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Thread: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

  1. #1
    Abdülmecid I's Avatar ¡Ay Carmela!
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    Default Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    The Intercept has published a large number of leaked documents and conversations, which prove a massive conspiracy between Bolsonaro, the incumbent president of Brazil, and superior justice officials, including judges and prosecutors, such as Sérgio Moro, currently serving, after having been appointed by Bolsonaro, as the ''Super Justice Minister''. To give you the necessary background, according to the polls for the 2018 general elections, Lula, the candidate of the center-left Workers' Party was project to easily defeat his main opponent, Bolsonaro, the leader of the far-right Social Liberal Party, whose ideology varies from the endorsement of torture, sterilisation and murders to privatisation and an admiration for military juntas. However, Lula was later found guilty and imprisoned for his involvement in the Operation Car Wash, a scandal which mainly concerned cases of corruption and money laundering. As a result, he was banned from the elections and subsequently Bolsonaro prevailed over his considerably less charismatic successor, Fernando Haddad.



    However, as the leak revealed, the judges that examined the case were far from neutral observers, as demanded by the law and their ethical code. On the contrary, they openly communicate with Lula's enemies, in order to discuss how they will manipulate the procedure, in order to curtail Lula's chances of victory. They even admit that the evidence linking Lula to the scandal is rather flimsy and doubtful, but they still insist on plotting about how to harm Lula's popularity and convict him of corruption. The leading figure in all this is the aforementioned Sérgio Moro, who was obviously rewarded for his services by Bolsonaro, by being appointed to a newly created position, which allows him to excercise an unprecedented power in the country's judicial system.



    Personally, I was never very fond of Lula, because, despite the apparent collapse of his Car Wash charge, his government was indeed marked by embezzlement and corruption, while his achievements were essentially limited to verbal populism. On the other hand, the content of the leaked files is absolutely unacceptable and demonstrate, beyond any reasonable doubt, how casually the Brazilian elite can influence the result of both legislative and presidential elections, by orchestrating a nice, little conspiracy, in a cordial cooperation with a bloodthirsty army officer, who never even cared to hide his sympathy for fascism. In my opinion, the affair implies that, even after more than 30 years since the fall of the murderous junta, democracy in Brazil remains unfortunately quite fragile and extremely vulnerable to the unchecked and non-transparent power of the upper echelons of the Brazilian society and the administrative hierarchy.

  2. #2
    Carmen Sylva's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    It shows clearly, that corruption won't end with Bolsonaro, it will only getting worse, especially for the poor. In my opinion the Workers Party should now organize a general strike till Bolsonaro steps down and a new elections will come, as the justice system is broken and not neutral.
    Last edited by Carmen Sylva; June 13, 2019 at 08:27 AM.
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    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Lula left the office in 2011 with an 87% approval rating.Even after his imprisonment, Lula lead in every major election poll until he was barred from the electoral race.

    Brazil court dodges debate on Lula's release, days after ... - MSN.com
    Brazil's Supreme Court on Tuesday unexpectedly avoided debating a request for the early release of leftist icon Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva.The court had placed this issue on its docket, but after four hours the five judges retired without addressing it...they scheduled debate on another Lula appeal -- seeking the annulment of his conviction on grounds that Moro is biased, for June 25. Lula, who led Brazil through a historic boom from 2003 to 2010, earning him the gratitude of millions of Brazilians for redistributing wealth to haul them out of poverty
    June 25.Let's wait and see.
    -----
    Fresh news,
    Moro's moral and judicial duplicity, "we can't offend someone who's support is so important" “Podemos tirar…”: Lava Jato's protection of Fernando Henrique Cardoso

    In its latest leak of conversations between Moro and the Lava Jato task force, the Intercept reveals that they pretended to investigate ex-President Fernando Henrique Cardoso, while ignoring evidence that his own foundation collected illegal donations from Odebrecht subsidiary Braskem.
    Referring to Cardoso (FHC) Sérgio Moro said in the leaked conversations, “we can’t offend someone who’s support is so important.
    In addition, Sérgio Moro’s wife Rosangela used to work for Flavio Arns, a high ranking member of Fernando Henrique Cardoso’s PSDB party in Paraná.
    Intercept. Detailed, exhaustive report.In Portuguese, Lava Jato fingiu investigar Fernando Henrique ... - The Intercept

    Last edited by Ludicus; June 19, 2019 at 03:45 PM.
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    This is nasty if true. Greenwald is American btw, and linked to Snowden, to the unaware. He has all the credibility in the world.


