Coronavirus outbreak - From China to the World.

[Ludicus]

Government intervention in economy is socialist.

Socialism is great for rich bankers, but not for ordinary people.During the financial crisis of 2008, instead of letting the market punish the banks,the US government bailed them out.

Cronyism is socialist

Crony capitalism rings a bell?
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It is with great sadness that I say, here begins the collapse of the European Union. Just a couple of days ago- read the statements from Netherlands finance minister Wopke Hoekstra about the dangers of fanning moral hazard
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During today's meeting organized by the European Council, nine EU countries have called for mutualised debt ("Coronabonds"/eurobonds) in order to fight the crisis. Hoekstra blocked the eurobonds, and pointed the finger of blame at Spain, calling for an investigation into how Spain manages its budget.
An Italian ultimatum gave the European Council 15 days to solve this issue. "Italy will not forget the shameful lack of solidarity", said Giuseppe Conte.
Portuguese Prime Minister Antonio Costa called Hoekstra's speech "totally repugnant" Discurso de ministro holandês é ″repugnante″, diz Costa - DN
A speech that undermines the foundations of the European Union, he added.

[Morifea]

Government intervention in economy is socialist. Cronyism is socialist by the very definition of the term itself.

What about naming one Government, that has never intervened in economy? Your understanding of the term "capitalism" is as faulty as that of "socialism" and everything between.

But concrats, you managed to derail a thread about an important topic with an excellent OP.

[Exarch]

Did China suddenly not arrest those doctors for trying to warn about the disease? Thats a cover up. You also just admitted officals and leaders in Huebi were dismissed over this. Contradicting yourself now?

Weak argument; the matter of Dr Li Wen Liang has been resolved, but since you're desperate to keep beating a dead horse:


btw, whatever happened to the PPE that American doctors, sorry; white american doctors desperately need?

Yeah, the same doctors who were told by the Trump admin.specifically Ron Vara/Peter Navarro that they didn't need 60,000 ventilators?

Just before we continue, have you ever worked in a hospital?

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/ar...-blame/608332/

The idea there was no cover up is ridi

LOL There's nothing more pathetic than watching the American Establishment try to re-gain control of the narrative now that they've lost it utterly, maybe they should explain to this nurse why they decided to release an American bioweapon against a Chinese city, only to have it rebound on their own population?

This fb post just in today from a nurse:


Speaking of cover ups; why are American hospitals and officials trying to silence Nurses and doctors who speak out? Can you answer that?

So one article about nurses who were threatened to be fired and a twitter post about the lack of PPE equipment in the US. How does this compare to China arresting doctors and covering up the outbreak?

Spoken like someone who's never worked in healthcare; without PPE, sending these doctors and nurses into the ER is like sending them to their deaths for no reason, it's like sending American soldiers dressed up in nothing but paper armour and weapons; not giving these brave men and women ventilators is like asking them to just hold the hands of the dying as they die in blood.

But of course, i expected nothing less from americans who would sacrifice lives just for a few random ticks on a spreadsheet.

America is now No.1 for total cases of COVID-19, and may even beat Europe for total deaths. You're looking at revolutionary conditions if not civil war.

[Vanoi]

Weak argument; the matter of Dr Li Wen Liang has been resolved, but since you're desperate to keep beating a dead horse:

https://www.axios.com/timeline-the-e...718a5faab.html

China destroyed samples related to the virus and continued to hold and question Li Wen even after Wuhan officials admitted they were dealing with an unknown virus. Why?

Its a blatant cover-up. To the point that China dismissed officials and had to exonerate a dead doctor they arrested for warning about the virus.

LOL There's nothing more pathetic than watching the American Establishment try to re-gain control of the narrative now that they've lost it utterly, maybe they should explain to this nurse why they decided to release an American bioweapon against a Chinese city, only to have it rebound on their own population?

