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Thread: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

  1. #321

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by Katsumoto View Post
    It'll be interesting to see how his previous views on Congressional oversight line up with any defense of Trump's unprecedented and blanket refusal to cooperate. From the Benghazi report:
    That's easy. If the Democrats want to compel the president to "cooperate" they have Congressional powers to do so - by actually voting to impeach him. They can also petition the Supreme Court to force the President to release information. Those are their "means of compulsion". At the moment, the Democrats are abusing the investigatory process by making demands of the president while denying him the proper rights that a defendant should be afforded. Considering how contrived the complaint upon which the inquiry is predicated is, that is hardly surprising.

    See, the problem the Democrats have - which Pelosi knew from the beginning - is that any impeachment trial is just as likely to damage the them as it is to damage Trump. So instead she's trying to use the investigatory phase as a way of smearing the president whilst not actually having to commit to the process.
    Last edited by Cope; October 09, 2019 at 04:19 AM.



  2. #322

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    They don’t have to vote until they actually impeach. The House has the sole power to Impeach is what you need to realize. How they investigate is their thing.
    One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
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  3. #323
    Katsumoto's Avatar Quae est infernum es
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    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by ep1c_fail View Post
    Then, when he refuses to play ball, they turn around and whine about "obstruction" and use the press to convince people such as yourself to get online and parrot talking points about how the president's supposed "unprecedented and blanket refusal to cooperate" is itself proof of his guilt.
    I don't need to rely on the press when Trump goes on camera and says "we're going to fight all the subpoenas" and has his lawyer send a letter outright declaring his obstruction. And it is obstruction, because Trump and his pals don't get to decide how the House goes about its constitutional oversight business I'm afraid.

    Refusing to cooperate is not inherently proof of guilt, but as your boy Trey Gowdy said:

    "The longer you remain silent, the longer you don't turn over documents, a presumption begins to build that you're withholding something. That's human nature. That may not be a legal presumption, but that's a common sense presumption."
    "I pray Heaven to bestow the best of blessings on this house and all that shall hereafter inhabit it. May none but honest and wise men ever rule under this roof."
    - John Adams, on the White House, in a letter to Abigail Adams (2 November 1800)

  4. #324

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by Katsumoto View Post
    I don't need to rely on the press when Trump goes on camera and says "we're going to fight all the subpoenas" and has his lawyer send a letter outright declaring his obstruction. And it is obstruction, because Trump and his pals don't get to decide how the House goes about its constitutional oversight business I'm afraid.
    Either have the Democrats hold a vote in the House to authorize an impeachment inquiry or go and get a Supreme Court ruling demanding that the President cooperate. Otherwise, I don't care about Trump's refusal to play ball with an abuse of the impeachment proceedings designed to facilitate the Democrats' electoral objectives. They "don't get to decide" to overturn an election because they can't cope with the result "I'm afraid".

    Refusing to cooperate is not inherently proof of guilt, but as your boy Trey Gowdy said:

    "The longer you remain silent, the longer you don't turn over documents, a presumption begins to build that you're withholding something. That's human nature. That may not be a legal presumption, but that's a common sense presumption."
    This logic ceases to apply when the people overseeing the investigation lack any semblance of partiality.
    Last edited by Cope; October 09, 2019 at 05:39 AM.



  5. #325

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Where does the Constitution demand a vote authorizing an impeachment inquiry?
    One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
    -Neil deGrasse Tyson

    Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.

  6. #326

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidin View Post
    Where does the Constitution demand a vote authorizing an impeachment inquiry?
    The part where it says that "the House of Representatives (not Pelosi or Schiff)... shall have sole power of impeachment." If you disagree, go and get a Supreme Court ruling stating that the Speaker has the authority to initiate an impeachment investigation.



  7. #327

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidin View Post
    They don’t have to vote until they actually impeach. The House has the sole power to Impeach is what you need to realize. How they investigate is their thing.
    Indeed. Here’s hoping Trump’s advance notice that he’s going to obstruct anything and everything earns an impeachment article of its very own.
    Of these facts there cannot be any shadow of doubt: for instance, that civil society was renovated in every part by Christian institutions; that in the strength of that renewal the human race was lifted up to better things-nay, that it was brought back from death to life, and to so excellent a life that nothing more perfect had been known before, or will come to be known in the ages that have yet to be. - Pope Leo XIII

  8. #328
    Katsumoto's Avatar Quae est infernum es
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    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by ep1c_fail View Post
    Either have the Democrats hold a vote in the House to authorize an impeachment inquiry or go and get a Supreme Court ruling demanding that the President cooperate. Otherwise, I don't care about Trump's refusal to play ball with an abuse of the impeachment proceedings designed to facilitate the Democrats' electoral objectives. They "don't get to decide" to overturn an election because they can't cope with the result "I'm afraid".
    The only way Democrats would 'overturn an election' is if Trump is guilty of wrongdoing. He can't be impeached if he's done nothing wrong, right? If he's innocent, he should have nothing to hide and allow the House to do its rightful duty. Indeed, by such cooperation he would surely demonstrate his innocence and prove to the public that Democrats are abusing their powers and pursuing a witch hunt. And yet, he and his administration continue to aggressively block any attempts at oversight.
    "I pray Heaven to bestow the best of blessings on this house and all that shall hereafter inhabit it. May none but honest and wise men ever rule under this roof."
    - John Adams, on the White House, in a letter to Abigail Adams (2 November 1800)

