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Thread: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

  1. #1

    Default When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    So my son bought warhammer for Christmas and I watched him play some. I am not a warhammer fan and will never buy it myself but damn did it look good. A dragon lifting up a dinosaur creature throwing it on the ground, arrows shot at the dragon, it was cool to watch. The campaign map was beautiful. But all I could think was imagine if this was lord of the rings. Imagine that was a nazgul, or eagle, imagine trolls, ents, the balrog, gandalf etc etc i want to see the white city on the campaign map, mordor, helms deep, lothlorien etc to me it seems a natural perfect fit. So when do we see it happen?

  2. #2
    Daruwind's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    So let´s speculate

    2020 is year of Saga:Troy - that is confirmed
    2021 is probably Wh3 which is basically next big thing - that is very likely
    2022 let´s say this is 3 years after 3K and usually we are getting follow up title ...like Napoleon,Attila...so let´s say Genghis Khan (or somebody else..)
    2023 is nearest option for something new. It could be just another Saga game it could be Empire 2 or Medieval 3 or some new setting...

    To tell truth, I would say Tolkien setting is very logical and very workable scenario. People are talking about various other fantasy setting like Game of Thrones or Witcher but those have more or less problems. One thing is sure. Tolkien mods are almost for any TW so far so it is trully popular setting and fantasy is now very succesful TW thanks to Warhammer 1+2. Plus tolkien is popular in general, well known. But it is also probalby very expensive thing. On one side, CA proved that they are capable of working lore friendly with fantasy IP like Warhammer so that is big plus. However obtaining the rights is another question. Right now there are no big films except new Amazon TV serie in production..

    DMR: R2 (Attila) (ToB) (Wh1/2) (3K) (Troy)

  3. #3

    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daruwind View Post
    So let´s speculate

    2020 is year of Saga:Troy - that is confirmed
    2021 is probably Wh3 which is basically next big thing - that is very likely
    2022 let´s say this is 3 years after 3K and usually we are getting follow up title ...like Napoleon,Attila...so let´s say Genghis Khan (or somebody else..)
    2023 is nearest option for something new. It could be just another Saga game it could be Empire 2 or Medieval 3 or some new setting...

    To tell truth, I would say Tolkien setting is very logical and very workable scenario. People are talking about various other fantasy setting like Game of Thrones or Witcher but those have more or less problems. One thing is sure. Tolkien mods are almost for any TW so far so it is trully popular setting and fantasy is now very succesful TW thanks to Warhammer 1+2. Plus tolkien is popular in general, well known. But it is also probalby very expensive thing. On one side, CA proved that they are capable of working lore friendly with fantasy IP like Warhammer so that is big plus. However obtaining the rights is another question. Right now there are no big films except new Amazon TV serie in production..

    I think you are correct. Warhammer 3 will be next for fantasy games and i am sure saga and historic titles would follow. But the next fantasy when warhammer is done, should be a LOTR IMO. Med 3 would be great by the way. I watched and loved game of thrones but it will never have the long term fanbase and interest that Tolkien has. In fact by the time it would come out as a game i bet it will be near forgotten while some new show takes its place. Of course it would sell well also being a TW game, I just dont see it as successful as a Tolkien game would be. What if CA got the rights to the books? and its own artists made middle earth or if they used allen lee who was used in the movies so it would be very similar? yes amazon is coming out i herd rumors of a LOTR theme park as well. But tolkien will be around long after game of thrones. And they would need licence to game of thrones as well.

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    Daruwind's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolkien_Estate

    Television series

    On 13 November 2017 it was announced that Amazon had acquired the global television rights to The Lord of the Rings, committing to a multi-season television series. The series will not be a direct adaptation of the books, but will instead introduce new stories that are set before The Fellowship of the Ring.[16] Amazon said the deal included potential for spin-off series as well.[17] The press release referred to "previously unexplored stories based on J.R.R. Tolkien’s original writings". Amazon will be the producer in conjunction with the Tolkien Estate and The Tolkien Trust, HarperCollins and New Line Cinema.[18]
    at the same time
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle...in_video_games
    New Line Cinema was absorbed into Warner Bros after 2010.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warner_Home_Video

    I see here a few problems. 1) there was no strategy game for long time. Companies probably pursue quick bucks in action games. 2) Warner Bros is currently working with Amazon. Not sure how willing Tolkien Estate will be to work with other studios at the same time.