This fb post just in today from a nurse:


Speaking of cover ups; why are American hospitals and officials trying to silence Nurses and doctors who speak out? Can you answer that?

American bio-weapon? You mean Chinese wet markets selling endangered animals next to raw meat? China has tried to control the narrative since the beginning. Like arresting a doctor.

Spoken like someone who's never worked in healthcare; without PPE, sending these doctors and nurses into the ER is like sending them to their deaths for no reason, it's like sending American soldiers dressed up in nothing but paper armour and weapons; not giving these brave men and women ventilators is like asking them to just hold the hands of the dying as they die in blood.

But of course, i expected nothing less from americans who would sacrifice lives just for a few random ticks on a spreadsheet.

America is now No.1 for total cases of COVID-19, and may even beat Europe for total deaths. You're looking at revolutionary conditions if not civil war.

Like i said, China itself had a PPE shortage during its outbreak. In fact the entire world is facing shortages right now. And its going to get worse with the infection spreading to the main producers of PPE equipment like Malaysia.

[Mithradates]

Spanish Doctors Are Forced to Choose Who to Let Die

As the country becomes the pandemic’s hotspot, people are dying in hospital waiting rooms before they can even be admitted.

Intensive-care wards overflowing and new rules dictate that older patients miss out to younger people with a better shot at surviving, Bernabeu said by telephone. “That grandpa, in any other situation, would have had a chance,” he said. “But there’s so many of them, all dying at the same time.”

"just a flu..."

[Morifea]

@Mithradates: Spain is going down, poor souls. How is the situation is Hungary?

[mishkin]

"just a flu..."

Who are you quoting?

[antaeus]

Like i said, China itself had a PPE shortage during its outbreak. In fact the entire world is facing shortages right now. And its going to get worse with the infection spreading to the main producers of PPE equipment like Malaysia.

China's equipment shortages were so acute that they sought both private and public sector help from around the world in January. It is the response to this call for help which has led to shortages elsewhere now. An awkward situation because I understand China's need at the time. But people are probably dying now because of it.

[Exarch]

https://www.axios.com/timeline-the-e...718a5faab.html

China destroyed samples related to the virus and continued to hold and question Li Wen even after Wuhan officials admitted they were dealing with an unknown virus. Why?

er, because they were dealing with a highly infectious unknown agent and if they weren't going to be sending the samples to military laboratories, they were ordered to destroy them?

Do you think private labs keep virulent biological agents around for fun? If you don't have the facilities to hold them, then you get leakages and contamination like what happened with Maatje Benassi's husband who worked for such a facility in america, gave it to her, then she went and spread it across Wuhan during the Military Games.

Its a blatant cover-up. To the point that China dismissed officials and had to exonerate a dead doctor they arrested for warning about the virus.

Such a cover up that the Central Government exonerated, commended and lauded the doctor and punished the local officials who hid it from the Central Government. Seems like that's the crux you're fixated on ignoring because it's better for you to focus on that than the glaring reality outside your window that your central government in Washington is perfectly happy for a americans, even white american females like yourself, to die from COVID-19.

Like i said, China itself had a PPE shortage during its outbreak. In fact the entire world is facing shortages right now. And its going to get worse with the infection spreading to the main producers of PPE equipment like Malaysia.

Yes, China had a PPE shortage in the beginning and mustered the entire nation around to do what needed to be done.

Perhaps the same USG that war-gamed for pandemics (this article from your rag, the Atlantic: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...mp-cdc/608215/) and who said that they were best prepared for a pandemic, should have prepared better than China:



Perhaps the USG should explain to these trash bag wearing American nurses where the hell their PPE and Outbreak suits are:


For instance, this is what medical staff going up against COVID-19 in China wear:

Exactly what you'd expect to wear when having to deal with a biological warfare attack from a hostile nation. The fact that US embassy staff sent to get their people out from Wuhan were wearing the same level of protection should speak volumes as to how much they really know about this virus.

