Total War Saga: TROY - general discussion

**Lord Baal** · August 19, 2020, 11:34 PM

Originally Posted by agnes69

A new PC will make you happy.

For sure, sadly cant afford it.

**PointOfViewGun** · August 20, 2020, 02:26 AM

Originally Posted by PikeStance

My first response was in response to Darios. It was an elaboration of that post. For some reason you later brought up Daruwind. Anyway, you wrote what is in blue. I do not understand what you mean by that if you didn't answer your own question. I don' know what you are talking about and you refuse to even elaborate. You brought it up so the least you could do is to explain it so that we all understand your position.

It is like on judge Judy, those fools that counter sue for harassment. Judge Judy, " if you pay them their money, they would be harassing you." So, elaborate and i will stop asking you to.

I love how you're missing a number of posts in that exchange. You keep saying "for some reason" I brought up Daruwind when I already explicitly pointed at why I referenced to him and his post. Your efforts to religiously deflect simply tells me that you have no argument to stand on. I can only interpret at this point is that you don't know of any convincing fantasy elements in the game and you're just keep on arguing for the sake of arguing. My question was an utterly simple one and you failed to answer it after 6 posts of whining. What a waste of bits.

**PikeStance** · August 20, 2020, 03:04 AM

Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun

I love how you're missing a number of posts in that exchange. You keep saying "for some reason" I brought up Daruwind when I already explicitly pointed at why I referenced to him and his post. Your efforts to religiously deflect simply tells me that you have no argument to stand on. I can only interpret at this point is that you don't know of any convincing fantasy elements in the game and you're just keep on arguing for the sake of arguing. My question was an utterly simple one and you failed to answer it after 6 posts of whining. What a waste of bits.

What argument? I do not even know your position. I asked repeatedly and you have refused to do so.
Daruwind has no relevant. My post was based on what Darios wrote. If Daruwind wrote something that connected to what you wrote in blue then I suggest you show me how it is connected. I shouldn't have to connect you dots in your own arguments.

**PointOfViewGun** · August 20, 2020, 04:00 AM

Originally Posted by PikeStance

What argument? I do not even know your position. I asked repeatedly and you have refused to do so.
Daruwind has no relevant. My post was based on what Darios wrote. If Daruwind wrote something that connected to what you wrote in blue then I suggest you show me how it is connected. I shouldn't have to connect you dots in your own arguments.

I can not explain things I've already explained or explain you what you've been arguing over and over again. You clearly have the capacity to go back and check what we discussed and you seem to be deliberately distorting or ignoring them. It's a quite asinine argumentation. Good luck with it. I got my understanding of your position that you have no tangible argument to support your implication. I'll leave it at that.

**Daruwind** · August 20, 2020, 12:31 PM

Not sure why my name is so so popular here

@PointOfViewGun
as well in another Troy thread
https://www.twcenter.net/forums/show...inally-reviews

What about trying to discuss actual game instead of discussing people around? This is not political mudpit..

**PikeStance** · August 20, 2020, 08:32 PM

Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun

I can not explain things I've already explained or explain you what you've been arguing over and over again. You clearly have the capacity to go back and check what we discussed and you seem to be deliberately distorting or ignoring them. It's a quite asinine argumentation. Good luck with it. I got my understanding of your position that you have no tangible argument to support your implication. I'll leave it at that.

LOL, dude, there is literally no argument here. I already said I was elaborating on Darios' points. So my first post stated it. I am trying to understand your post in your initial response to mine. For some reasons you won't. If there is a previous post you made that explains it, then you would be better at finding it than me. Just link it. It isn't hard. I do not have time to flip through the thread looking for that one post that you actually stated your POV on the matter. Seriously, this popped in my feed, I read what Darios wrote, said cool and posted.

**Alwyn** · August 21, 2020, 02:57 AM

I'm enjoying Troy so far. I like the idea of 'mythical' units being exceptional humans, not monsters - and the way that you need to capture certain area of the map to recruit them.

I understand that legendary heroes were a big thing in this era. This makes sense, in a time when a smaller population compared to later periods might have made it easier for one fighter to stand out. This would make even more sense if most soldiers were farmers or craftsmen brought into the army for a season, while the legendary heroes were from the elite class of society who could afford to train hard and specialise as warriors. Even so, I was wondering if the hero abilities would seem too magical.

Playing as Hector, I like the fact that his hero ability is 'lead by example' - that seems like something which a hero would actually do, rather than just a 'magic button'. The one slightly odd thing about this is that the ability is turned on temporarily when the player activates it. I think it would feel more natural if the ability activated automatically when conditions were met. For example, it could be activated only when Hector was in melee, either after he had killed a certain number of enemies in the battle (like the Murderous Prowess ability of the Dark Elves in Warhammer II) or if he was fighting an enemy hero, then the idea of Hector leading by example would make more sense than simply standing him near units and activating the ability.

Hector's faction dynamic (his rivalry with Paris for the favour of King Priam) adds an extra dimension. When Paris earns Priam's respect, I get a notification that he has earned a number of points. It would be helpful if the game showed me a chart showing the significance of this, maybe similar to the Senate chart in Rome II (where the player can see their influence rising or falling over a series of turns).

