?

Well, travel to the US has been banned since March on Donald's order as has been pointed out, so you may have to wait until THAT restriction is lifted to ship them home.

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

If Americans are banned from traveling to the EU, does that apply to American soldiers as well? If so can we ship them all home or do you guys still need baby sitting?

Some real facts:

After Ben Hodges, former CiC for US troups in Europe, only 10700 of the 37000 soldiers in Germany are from real combat troups, the rest is support troops for a quick build up of US troops in a NATO defense case in Europe, but their main task is supporting the transport of reinforcements and replenishments for US operations in Africa and Near East, Afghanistan via Ramstein Air Base. Additionally the biggest US Army hospital outside of the US is in Landstuhl/Germany.

No, zero. No strategic analysis will conclude that the US will be better off if it reduces its presence in Germany. We are already extremely thin in terms of personnel. We're still 34,000 people. I'm a fan of Eintracht Frankfurt. 51,000 people fit in their stadium. We wouldn't get that fully. There is only one battalion for each special task. If we take 30 percent of it away, some areas of the task are practically 100 percent disabled. The US troops in Germany are primarily used to provide quick support for forces that come from the USA with logistics, administration or communication. The only real combat troops we have are based in Vilseck, Bavaria. That's it. Everything else is needed to support American units on the way to Africa or the Middle East, for example.

https://www.rnd.de/politik/us-truppe...TTYS2ETHY.html

So draw back your troups, it will cause more problems for the US themselves than for Germany.

This whole drawback is only a distraction from his failure in handling the Corona Crisis (and a "revenge" for Merkel's refusal to come soon for a G7 summit in Washington to show, that everything is normal).

[Cyclops]

...The threat of getting Covid from US soldiers is pitifully small. The US likely tests soldiers it sends overseas so they don't spread the virus among their own bases.
...

This raises an interesting point, something Mrs Cyclops has commented on.

The US has the best plague control capability in the world. They have all the viruses, they have the money, the infrastructure, the experts, the CDC, a huge (yuge!) health industry and pharma as well. Their large armed forces have ABC capabilities (and B incudes V) and can work as ancillaries to civilian measures.

Anyone in Australia with a decent high level knowledge or praxis in this area has studied in the US and this would likely be true in most countries. In Australia we've kept infection rates low (OK there's a minor outbreak in my city because hotel quarantine guests were having sex with semi-literate security guards-the infection rate spiked to 70 a day) using the playbooks started by the French and British epidemiologists of the 19th century, and perfected by the CDC.

US wealth and connectedness (long land borders and the most air arrivals of anywhere) means you cannot keep the virus out, but you can bag it once it arrives, as Israel shows. Technically there is no country in the world better set up to contain COVID 19 than the US (NSA, multiple law enforcement branches etc). I have to say if the US has out of control infection rates its because you are choosing to do so. The US has a political problem, not a health problem.

Can people in the US get of the presidents back and let him lead? And can he lead please? It'd be nice if the US wasn't a health risk for the rest of us.

[swabian]

[QUOTE=Cyclops;15930835]

Anyone in Australia with a decent high level knowledge or praxis in this area has studied in the US and this would likely be true in most countries.

That's not an outright necessity, but it might be with regard to some local tortoises that just aren't bothering so much and prefer to keep their heads down.

In Australia we've kept infection rates low (OK there's a minor outbreak in my city because hotel quarantine guests were having sex with semi-literate security guards-the infection rate spiked to 70 a day) using the playbooks started by the French and British epidemiologists of the 19th century, and perfected by the CDC.

The CDC cannot do anything without data coming from outside. The US might have the worlds best laboratories (although i would be almost sceptical about American science which is not explicitly defense-oriented). Because the only thing the Yanks can build and sell is guns and missiles.