The America of the common man is nowhere near prepared for the storm that Coronavirus is going to inflict on the american people. Trump supporters like Breitbart, and evidently yourself use decent americans as human shields to escape justice. In order to deflect from the massive storm that coronavirus is going to be next week when deaths start reaching 10s or even 100s of 000s, Trump and Pompeo are going to try and start ww3 because why the hell not for a bunch of old 70-somethings who are out of cialis and have to resort to self love because of self isolation.

[Infidel144]

er, because they were dealing with a highly infectious unknown agent and if they weren't going to be sending the samples to military laboratories, they were ordered to destroy them?

Who ordered China to destroy the samples?

[Exarch]

The show that is the USG/Trump admin. handling of COVID-19 continues:

Internal Emails Show How Chaos at the CDC Slowed the Early Response to Coronavirus

The CDC fumbled its communication with public health officials and underestimated the threat of the coronavirus even as it gained a foothold in the United States, according to hundreds of pages of documents ProPublica obtained.

Source: https://www.propublica.org/article/i...to-coronavirus

Oh and whatever happened to the billions of dollars in health equipment the USG was supposed to purchase to save american lives? They got ditched since it would have cost US mega corps. millions in profits:

Trump WonÂ’t Order Vital Coronavirus Supplies Because Corporate CEOs Asked Him Not To


TheyÂ’re worried it could be bad for business.

Source: https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020...production-act

Also, using taxpayer monies to purchase life saving machines that could save american lives is considered...unacceptable for America's leaders:

White House Considers $1 Billion Price Tag for Ventilators — and Has Second Thoughts


A deal with General Motors and Ventec Life Systems to produce tens of thousands of the critical lifesaving devices seemed imminent. Then the announcement was pulled back.

I must say, for a country that makes a big deal about Human Rights, it certainly doesn't seem to think human life is a right at all.

Which brings me to the reason why there is such a shortage of medical supplies for US medical staff, part of it is a downstream effect of the trade war:

Coronavirus: trade war with China weakens crucial links in US medical supply chain

• Trump administration hardliners resist medical supply imports despite Covid-19Â’s toll
• ‘The main distinction between Europe and the US in terms of lack of preparedness is that ours is more self-inflicted. We put tariffs on all of those productsÂ’

Source: https://www.scmp.com/news/china/dipl...nks-us-medical

Oh and btw, just so that it will save lives even though some americans here would prefer to die for the freedom of drinking bat soup, but masks don't have to be designated N95 to have the same standards as N95; that's just a crappy american classification to prevent foreign equivalents from gaining a foothold in the american N95 market; other comparables include the Chinese KN95 and the Japanese DS.

Since america values profits over lives, american doctors and nurses are forced to re-use N95s for weeks on end, even being asked to use ing scarves. Are you kidding me? Against COVID-19? Makes my blood boil.

Most of the american twcenter posters here can afford the pc master race gaming rigs required to play these games; ie they come from privileged backgrounds, so never have to deal with this sort of crap:

More than 3 million Americans filed for unemployment claims last week

"It's beyond anything we have ever seen. ItÂ’s the speed that is so painful," one economist said.

Source: https://www.nbcnews.com/business/bus...-week-n1169266

This is some Weimerica stuff, only the goose stepping morons are already incumbents and the street battles were so 2017 and the Goebbels and Goerings of the US are intent on starting a war with just about anyone.

[Infidel144]

Oh and whatever happened to the billions of dollars in health equipment the USG was supposed to purchase to save american lives? They got ditched since it would have cost US mega corps. millions in profits:

Trump WonÂ’t Order Vital Coronavirus Supplies Because Corporate CEOs Asked Him Not To



TheyÂ’re worried it could be bad for business.

Source: https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020...production-act

Hmmm... Maybe I'm missing something here, but the claim and headline do not seem to match the article. The factual information in the article indicates not that he wont order supplies, but rather Trump has not invoked the Defense Production Act to, hmmm... 'take over' private companies and compel them to make the "supplies".
The article also seems to indicate that companies are doing this with out the DPA being invoked.