The multi-resource economy and bartering is interesting too. When an AI faction initiates bartering with me, it would be helpful to be able to see my current level of each resource and my current income for each resource, before agreeing a deal (maybe there's a way to see them and I've missed it?).

**Daruwind** · September 10, 2020, 05:07 PM

Patch 1.1.0
https://www.totalwar.com/blog/a-tota...y-patch-1-1-0/

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

**Basileos Leandros I** · October 07, 2020, 05:03 PM

I've played a bit of Troy TW past weekend and here are some of my initial thoughts.

As the main impression, and main positive point for me, the UI, just like ToB, is absolutely spectacular! Fabulous work done by the Art team, spectacular work. I do notice that the game has been simplified, in the scope of ToB as well, and with the resources it feels a lot like Age of Empires in that aspect. Not particularly fond of it, but it works, and adds a different depth of decisions that you need to do. Researching tech now is a bit different, and it grants you resources, which again is good for the game but it feels strange as a Total War product. It takes time to adapt to it.

Building browser again is different, it forces you to clearly choose but often times you see that in the beginning of the game, there are drawbacks (on resources especially) that you can't get back that easily. So while it creates a good choice to have it's hard to use it in the beginning. Especially if you don't have gold!

Battles wise, it's almost the same as ToB, with the obvious added difference of having hero units. Haven't played a siege yet but I will do a custom siege Troy battle.

So far it's a solid game but to be frank, not my cup of tea. It's just too different as a TW game in my view. However for those familiar with ToB / Warhammer even, this is a good game. And of course, I could sit for HOURS and look at the game, the artwork is beyond splendid!

**~~swabian~~** · September 10, 2021, 10:17 AM

Playing it right now. Steam seems to be

a lot, but I like it. I bought the Mythic Edition + the blood pack.

The battles are gorgeous and I like the simplicity compared to previous titles as well as the quality of life improvements, like vegetation getting stripped when holding space.

Thiff Iff Fpartaaaahhh!

edit: The Immersive Combat Mod by kam2150 on Steam workshop is a must have mod imo.

**Nack** · September 13, 2021, 10:46 PM

Sorry if this is a bit long, but I really wanted to express my thoughts on this game somewhere because I honestly think it's one of the best TW titles I've played.

At first, I played this on epic when it came out for free. I liked it quite a bit, although, like many, I wasn't too convinced by the truth behind the myth approach. That said, I really appreciated how well thought out the mechanics of the game were compared to previous titles, especially games like warhammer which due to its many years of development suffers from "update creep" where mechanics added start to feel disjointed and each faction starts to feel like it's own particular set of mechanics completly disconnected from the game of the game.

Troy, as simple as it may seem on the surface, I think has a lot more depth than meets the eye precisely because of the attention to detail and comprehensive design where mechanics don't feel so isolated. I mean, at least not all of them, but this is because the core gameplay is super solid and permeates all factions. This strong gameplay core is enhanced by the great UI design that can be found in most areas of the game, at least for what a total war title can offer, as well as a TON of quality of life tidbits that really ease some of the frustration that sometimes comes from playing this kind of games.

My main praises are:

- Everything seems to fit together: Basically what I said before, it shows the dev team really thought this one out, because it's like they stripped the gameplay of total war down to the basics and then built from the ground up leaving the good parts working together.

- Well implemented narrative approach: I've always been a sandbox kind of guy, so I never really liked those scenario focused mini campaigns added to TW titles like Caesar in Gaul and at first I feared Troy was going to be like this. Fortunately, I was wrong, because the way the narrative is driven in this game is very well implemented with the grand campaign aspect. It doesn't really railroad the player too much which allows for sandbox gameplay that organically drives the player and, more importantly, keeps the focus and attention of the player in the late campaign.

- Diplomacy is a real game changer now: First of all, they added the vastly superior 3K diplomatic system which gets rid of the annoying ambiguous mechanics in previous titles where you could never really tell why or how much a faction likes you or dislikes you, or why an offer is rejected or accepted. Secondly, alliances, at least among factions of the same culture, are far more reliable which actually makes you want to play the diplomatic game rather than just ignore everything and betray everyone everytime (since they will do that to you anyway in previous games). The game may be called "Total War", but war is just diplomacy by different means. The only thing it's missing is the ancilliary trading system 3K had.

- More than a single resource: YES, THIS IS GOOD, I HOPE THEY KEEP DOING THIS. Adding more types of resources you can manage really opens up the game and tears down the boring and frustrating classic TW trade system. I would still add some sort of luxury good trading system, but I guess it's nice Sarpedon has something like it in a way. I really love how gold also ends up being far more valuable in late game due to mines getting exhausted. The only thing we need now is POPULATION.