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    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    The Intercept showed us how lawfare and political justice -expression used by Kirchheimer to describe the use of legal procedure for political ends- became political weapons.
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    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Like Venezuela and Hungary it looks like Brazil is going the way of politically partial crony courts.

    Are young democracies just more susceptible to corruption or is it something else?
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Like Venezuela and Hungary it looks like Brazil is going the way of politically partial crony courts.

    Are young democracies just more susceptible to corruption or is it something else?
    Democraty lives not only from its constitution and its laws, the unwritten Laws and the political culture of a Country are the things that keep government running and the democracy alive.
    A good examble would be, if in the German Government would ignore Decisions of our High Court (Bundesverfassungsgericht).

    Young Democracies regularly don`t have this policitical culture, their populace has most times not really learned, what "makes" democracy. Furthermore there need to be enought civil Servants that indentify with the system and have to be resistent against corruption.

    But its a everydays struggle, even old Democracies can erode, see USA.

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    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Are young democracies just more susceptible to corruption or is it something else?
    In Major "Blow" To Bolsonaro, 39 Kilos Of Coke Seized On Brazil's Presidential Plane

    A Brazilian Air Force pilot, who was one of the crew members on their way to serve as the advance guard for Brazil president Bolsonaro during the forthcoming G20 summit in Osaka, was arrested during a stopover in Seville en route to Japan after Spanish customs officers discovered enough cocaine on him in to fuel a small Wall Street bank's party for a month

    -------
    Well, it's not so young. Brazil’s first democratic form of government came in 1889, but the military coup in 1964 suspended democracy in Brazil. In part, it's the historical legacy and here are some causes: the council of Trent, absolutism and conquest. But, to be fair, they aren't the whole explanation. Antero de Quental in his 1871 famous lecture Causes of the Decadence of the Peninsular Peoples in the Last Three Centuries sketches the history of the Iberian peoples after the Counter reformation, and identifies the moral, economic and economic causes of the Iberian decline.
    "Thus, while other nations rose, we fell. They rose because of their modern virtues; we fell because of our ancient vices, concentrated, developed and applied in the most extreme manner"
    Last edited by Ludicus; June 27, 2019 at 02:38 PM.
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Quote Originally Posted by Morifea View Post
    Democraty lives not only from its constitution and its laws, the unwritten Laws and the political culture of a Country are the things that keep government running and the democracy alive.
    A good examble would be, if in the German Government would ignore Decisions of our High Court (Bundesverfassungsgericht).

    Young Democracies regularly don`t have this policitical culture, their populace has most times not really learned, what "makes" democracy. Furthermore there need to be enought civil Servants that indentify with the system and have to be resistent against corruption.

    But its a everydays struggle, even old Democracies can erode, see USA.
    Meh, "political culture" is a non-entity. For example here in Canada, we have more of that "culture" then any other Western country, but our current government under Trudeau (who got into power via retarded first-past-the-post system and gerrymandering) is more authoritarian and corrupt then in Brazil. At least Bolsonaro, as corrupt as he is, doesn't want to disarm his people or violate their freedom of speech or sell weapons to backwards barbaric countries like Saudi Arabia. Then we have relatively young democracies like Hungary or Poland, where political freedoms are respected, but then we have "old democracy" in UK, which is now de-facto an authoritarian state where regime can jail people for social media posts.