  9. #329

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by Katsumoto View Post
    If he's innocent, he should have nothing to hide and allow the House to do its rightful duty. Indeed, by such cooperation he would surely demonstrate his innocence and prove to the public that Democrats are abusing their powers and pursuing a witch hunt. And yet, he and his administration continue to aggressively block any attempts at oversight.
    I've just explained why this logic isn't applicable in instances where the investigatory oversight is provided by an unapologetic partisan who's already lied about his involvement with the initial complainant (himself a registered Democrat with no first hand knowledge of events) and has fabricated the President's statements before Congress.

    So again, either have the House vote in favor of initiating an impeachment investigation (as the Constitution provides for) or have the Supreme Court declare that the President is legally obliged to cooperate with the inquiry as it currently exists. Until then I see no reason why Trump should facilitate the attempts of his political opponents to abuse investigatory processes for their electoral benefit.



  10. #330

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by ep1c_fail View Post
    The part where it says that "the House of Representatives (not Pelosi or Schiff)... shall have sole power of impeachment." If you disagree, go and get a Supreme Court ruling stating that the Speaker has the authority to initiate an impeachment investigation.
    That said nothing about requirements for a majority vote to open an investigation. The Senate has actually had a ruling on this after someone didn’t like their impeachment trial and how Senate ran it. What’d SCOTUS say? That Senate has the sole power to try impeachment. And they could bugger off.
    One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
    -Neil deGrasse Tyson

    Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.

  11. #331
    B. W.'s Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Whistleblower has direct ties to a current Democratic presidential candidate. I wonder why the mainstream fake news hasn't reported this:

    https://www.americanthinker.com/blog...ship_with.html

  12. #332
    alhoon's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by B. W. View Post
    Whistleblower has direct ties to a current Democratic presidential candidate. I wonder why the mainstream fake news hasn't reported this:

    https://www.americanthinker.com/blog...ship_with.html
    He could have ties to the Taliban and a winged unicorn and that wouldn't change that what he said is serious and seems to at least be based on actual things Trump said. Whether those things should be taken as the Democrats and Trump-haters insist or as non-important comments that are taken out of context is a different issue and it's up to the congress.

    The issue of whether the Whistleblower had nefarious reasons to blow the whistle and whether he should be prosecuted for that, is a completely different issue. The whistleblower didn't lie but perhaps the Democrat interpretation of what Trump said is erroneous - and it is certainly politically motivated.
    But that doesn't exhonerate Trump.
    alhoon is not a member of the infamous Hoons: a (fictional) nazi-sympathizer KKK clan. Of course, no Hoon would openly admit affiliation to the uninitiated.
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  13. #333

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    What if Trump killed a man and the witness was a Democrat? Man, tough one for Republicans to process.

  14. #334

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by ep1c_fail View Post
    @The spartan

    The top part of your post has already been answered. I'm not going over it again - especially since you obviously haven't bothered reading the primary source material.

    This coming from the guy willing to use HRC as a partisan cudgel without checking when she was Secretary of State.

    What primary source do you think I haven't read? The transcript?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyama View Post
    What if Trump killed a man and the witness was a Democrat? Man, tough one for Republicans to process.
    Not even. Unless there was some direct damage to policy they wanted enacted, I think they would fail to realize how this is their problem at all.

    They have a culture war to win, god dammit! Sometimes, collateral damage happens.
    Last edited by The spartan; October 09, 2019 at 03:24 PM.
    They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more.

  15. #335

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyama View Post
    What if Trump killed a man and the witness was a Democrat? Man, tough one for Republicans to process.
    The affiliations of the complainant bring his reliability into question - especially since he isn't a first hand source and we know that he had been in contact with Schiff even before the allegations were lodged (a fact about which Schiff subsequently lied). Examining biases and intent are fundamental aspects of a fair investigatory process.

    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post

    This coming from the guy willing to use HRC as a partisan cudgel without checking when she was Secretary of State.

    What primary source do you think I haven't read? The transcript?
    Nothing of substance worth responding to here.



  16. #336

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Your political party doesn’t allow you to NOT whistleblow.
    One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
    -Neil deGrasse Tyson

    Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.

  17. #337
    B. W.'s Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    White House counsel's response to Pelosi on impeachment inquiry:

    https://www.worldtribune.com/text-of...achment-probe/

  18. #338

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    BW, if this gets too far, would you support Trump suspending Congress until Pelosi's coup attempt is over?
    They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more.

  19. #339

    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    Evidence is starting to emerge that Biden received $900,000 from Burisma.

    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/201...-ukrainian-mp/



  20. #340
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    Default Re: US House Speaker Announces Formal Impeachment Inquiry

    I'm surprised that so far, none of these politicians in Washington have been "suicided" yet; given the penchant for Beltway politicians to pull an Epstein, you'd think they'd have death squads on the ready to 'take care' of problems that won't go away.

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