- Combat -somehow- incredibly fun despite less "variety": Now, I'm one of those people that agree with some of the things said by angry youtubers about how the combat in older titles was much better and thought out, about the "weight" units had before, about single entity units, blah blah blah. Surprisingly, I have to admit Troy manages to, in it's own way, have great and, once again, cohesive and comprehensive mechanics that make every battle fun to play even if the unit selection, in strict terms, is far more restricted than in previous titles. They really did a good job making different types of infantry actually have very distinct roles, and the types of maps they game throws at you complement the unit dynamics.

- FANTASTIC art design, great UI and some seriously needed QoL improvements: Basically, the game looks gorgeous, it's easy to understand and has a ton of customizing settings to get rid of some of the hassle, especially in the late game (turn camera, notifications, etc). The only thing I would add is a way to signify factions wether you are or not interested in barter of x or y resource, because it's a pain in the ass when factions keep offering resources you obviously don't need.

The only things I would critizise would be the following:

- Factions are way too biased against the player in lower difficulties: This is more of a general total war issue, but the deal is since AI factions don't -really- have personal objectives (and if they do, they are mostly overriden by the bias), they tend to gang up on the player regardless of the situation. This isn't terrible when you're Hector or Paris, since the whole point is that you're being besieged (or even Agamemnon, since you are a powerful king and everyone is after your stuff), but it's very frustrating when you are playing as a minor faction and EVERYONE seems to be out to get you, especially for campaigns like Panthesilea's where you are a nomad and for some reason every single kingdom feels the need to conga line their way to your newly created hordes even if they live in the other side of the map and are being besieged by their OTHER enemies. I wouldn't mind this if it happened in the highest difficulties (since those are for masochists, obviously), but having everyone and their mother after you when you are playing on hard as Sarpedon is a bit too much.

- Trojans are a bit too aggresive: A similar point to the one above could be said about greek factions being attacked from turn 1 by trojan factions when the player is greek. It would be great if there was some sort of "peace treaty" period, say, until turn 10 or 20, where greek and trojan factions can't interact with each other, to force the AI to take care of their own side first before setting their sights on the other side of the aegean (the trojans shouldn't even invade greece until they are attacked first, honestly). That said, I do like how cohesive alliances feel in this game compared to previous titles and how you are even compelled to GIVE THEM TERRITORIES (which thankfully is a thing in this one too), which would be unthinkable in, say, rome 2 total war, where your own allies will backstab you for no reason and would be completly useless against your enemies.

- Some parts of the map feel claustrophobic: I am aware most of the important stuff happens in greece and western anatolia, but it would be great if we had some more parts of central anatolia and northern greece/macedonia. This is most notorious part on the north coast of the aegean where the territory is one region tall. That said, I'm not suggesting going full eastern mediterranean sea or anything (even though a proper bronze age total war map with egypt and everything would be great) because it's not bad to keep the focus on the trojan scenario, but a slight expansion would be welcome.

Lastly, the "historical" mode is completly tacked on and it's basically just a version of the game with less content and features, there's 0 added value. I get that they probably did it to appeal to the diehard historical fans, but you're not getting any of them on board with this, I can assure you. I love all TW titles and I bought this for the setting, but if I had bought this because of the historical mode I would feel ripped off.

Anyway, despite all of this, I honestly think this is one of the best Total War titles to date with the most cohesive mechanics since the old Rome and Medieval II titles, even surpassing them in some ways. I honestly hope it doesn't get abandoned too quickly and people can see its value beyond the awkward place it has in the (honestly tiresome at this point) HISTORY-FANTASY dychotomy total war seems to be immersed in.

I sincerely congratulate the Sofia team. It really shows they have great ideas and a strong focus on cohesive design to integrate them together, which, frankly, is something Total War has been in need for YEARS.

**PikeStance** · September 14, 2021, 03:36 AM

Originally Posted by Nack

- FANTASTIC art design, great UI and some seriously needed QoL improvements: Basically, the game looks gorgeous, it's easy to understand and has a ton of customizing settings to get rid of some of the hassle, especially in the late game (turn camera, notifications, etc). The only thing I would add is a way to signify factions wether you are or not interested in barter of x or y resource, because it's a pain in the ass when factions keep offering resources you obviously don't need.

The art work in everyone of titles are always well done. it is one the best things about the series.

Originally Posted by Nack

Anyway, despite all of this, I honestly think this is one of the best Total War titles to date with the most cohesive mechanics since the old Rome and Medieval II titles, even surpassing them in some ways. I honestly hope it doesn't get abandoned too quickly and people can see its value beyond the awkward place it has in the (honestly tiresome at this point) HISTORY-FANTASY dychotomy total war seems to be immersed in.

I sincerely congratulate the Sofia team. It really shows they have great ideas and a strong focus on cohesive design to integrate them together, which, frankly, is something Total War has been in need for YEARS.

I one of those people. The game will never appeal to me although I am fascinated by the time period. If they came up with a fleshed out historical part of the game, then I would consider it, but years after the release of 3K they haven't even fixed the poorly created "records" part of the game. The days of historical TW games are probably over. The writing was on the wall when we got 101 female generals in Rome II.

Personally, I liked how each game has its own nuance of mechanics. If they were all the same but in different time periods, it would be incredibly boring to play after awhile.