Edit:
Oh yeah, who ordered China to destroy the samples?

[tgoodenow]

Microbiology experts in Spain have said that rapid coronavirus tests that the country bought from China are not consistently detecting positive cases.

The error was discovered as Spain is in the grip of one of the worst coronavirus outbreaks in the world, second only to Italy in the number of reported deaths.

Studies on the tests done in Spain found that they had only 30% sensitivity, meaning they correctly identify people with the virus only 30% of the time, sources told the Spanish newspaper El País.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bus...s-2020-3%3famp

Wow China thanks for the help

[Ludicus]

Coronavirus response, the European Disunion. In more detail


“Repugnant!”: PM Costa launches extraordinary attack on ...

Portugal’s prime minister António Costa has launched an extraordinary attack on Dutch finance minister Wopke Hoekstra, one of the four key moneymen standing in the way of a concerted European plan to face the economic recession caused by Covid-19.
The moment came during the tense EU ‘summit’ that went ahead yesterday via videolink.
Hoekstra suggested the EU “should investigate countries like Spain that say they have no budgetary margin to deal with the effects of the crisis provoked by the new coronavirus in spite of the fact that the eurozone has grown for seven consecutive years”.
Costa told journalists after the six-hour long meeting – which ended without answers – that the discourse was “repugnant”.

“No one wants to hear the Dutch finance minister say what was said in 2009, 2010 and 2011. Spain did not import the virus. The virus hits everyone equally. If one country in the European Union thinks it can resolve the problem by leaving the virus in other countries, it doesn’t understand what the European Union is…”

President Macron has also warned this kind of political reaction to the crisis “could spell the end of the EU”

As Italian PM Guiseppe Conte refused to sign his name to the final summit declaration, PM Costa didn’t stop short in his tirade.

Mr Costa accused Hoekstra of “absolute unconsciousness” and a “recurring meanness” that “completely undermines what the spirit of the EU is” and which (therefore) is a threat to the future of the EU itself.
“If the EU wants to survive, it is unacceptable for any politician, from whichever country, to give this kind of response in the context of the pandemic that we’re living through”, he stormed.
“If we don’t respect one another, don’t understand one another, lack the capacity to respond in unison to a common challenge, then no one understands anything about the European Union”.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bus...s-2020-3%3famp

Wow China thanks for the help

Read the full article. I quote,

The Chinese Embassy in Spain said that the Bioeasy tests were not part of China's medical donations and that firm didn't have a license to sell its products

More
Spain returns faulty test kits to China as COVID-19 death toll ...

The Chinese embassy said the Spanish government had purchased the items from an unlicensed company called Shenzhen Bioeasy Biotechnology.
The Chinese ministry of commerce offered Spain a list of certified providers, which did not include Shenzhen Bioeasy Biotechnology. Shenzhen Bioeasy Biotechnology has not yet been licensed by the Chinese National Medical Products Administration to sell its products,” he said.
The head of Spain’s public health emergency department Fernando Simon confirmed in his daily briefing that the first batch of kits delivered to the country had been sent back to the provider, although he did not name the company in question.

[Lord Thesaurian]

Timeline: The early days of China's coronavirus outbreak and cover-up

Why it matters: A study published in March indicated that if Chinese authorities had acted three weeks earlier than they did, the number of coronavirus cases could have been reduced by 95% and its geographic spread limited.

Jan. 1: Wuhan Public Security Bureau brings in for questioning eight doctors who had posted information about the illness on WeChat.
* An official at the Hubei Provincial Health Commission orders labs, which had already determined that the novel virus was similar to SARS, to stop testing samples and to destroy existing samples.

Jan. 2: Chinese researchers map the new coronavirus' complete genetic information. This information is not made public until Jan. 9.