US wealth and connectedness (long land borders and the most air arrivals of anywhere) means you cannot keep the virus out, but you can bag it once it arrives, as Israel shows. Technically there is no country in the world better set up to contain COVID 19 than the US

I think it's really Iceland or the Faroer/Faeringjar Islands lol. The US is technologically best set up but otherwise totally devastated - and i don't even find it funny anymore. There is no schadenfreude to enjoy it, because they have heavy air traffic and they might add 3rd or 4th wave, if they don't start the 2nd wave. ANd how can you even enjoy so much vicarious embarassment? It's crooked.

I'm sorry about what i said, can we get back to discussion business again? I didn't mean it.

[Ludicus]

I have to say if the US has out of control infection rates its because you are choosing to do so.

I agree. In fact, everything else becomes collateral and almost irrelevant (health industry, hegemonic power, armed forces, nuclear bombs, etc). Health industry and public health aren't the same thing. The US is only major civilized country without a proper public health service. I think that speaks volumes.The anti-China campaign in the U.S. is a distraction from Trump's mishandling of the pandemic.

Do these scans suggest that even asymptomatic cases are causing lung damage?

Absolutely.I would say that, generally speaking, the symptoms underestimate the severity of the disease. But we can't predict how an individual's case will progress, with temporary damage ( that's what I think) or permanent lung fibrosis and chronic respiratory failure ( much less likely) .Let's also keep in mind that the coronavirus infection is a multi‐organ disease.

[sumskilz]

US wealth and connectedness (long land borders and the most air arrivals of anywhere) means you cannot keep the virus out, but you can bag it once it arrives, as Israel shows.

Update on that. Israel went from over 700 new cases daily in early April to less than 10 new daily cases per day by mid May, most of them already in quarantine. Then the government caved to economic concerns and reopened too quickly at just about the same time the Shin Bet's temporary permission to track people's movements via cell phones expired. The result was the daily number of cases shot back up as fast as it did the first time, presumably just from the seed of a few undetected asymptomatic people. Which is unfortunate because completely eradicating it within the borders like New Zealand did was within sight. If everybody could have remained patient for just another two or three weeks, it probably would have been over locally, which would have meant less economic damage in the long run. Now, to a lot of people, it feels like the initial economic losses were all a waste. Although I don't think that's entirely true, it almost certainly was a wasted opportunity not to stick it out just a bit longer.

The Knesset has since unanimously voted to reinstate the Shin Bet's permission to track, and no one is really complaining about it, so there wasn't any pressure there, it was just lack of focus on the government's part during the transition.

[PointOfViewGun]

Well, travel to the US has been banned since March on Donald's order as has been pointed out, so you may have to wait until THAT restriction is lifted to ship them home.

For accuracy sake, there was never a ban. Citizens and residents can travel to USA.

[tgoodenow]

A surprising new study found that the controversial antimalarial drug hydroxychloroquine helped patients better survive in the hospital.A team at Henry Ford Health System in Southeast Michigan said Thursday its study of 2,541 hospitalized patients found that those given hydroxychloroquine were much less likely to die.

Dr. Marcus Zervos, division head of infectious disease for Henry Ford Health System, said 26% of those not given hydroxychloroquine died, compared to 13% of those who got the drug. The team looked back at everyone treated in the hospital system since the first patient in March.

"Overall crude mortality rates were 18.1% in the entire cohort, 13.5% in the hydroxychloroquine alone group, 20.1% among those receiving hydroxychloroquine plus azithromycin, 22.4% among the azithromycin alone group, and 26.4% for neither drug," the team wrote in a report published in the International Journal of Infectious Diseases.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/02/healt...udy/index.html

[Cyclops]

Update on that. Israel went from over 700 new cases daily in early April to less than 10 new daily cases per day by mid May, most of them already in quarantine. Then the government caved to economic concerns and reopened too quickly at just about the same time the Shin Bet's temporary permission to track people's movements via cell phones expired. The result was the daily number of cases shot back up as fast as it did the first time, presumably just from the seed of a few undetected asymptomatic people. Which is unfortunate because completely eradicating it within the borders like New Zealand did was within sight. If everybody could have remained patient for just another two or three weeks, it probably would have been over locally, which would have meant less economic damage in the long run. Now, to a lot of people, it feels like the initial economic losses were all a waste. Although I don't think that's entirely true, it almost certainly was a wasted opportunity not to stick it out just a bit longer.