    However as Amazon is basically dirrectly working on prequel in graphic style ala LotR and Hobbit it might be possible fot CA to opt for more lore friendly/base on book vision especially for First Age up to LotR. Question is, what kind of deal is there with Amazon Games..if some kind of exclusivity ala Star Wars and EA right now or something more loosely. We will see.

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  5. #5

    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Battle for Middle Earth games were some of my favorite RTSs back in the day. I still remember the Ring Wars map, and the Xodox version of it. I'd love an LotR Total War, but the Tolkien Estate is probably not equipped to handle the negotiations with CA in order to do its IP justice.

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    Daruwind's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    I won´t be surprised if Amazon got some time exclusivity for their games. Like that no other studio is permitted to produce a game in certain time period. For GW the games are not main competitor (games vs tabletop) but surely even different games may influence other video game genres. (if billion people play Fortnite, there is probably a few less casual buyers for strategy and vice versa....)

    But in general idea, I won´t be surprised if CA now tried at least to talk about it....

    DMR: R2 (Attila) (ToB) (Wh1/2) (3K) (Troy)

  7. #7

    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Now that you mention it, I wouldn't be surprised if GW wouldn't be happy about an LotR Total War game. That's pretty much a direct competitor in terms of IP.

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    Daruwind's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Well exactly. If I remember correctly, GW and CA had about 10 years long deal...so 2013 - 2023 give or take. Basically 2021 WH3 release plus year or two for DLCs and patches to wrap it up completely.

    I won´t be suprised if there were some point in the deal about not doing yet famous fantasy setting in meantime. Who knows...

    But basically that is yet another point why I listed above the years for possible TWs as I listed them. 2023 is really probably the nearest option for new IP setting.

    Now of course the big question is, how will current Wh1+2 success translate into Wh3 and if GW would like with CA do something like Saga game, extension or something after Wh3. On opposite side, reading about different studios (CD project Red and Withcer series for example) I would not be surprised if CA would prefer some break from Wh. Produce something else. Because they are and will be doing Wh setting for decade...Because of this nobody would be surprised if the game after that is really Empire 2 or Med 3. But there of course question of potential gains/money. Basically if the Empire 2/Med 3 are more money wise scenario than Tolkien...in case they gained the license...so that´s a lot ifs. Will CA get Tolkien license? Would they prefer break ala Empire2/Med 3? Or will they signed up for one more Wh title?

    DMR: R2 (Attila) (ToB) (Wh1/2) (3K) (Troy)

  9. #9

    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Like you said, who knows? I also wouldn't be surprised if CA didn't sign exclusivity either. Companies can be pretty thorough, but they can often miss things as well. It also depends on who really had the leverage in the negotiations. I think Warhammer has been the best project CA has ever done. It really addresses most of my criticisms. It's long time horizon and continuous content has generated way more money for CA then rushing 6-7 games in the same amount of time. Well, I think, I don't actually know without seeing their detailed spreadsheets. If this was as successful as I suspect, what I'm really interested in is seeing who is responsible for it. Because while the Saga seems to be pretty "successful" thanks to 3K, I actually think this is precisely the model that I despise, which makes me hesitant with trusting CA with anything. Because then, it seems like Warhammer was well executed because Games Workshop was involved with the decision making. I don't know whether the Tolkien estate is capable of emulating that successful model. The last thing I want, is yet another mediocre LotR and CA game.

  10. #10
    Abdülmecid I's Avatar ¡Ay Carmela!
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    The crux of the matter is the conciliation of so many interests coming from a great variety of parties. The prize is great, as the theme will guarantee the game's success, even if the final product is as polished as Empire and Rome II on release. However, the compromise about every side's share of the profits will be quite complicated, so negotiations will take time, which means that Total War: Lord of the Rings is out of question for the foreseeable future, unless SEGA's legal team discovers a loophole in the system (highly unlikely, not to mention the fact that any such manoeuvre will be challenged in the courts). Game of Thrones was a more probable scenario, but there was apparently no deal in that front either.

