SCANDINAVIA (Denmark & Norway)

[Jurand of Cracow]

Shouldn't Bergen be put as Norway's capital? Oslo was capital after Bergen, around the XIV century or so

It is, isn't it?
You may see here that I worked under assumption it is - see my work here on the crowns, it's Bergen that's the place of coronation. I've recently reviewed the hidden resources (while working on the merchants) and the "capital" in Norway is Bergen.
I didn't check where the initial capitl is, though.

[Lifthrasir]

That's probably a remaining mistake due to Geomod messing up the settlements' names. That's a simple change in the descr_strat.txt file. Bergen has to be put in first for Norway. Thanks for pointing this out.

[Jurand of Cracow]

fixed in the next release

[Lifthrasir]

Thanks JoC

[Jurand of Cracow]

I've got in mind two name changes concerning Norway:
- Oslo should be Ánslo (as it is mentioned in the 11th source)
- there could be name change after a conquest by Denmark - historically, but much later, it was changed into Christiania. So why not?
what do you think?

[King Athelstan]

There weren't any kings called Christian until the Oldenborg Dynasty came into power in the 15th century, so we're not only talking about a name change much later, but a completely different royal house. So I'm opposed to that bit tbh.

Ánslo works fine , though I personally prefer Áslo

[Lifthrasir]

Áslo makes me think about the hero nickname in the Last Kingdom season 1
I know, I'm sick

[XXZit]

Denmark is my favorite Faction. I've played countless of campaigns with them; too many if you ask me; perhaps somewhere close to 80% of all my games. I'm not exaggerating; I guess you could say I'm a Viking enthusiast.

In all my games I've learned a thing or two not only about staying alive, but thriving as the Danes. Here's what I usually do: (some of these might not suit all play-styles, but most are just sensible things)
* Keep HRE happy. You do NOT want to enter a military conflict with them before you are ready. It's almost certainly suicide. Sending them tribute and gifts is nothing to be ashamed of. Ally with them if you can!
* Having a strong navy is essential for survival. Not only will it prevent your coasts form being invaded, it can be very lucrative for trade and you will get papal missions to blockade the ports of the English or Scots who usually get excommunicated.
* Go for the Rebel settlement closest to Norway first. You don't want them to expand beyond their initial two cities. If the rebel forces are considerable, let the Norse attack them first. They will fail and weaken them so you can swoop in and take the settlement with minimal losses.
* Rush to the south to take the settlement north east of the HRE castle (I forgot the name) This is less to prevent the germans from taking it and more to give you a prosperous settlement that can grow. The rest of the lands in Scandinavia are extremely hard to grow and you won't get much from them unless you bring a highly chivalrous general to govern them. Take the neighboring rebel castle in the area if you can and Ignore the rest of the settlements to the east for now -specially Visiby which is nearly useless.
* Attack Norway. I've tried countless of times to ally with them, it doesn't work. Sooner or later they always backstab you. Due to their position you are their best target. (A case could be made that Scotland is, but the AI doesn't think that way).
* Finish conquering available rebel lands.
* After Norway is defeated, go for Lithuania.
* Do not trust the Poles. Never ally with them, (specially not if they are at war with HRE), even when doing so might seem beneficial since they are usually fighting Lithuania.
* After Lithuania, you could attack Nogovorod or Poland. Scotland might be a good option too but that would mean having the English as neighbors...
* At this point you should have a solid empire and could decide to take on the HRE if you wish. I usually wait for a civil war, excommunication or until they are at war with multiple factions. Don't get baited though; they might make peace with all warring factions by the next turn and focus all their might on you.
* Always keep the pope happy but ignore the stupid crusades. Don't even think about joining until you have a huge empire and can afford to wage multiple wars away from home. Alternatively, you could go on a crusade take the settlement for fame and glory and sell it to the pope or highest bidder the next turn. Then bring the experienced, highly decorated troops home, taking and selling every rebel/weak settlement on the way back.

Gee, just talking about this brings back many fond memories, wish I could play again. Too bad my laptop was stolen last week; just when I was ready to try out the new release...

[kostic]

Gee, just talking about this brings back many fond memories, wish I could play again. Too bad my laptop was stolen last week; just when I was ready to try out the new release...