The Knesset has since unanimously voted to reinstate the Shin Bet's permission to track, and no one is really complaining about it, so there wasn't any pressure there, it was just lack of focus on the government's part during the transition.

Our little outbreak in Melbourne seems to be under control but there's a few more bad days of numbers to come because of data lag, hopefully its in the bag again. Similarly a loss of focus was behind the outbreak: there were some low paid security guards at one of the quarantine sites and their ethnic group hadn't been targeted for translated information. The State govt was advise to use the Defense forces for the security jobs, and the Feds were warned about outreach to non-English speakers but everyone's shouting atm so its not inexplicable why it happened.

[swabian]

New Zealand?

[sumskilz]

New Zealand?

Yeah, New Zealand was able to completely eliminate it within their borders. They initially had something like 1,500 cases, but they've only had a handful of new cases since early May, and from what I understand, those have all been recent arrivals, which they quarantine.

[swabian]

Glad for them. Thanks for the information.

[Cyclops]

So we're delaying most students from going back to school, closing the Victoria border (well the rest of the country is locking us in) and returning to Phase 3 in the Metropolitan area here as there were almost 200 cases in Melbourne yesterday.

A failure by two staff at one site has let the cat out of the bag. I was hopeful they would bag it at the first hundred or so, but looks like the restrictions are back for at least six weeks, which will send a lot of businesses to the wall.

[Ludicus]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/02/healt...udy/index.html

Randomized controlled studies are considered to be more reliable than observational studies, when evaluating treatment effectiveness. In this observational study, concomitant steroid use in patients receiving HCQ was more than double the non-treated group.
Welcome — RECOVERY Trial

Dexamethasone reduced deaths by one-third in ventilated patients (rate ratio 0.65 [95% confidence interval 0.48 to 0.88]; p=0.0003) and by one fifth in other patients receiving oxygen only (0.80 [0.67 to 0.96]; p=0.0021). There was no benefit among those patients who did not require respiratory support (1.22 [0.86 to 1.75]; p=0.14).
Based on these results, 1 death would be prevented by treatment of around 8 ventilated patients or around 25 patients requiring oxygen alone.

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Follow the link

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New Zealand is little island country, the borders remain closed to foreign travellers, and rules remain in place requiring New Zealanders arriving from abroad to go through a 14-day period of isolation/quarantine. And yet, New Zealand's economy shrinks by the most since 1991.
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Lockdowns and quarantines can't last forever.We should avoid groups,keep always safe distance, and wear a mask whenever we are in public- and beware public transports.
What cannot happen. Or else, we aren't going anywhere.

Here...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

On in the US,

Alabama college students with coronavirus threw parties, bet on who'd get sick next: ... “They put money in a pot, and they try to get COVID.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

This is an intentional,criminal behaviour.
As a side note, let's not minimise the risk of mass demonstrations during the pandemic.

[irontaino]

Brazilian president, walking talking environmental disaster and racist extraordinaire Jair Bolsonaro has tested positive for Covid-19.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Sar1n]

Karma.. Unfortunately a bit too late.

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

He should have worn a face mask and shouldn't have vetoed against them for using them in churchs.

[Ludicus]

Brazilian president, walking talking environmental disaster and racist extraordinaire Jair Bolsonaro has tested positive for Covid-19.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Boris Johnson- an intelligent man- learned his lesson,

This evening I was honoured to host those who looked after me at St Thomas’ Hospital at Downing Street, as we celebrate 72 years of our incredible NHS.

Boris mets Jenny McGee (New Zealand) and Luis Pitarma ( Portugal), the NHS "heroes" who saved his life.



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Bolsonaro is an unbelievable idiot, he will never retract his words.Three months ago,he said "wouldn't feel anything" (sic) if infected with Covid-19.