    Given how the popularity of Martin's show is steadily declining, as the TV show has ended (in a rather lukewarm manner), I doubt we will see any GoT-inspired TW game anytime soon. However, it's interesting to note how Creative Assembly exploits popular culture for marketing purposes. The usual suspects usually involve films, like Saving Private Ryan, Last Samurai and Pirates of the Carribean, but TV series, like the Vikings are no exception. Throb is probably the most typical example of this strategy: The principal word of the title, the theme, the visuals, the audio of the trailer, even the raven, were clearly borrowed from Game of Thrones:


    In my opinion, the next fantasy tent-pole product will be based on ancient mythology, which will allow CA to create all sorts of mythical monsters and superhuman heroes, without being limited by lore, other franchises and "historical authenticity".
    Last edited by Abdülmecid I; January 03, 2020 at 08:25 AM.

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    Daruwind's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    GoT is done. Hype is dead after 8th season finale. And not sure if any new spinoff might return the glory... Interestingly Witcher despite not being the perfect in my eyes is gaining popularity. The lore is similarly big and good as GoT but the translation into game is also hard. (books/games/films focus on a few notable characters amidst politics...)

    So what other great setting are around?

    30/40/41K is probably too far from "land" base TWs as any modern WW1/WW2 settings. Star Wars are also sci-fi and off limits probably as is Warcraft. Tamriel? Dungeon and Dragons/Forgotten Realms? Narnia? Hybornia (Barbar Conan), Harry Potter is garbage for strategy. I´m not discarting general "mythology" setting but it is lacking this familiarity of known IP.

    -Tamriel, Dungeon and Dragons settings are missing notable characters. (imagine Gerald, Aragons like figures and no, ToB despite having no generally well known characters is not good example as are prooving low sales in comparison with any other TW.)
    -Narnia, Potter, Hybornia are missing variability in units/factions (compare with Whs)

    Warcraft has both, characters like Arthas, Thrall....and variety. But that is probably rooted in origin as Warcraft was created when licence for warhammer was denied. And because Warhammer is loosely based upon Tolkien work...CA can do anything of course, but logically all roads lead to Tolkien.

    If I have to pick interesting settings for me:
    1)Tolkien
    2)Warcraft
    3)Witcher (with some kind strong central story about Gerald. Basically we are playing as some king/queen and there is major event flow influenced by Ciri/Gerald..who are like independent NPC Gotrek/Felix like heroes. Maybe in the end with certain condition a player might get Ciri as queen/general and Geralt as Hero like figure. One of ending of Wh3 is that Ciri is new Nilfgaard Queen.....but this would heavily rely upon characters, interactions, diplomacy. It is really better suited for RPG games....)
    4)Tamriel
    Last edited by Daruwind; January 03, 2020 at 09:24 AM.

    DMR: R2 (Attila) (ToB) (Wh1/2) (3K) (Troy)

  12. #12

    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    I was laughed at, and downvoted into oblivion for daring to make a thread on a Middle Earth TW game, on /r/TotalWar.

    The WH fanboys there are so defensive.

    I, also, want a Tolkien TW, the Med 2 mod is okay, but it just doesn't do it, for me.

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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Licensing will probably be the biggest issue, I haven no doubts CA would jump at the chance to make a Third Age: Total war. GoT is indeed done, season 8 ruined everything even more than season 7 did.
    I'm very satisfied with the Med 2 mod for now though, or rather the submods for it - DaC is great, and DCI:LA is going to be brilliant when it releases
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    Flinn's Avatar The Berlusca Abides!
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Quote Originally Posted by King Athelstan View Post
    ... and DCI:LA is going to be brilliant when it releases
    I promised Ngugi that that would be the last mod I'll ever play

    "Play DCI:LA and then die" as the say in Naples ...
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Flinn View Post
    I promised Ngugi that that would be the last mod I'll ever play

    "Play DCI:LA and then die" as the say in Naples ...
    Well I've played it, and it's darn good, so it'd be a death worth dying for
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  16. #16
    Daruwind's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Just finished reading Fall of Gondolin so yeah. I would love to see similar endeavour as WH trilogy for Tolkien next time. First - Second - Third Age.

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    Flinn's Avatar The Berlusca Abides!
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    Default Re: When Will we get Lord of Rings Total war?

    Quote Originally Posted by King Athelstan View Post
    Well I've played it, and it's darn good, so it'd be a death worth dying for
    I was a beta tester early on.. like 5 years ago? man, time runs fast
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