Jan. 7: Xi Jinping becomes involved in the response.

Jan. 9: China announces it has mapped the coronavirus genome.

Jan. 11–17: Important prescheduled CCP meeting held in Wuhan. During that time, the Wuhan Health Commission insists there are no new cases.

Jan. 13: First coronavirus case reported in Thailand, the first known case outside China.

Jan. 14: WHO announces Chinese authorities have seen "no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel coronavirus."

Jan. 15: The patient who becomes the first confirmed U.S. case leaves Wuhan and arrives in the U.S., carrying the coronavirus.

https://www.axios.com/timeline-the-e...718a5faab.html

I don’t know what the point is of continuing to argue about this. The CCP lied, people died, just like during SARS and H1N1. They will not be punished for it, any more than will Trump for following the same playbook of downplaying the crisis and then taking sudden extreme actions after the fact to accomplish political goals. The difference, if nothing else, will be that Trump will face the voters for his performance. We’ve already seen what happens to Chinese who criticize the CCP, and the latter dynamic is precisely why we are in the midst of a global pandemic.

[Aexodus]

I don’t know what the point is of continuing to argue about this. The CCP lied, people died, just like during SARS and H1N1. They will not be punished for it, any more than will Trump for following the same playbook of downplaying the crisis and then taking sudden extreme actions after the fact to accomplish political goals. The difference, if nothing else, will be that Trump will face the voters for his performance. We’ve already seen what happens to Chinese who criticize the CCP, and the latter dynamic is precisely why we are in the midst of a global pandemic.

Goddammit that article really pisses me off. The destroying of test samples, WHO’s limp dick suck up to Chinese authorities, and the first arrival of an infected person in the US in January.

[Gaidin]

I don’t know what the point is of continuing to argue about this. The CCP lied, people died, just like during SARS and H1N1. They will not be punished for it, any more than will Trump for following the same playbook of downplaying the crisis and then taking sudden extreme actions after the fact to accomplish political goals. The difference, if nothing else, will be that Trump will face the voters for his performance. We’ve already seen what happens to Chinese who criticize the CCP, and the latter dynamic is precisely why we are in the midst of a global pandemic.

Ummm...you can't see it but I'm raising my hand like the good student. I want to know what playbook Trump followed. What actions did he take. Every god damn action taken was taken at the state and local level. He activated the Defense Production Act but never used it. He put it into play to get some tests produced but then rolled it right back. Right now he's talking his head off about opening up the economy by Easter, but, do you want to know how much he can open up? Just the Executive Agencies that have all but shut themselves down for the sake of social distancing and have their workers telecommuting in the most MASSIVE act of telecommuting I have ever seen in federal work ever. He literally can not stop the governors and mayors from enacting their policies because he did not enact them. They did.

Trump. Didn't. Do. Jack.

[Lord Thesaurian]

Goddammit that article really pisses me off. The destroying of test samples, WHO’s limp dick suck up to Chinese authorities, and the first arrival of an infected person in the US in January.

It is important that the CCP owns this pandemic in the history books, because that’s the truth. I doubt, due to the “suck up” factor and the relentless CCP propaganda taken up even by many in the west, whether that is how it will be recorded.

Ummm...you can't see it but I'm raising my hand like the good student. I want to know what playbook Trump followed. What actions did he take. Every god damn action taken was taken at the state and local level. He activated the Defense Production Act but never used it. He put it into play to get some tests produced but then rolled it right back. Right now he's talking his head off about opening up the economy by Easter, but, do you want to know how much he can open up? Just the Executive Agencies that have all but shut themselves down for the sake of social distancing and have their workers telecommuting in the most MASSIVE act of telecommuting I have ever seen in federal work ever. He literally can not stop the governors and mayors from enacting their policies because he did not enact them. They did.

Trump. Didn't. Do. Jack.