That’s bad luck ! Thank you for sharing your experience.

[kaiser29]

the regions of Bergen and Oslo are called "Gulathingslog" and "Borgarthingslog". but this is an error: "log" is Old Norse for "law".

furthermore, the "Thing" in ancient Norway was a legislative assembly, something like a modern parliament. there were different Things, like the Gulathing and the Borgarthing, but to my understanding these words were not used to define a geographical area

[RodriguesSting]

* Do not trust the Poles.

Around polacks, never relax...

Also, considering how much you have to walk around eggshells with the HRE, how easy would be to squash Norway and Denmark as, well, any faction that have easy(er) access to heavy cavalry?

[Jurand of Cracow]

the regions of Bergen and Oslo are called "Gulathingslog" and "Borgarthingslog". but this is an error: "log" is Old Norse for "law".

furthermore, the "Thing" in ancient Norway was a legislative assembly, something like a modern parliament. there were different Things, like the Gulathing and the Borgarthing, but to my understanding these words were not used to define a geographical area

current names were researched by Eldgrimr, I hope he would answer. I'd guess that log migh be also translated into "realm" (the space where the law is in force).

[RodriguesSting]

Regarding Norway, and POSSIBLY Denmark as well, I found some inconsistencies on their troop tree. Keep in mind, I am giving this report based on the building browser of Lund, and the current turn is 123.

- Landevaernmenn show up at 2 on City Watch and then never again, being apparently replaced, at first, by Spear Militia, and then Urban Spear Militia.
- Gestir show up at 1 on Archery Range and then never again.

As an aside and borderline suggestion, Veidmenn show up at 3 on Practice Range and go up to up to 5 at Marksman's. Not only they are better than generic Latin Archers, both on attack and armor, they are also very plentiful, and quick to recruit.

I may have some suggestions regarding these units, but this is not the place.

[Macaras]

If the cathedrals are not allowed in castles, Norway or Denmark will never get a king, since the place of the coronation is the castle?

[Jurand of Cracow]

If the cathedrals are not allowed in castles, Norway or Denmark will never get a king, since the place of the coronation is the castle?

Rigth, this is the inconsistency for Skandinavia. You need to rebuild the castle into a city and build a cathedral.
I'll think how to solve it in the next release. Perhaps allowing cathedrals to be built in the castles.

[RodriguesSting]

Rigth, this is the inconsistency for Skandinavia. You need to rebuild the castle into a city and build a cathedral.
I'll think how to solve it in the next release. Perhaps allowing cathedrals to be built in the castles.

A wooden castle upgrades MUCH quicker to fortress than a palisade to a large stone wall. Going fortress and then converting can be a smart move. So, unintended, that might be a good decision.

[Cephalophore]

Regarding Kaiser's comment.

the regions of Bergen and Oslo are called "Gulathingslog" and "Borgarthingslog". but this is an error: "log" is Old Norse for "law"

Imo, alternative names for these regions would be more accurate as Vestnóregs (Western Norway) and Vingulmǫrk (something marche, idk) or Víkin (old name for eastern norway 900s-1100s). Or one could just use Austnóregs (Eastern Norway)

https://onp.ku.dk/onp/onp.php?o87587
https://onp.ku.dk/onp/onp.php?o86224
Noregs, obviously, is Norway. I.E. Noregsríki (State of Norway)
Many of my place-names are from this site, very useful.
The rest of the Scandinavian region names are acceptable, imo. But I was going to reevaluate them for my own submod, personally.

[Jurand of Cracow]

Hmm, many options actually... I'd by happy to have an opinion also of Elgrimr and King Athelstan on which names to use for the provinces.

[kaiser29]

Be aware that in Old Norse the 's' at the end of a word is the equivalent of the english possessive. So:

Konung ---> king
Konungsson ---> son of the king

Riki ---> realm
Noreg ---> Norway (spelled like this also in Nynorsk)
Noregsriki ---> realm of Norway

Therefore, a region should end just with "noreg", without the S at the end

[Cephalophore]

Thanks, Kaiser. I actuallly did correct this. You're absolutely right.