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Thread: What does Christmas mean to you?

  1. #121
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    conon394,

    The thing is that the original letters sent out to the infant churches would not have been in latin or Greek until there were enogh Gentile believers needing translations from the Hebrew as that language was spoken by predominately Jewish converts. Where these originals are is anyone's guess. However since Paul took over the building of the dogma for the churches I do not believe his teaching ever changed because his message was kept simple in that Jesus Christ died for sinners, rose again waiting to return to complete all things. " For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whosover believeth on Him shall not perish but have everlasting life." are John's words to the world and what could be simpler? Why perish when life and love is what the message declares?

  2. #122
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by basics View Post
    conon394,

    The thing is that the original letters sent out to the infant churches would not have been in latin or Greek until there were enogh Gentile believers needing translations from the Hebrew as that language was spoken by predominately Jewish converts. Where these originals are is anyone's guess. However since Paul took over the building of the dogma for the churches I do not believe his teaching ever changed because his message was kept simple in that Jesus Christ died for sinners, rose again waiting to return to complete all things. " For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whosover believeth on Him shall not perish but have everlasting life." are John's words to the world and what could be simpler? Why perish when life and love is what the message declares?
    A You asked not about any of that but if I read a Bible. I have and has we know not so impressed or enchanted as you not matter the dialect of the NT (sorry to say I prefer Euripides as a re read)

    B Paul wrote in Koine Greek/Attic-Ionian.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  3. #123

    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by conon394 View Post
    A You asked not about any of that but if I read a Bible. I have and has we know not so impressed or enchanted as you not matter the dialect of the NT (sorry to say I prefer Euripides as a re read)
    Personally, I prefer the plays of Shakespeare, and I find Euripedes characters rather long winded and tedious, without the clever word play you find in Shakespeare.

    I think just as literature the NT is better, shipwrecks and dramatic reversals, from utter defeat to total triumph. But everyone has their preferences

  4. #124
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    conon394,

    Look up Youtube for The Theology of Christmas by John McArthur because his explanation is by far greater than anything I might say.

  5. #125
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by basics View Post
    conon394,

    Look up Youtube for The Theology of Christmas by John McArthur because his explanation is by far greater than anything I might say.
    Or you could use it as a reference to support your own points; it's not really an argument to go tell someone to listen to someone else.

  6. #126
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Common Soldier View Post
    Personally, I prefer the plays of Shakespeare, and I find Euripedes characters rather long winded and tedious, without the clever word play you find in Shakespeare.

    I think just as literature the NT is better, shipwrecks and dramatic reversals, from utter defeat to total triumph. But everyone has their preferences
    Ahh but by the competition definitions at the time the genera were a bit divided in Athens vs Shakespeare's open audience (they had to submit their clever word play in a separate work mostly lost now). But even the Bard could drone on I mean really even though I like Hamlet. Read strait through one does tend to think just get on with it man and kill the king and avenger your father and is anyone paying attention that Fortinbras issue? Come on Will this was a one act play where H gets the girl and proves Denmark needs an over educated mopey King..
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  7. #127
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by basics View Post
    conon394,

    Look up Youtube for The Theology of Christmas by John McArthur because his explanation is by far greater than anything I might say.
    "If we just squeeze those verses together, it’s pretty clear that we’re talking about one who is God, that’s how it starts, and is Lord, and that’s how it ends. That’s the real message of Christmas, that Jesus Christ is God and He is Lord"

    This is your problem you see if you don't squeeze the text together at Philippians 2 1-12 the asserted message is not clear and it rather looks to me as if God is very much separate. And the point is rather more about humility and sacrifice in a community, but not a theological compression.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  8. #128

    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by conon394 View Post
    "If we just squeeze those verses together, it’s pretty clear that we’re talking about one who is God, that’s how it starts, and is Lord, and that’s how it ends. That’s the real message of Christmas, that Jesus Christ is God and He is Lord"

    This is your problem you see if you don't squeeze the text together at Philippians 2 1-12 the asserted message is not clear and it rather looks to me as if God is very much separate. And the point is rather more about humility and sacrifice in a community, but not a theological compression.
    If you look at the beginning of the Gospel of John, it seems clear that it supports very the idea of the Trinity. There are several statements throughout John, that support the idea that Jesus existed before he was born, and was somehow existent with God.

  9. #129
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by conon394 View Post
    "If we just squeeze those verses together, it’s pretty clear that we’re talking about one who is God, that’s how it starts, and is Lord, and that’s how it ends. That’s the real message of Christmas, that Jesus Christ is God and He is Lord"

    This is your problem you see if you don't squeeze the text together at Philippians 2 1-12 the asserted message is not clear and it rather looks to me as if God is very much separate. And the point is rather more about humility and sacrifice in a community, but not a theological compression.
    conon394,

    I don't have a problem with what's written as you seem to have for the chapter follows on from Paul describing his experiences being now in Christ by encouraging the Philippians to be the same despite what may follow resting on Christ being God. He states that every knee shall bow, those in heaven, those in hell, those still to get there that Jesus Christ is Lord, is God.

  10. #130

    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Why would someone in hell do that?
    Optio, Legio I Latina

  11. #131
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Common Soldier View Post
    If you look at the beginning of the Gospel of John, it seems clear that it supports very the idea of the Trinity. There are several statements throughout John, that support the idea that Jesus existed before he was born, and was somehow existent with God.
    My point would those are NT not really some direct quote from the OT. I don't mean to be rude but essentially as an agnostic so why not LDS than yet another add on to the and compilation of the Jewish religion.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  12. #132
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Happy Christmas to everyone.

  13. #133
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    conon394,

    The Jewish people because of their Old Testament writings are still awaiting the arrival of Messias Whom they thought would be a military leader, most still thinking along those lines. Today in Israel alone there are some thirty odd thousand Jews who know Jesus Christ as their Lord and Saviour, their Messias promised as written. On reading or hearing the New Testament Gospel the link between Jesus and that prophesied in the Old writings was the answer they had been looking for in the wrong place. Religous Jews are not even allowed to say the name of Jesus but thanks to the brave preachers as well as the internet the word is getting through to some. That's what Christmas means to them that now know God whence once they didn't.

  14. #134
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Religious Jews are not even allowed to say the name of Jesus
    According to what?

    ----

    Sorry to snarky basics but

    as well as the internet the word is getting through to some
    Think maybe if Jesus had created that via miracle a lot more people would have heard the word of the lord before they died over the past 2000 years or so
    Last edited by conon394; December 26, 2019 at 09:07 PM.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  15. #135
    basics's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by conon394 View Post
    According to what?

    ----Sorry to snarky basics but

    Think maybe if Jesus had created that via miracle a lot more people would have heard the word of the lord before they died over the past 2000 years or so
    conon394,

    I presume it is because of Whom He claimed to be, the reason their forebears crucified Him. Anyway I got that from clicking into a programme about Jews for Christ and I think it was in TV.

    Yes, the internet certainly helps get the word across yet one could argue that it has an opposite effect if this site is anything to go by.

  16. #136

    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    You went full Jews killed Jesus. Hilarious.
    Optio, Legio I Latina

  17. #137
    basics's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    May I wish friend and foe alike, a happy New Year.

  18. #138
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Indeed many happy returns of the event to us all.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  19. #139
    basics's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by CommodusIV View Post
    Or you could use it as a reference to support your own points; it's not really an argument to go tell someone to listen to someone else.
    CommodusIV,

    Oh it's not for my benefit, rather those that don't know the importance of the birth of Christ.

  20. #140

    Default Re: What does Christmas mean to you?

    Jesus of Nazareth was born in March. One of the few things we know about the man.

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