I agree. The “playbook” is, deny, downplay anything that could be politically bad for you in terms of accountability, then when that’s no longer an option, suddenly enact travel restrictions and massive government intervention (natl defense production, stimulus rescues, etc) to politically save face while assuring everyone you are on top of it all and always were.

[Ludicus]

Stop blaming China, my dear haters. I quote Anthony Fauce, once again:

Q: What about the travel restrictions? President Trump keeps saying that the travel ban for China, which began 2 February, had a big impact [on slowing the spread of the virus to the United States] and that he wishes China would have told us three to four months earlier and that they were “very secretive.” [China did not immediately reveal the discovery of a new coronavirus in late December, but by 10 January, Chinese researchers made the sequence of the virus public.] It just doesn't comport with facts.

Anthoy Fauce: I know, but what do you want me to do? I mean, seriously Jon, let’s get real, what do you want me to do?... I can't jump in front of the microphone and push him down.

YOu know what really pisses me off? Haters like to hate.
Food for thought. From where solidarity is coming from? from the richest and most powerful country in the world? nope.
Trump touts great success as US becomes world's worst virus ...

it's unlikely any other modern administration would spend so much time praising its own performance -- even as the crisis magnifies by the day.

Italy wonders where Europe's solidarity is as coronavirus ...

With the grim task of selecting patients unlikely to survive, Italy’s health authorities have pleaded with the country’s friends and allies for emergency supplies. On Thursday, they finally arrived — from Shanghai. The China Eastern flight brought a medical team and 31 tonnes of supplies including ventilators.

Serbia turns to China due to 'lack of EU solidarity' on ... - EurActiv
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Even under U.S. Sanctions, Cuba sends doctor brigade to Italy and more. From Medscape, Reuters Health Information © 2020
Cuba said it dispatched a brigade of doctors and nurses to Italy for the first time this weekend to help in the fight against the novel coronavirus at the request of the worst-affected region Lombardy.
The Caribbean island has sent its "armies of white robes" to disaster sites around the world largely in poor countries since its 1959 revolution. Its doctors were in the front lines in the fight against cholera in Haiti and against Ebola in West Africa in the 2010s.
Yet with the 52-strong brigade, this is the first time Cuba has sent an emergency contingent to Italy, one of the world's richest countries, demonstrating the reach of its medical diplomacy.

This is the sixth medical brigade Cuba has sent in recent days to combat the spread of the new disease abroad.

We are going to fulfill an honorable task, based on the principle of solidarity, said Graciliano Díaz, 64.

"We are all afraid but we have a duty to fulfill, so we take out fear and put it to one side," Leonardo Fernandez, 68, an intensive care specialist, told Reuters late on Saturday shortly before his brigade's departure.

Fernandez said this would be his eighth international mission, including one in Liberia during the fight against Ebola.
Cuba has one of the highest ratios worldwide of physicians per capita even when excluding those doctors abroad, and its medical brigades for disaster relief continue to earn Havana goodwill worldwide.
Britain also thanked Cuba last week for allowing a British cruise ship that had been turned away by several Caribbean ports to dock on the island and for enabling the evacuation of the more than 600 passengers onboard.
Meanwhile Cuba, which is known for its disaster preparedness, is stepping up measures at home too to stem the coronavirus contagion. Twenty-five cases have been confirmed so far.

[Spyrith]

It is important that the CCP owns this pandemic in the history books, because that’s the truth. I doubt, due to the “suck up” factor and the relentless CCP propaganda taken up even by many in the west, whether that is how it will be recorded.

The history books will remember it as starting in China, but will mostly focus on how incompetent the West was in containing the disease. If the CCP puts a lid on infections (as their official data suggests), but the West loses control of it and has hundreds of thousands of dead, then every historian will use coronavirus as an example when a democracy was more incompetent than a dictatorship.

Also, this isn't the first flu-like disease of it's kind. Google the flu pandemics of 57-58 and the one from the late 60's. Each one had at least 1 million dead, if not more. Both started from China.