  10. #10
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    Canada, is more authoritarian and corrupt then in Brazil.
    No, it's not.Canada is the 9 least corrupt nation out of 175 countries, according to the 2018 Corruption Perceptions Index reported by Transparency International

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    Hungary...political freedoms are respected
    No, political freedoms are not respected in illiberal, semi-authoritarian Hungary.

    Media freedom in Hungary is no more - ECPMF
    In an unprecedented concerted action pro-Orbán media owners 'donated' their news channels, internet news portals, tabloids and sports newspapers, several radio stations, numerous magazines and all of Hungary’s county newspapers, to a newly formed media conglomerate equipped with immense resources. It goes by the name Central European Press and Media Foundation and is headed by Orbán supporter and media owner Gábor Liszkay.
    ... which results in total control over the right-wing media close to the government while any of the few independent media that is left, are already starved of advertisement budgets.
    Hungary is now a "partly free" country, becoming the first country in the EU that is not currently classified as "Free" -Freedom in the World 2019 | Hungary Country Report

    How Viktor Orban degraded Hungary's weak democracy
    Democracy Besieged, Illiberalism Entrenched - Visegrad Insight
    Explaining Eastern Europe: Orbán's Laboratory of Illiberalism | Journal of Democracy...
    How Hungary's Viktor Orbán destroyed democracy, and what it means ...
    Modern Authoritarianism: Illiberal Democracies | Freedom House
    ---
    "Illiberal Democracy" or "Majoritarian Authoritarianism"?
    the illiberal democracy is in practice a smokescreen that conceals the shift towards a “majority authoritarianism”, the characteristics of which are increasingly clear: the desire of authoritarian leaders to avoid their power being questioned, a tight control of politics by reducing the uncertainty of electoral competition, the weakening of opposition forces so as to control the State apparatus more effectively, intervention in the media to control information and communication and the reduction of academic freedom. It is then possible to question the alleged democratic nature of populist and illiberal authoritarianism which is basically characterised by “anti-pluralism”. The populist criticism of the elites systematically comes with the claim to have the monopoly of the expression of the “real” people’s will, and yet citizens’ freedom requires that they are not held hostage before it is expressed and democracy implies the pluralism at the centre of political liberalism.
    The cover page of Freedom of the World 2019 - Freedom in the World 2019 - Freedom House.




    --
    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    ...But, to be fair, they aren't the whole explanation.
    In fact, I would like to add,political heritage doesn't explain everything.Timor East is considered the most democratic country in Southeast Asia. Cape Vert is the most democratic nation in Africa. With 90 points on a scale of 100, Cabo Verde is in the same position as France, leading its continent.
    Cause to Celebrate Democracy in Southeast Asia - Atlantic Council
    freedom house ranks cabo verde as africa's most democratic country
    Last edited by Ludicus; July 01, 2019 at 09:47 AM.
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  11. #11

    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    No, it's not.Canada is the 9 least corrupt nation out of 175 countries, according to the 2018 Corruption Perceptions Index reported by Transparency International
    Situation is quite different, especially on higher levels. The whole SNC-Lavalin thing, for example, seems to be much worse then anything Bolsonaro did so far, and its just the tip of the iceberg. Not to mention that "transparency international"
    is run straight from... Merkel's Germany. And both treasonous globalists like Merkel and Trudeau tend to sympathize with each other.
    No, political freedoms are not respected in illiberal, semi-authoritarian Hungary.
    It is more democratic and free if compared to places like UK or Germany. I mean I'm not sure if they are just as free as US is (in terms of most important freedoms of free speech and ability to own firearms), but we don't hear about people getting arrested in Hungary for posts on social media.

  12. #12
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Bolsonaro hates everything that is left, and thinks they should be eliminated (I wonder how many of you agree with him?...)
    Nowadays, Brazilians don't give much credit to democratic institutions. No other Latin American nation showed less support for democracy, according to the Latinobarometro. Just (+-) 32% agreed when Latinobarómetro asked if they agreed that "democracy may have problems but is the best system of government".
    In the year of our Lord 2018, the Annus Horribilis,






    ---Edit,

    Edit.
    Look at the graph. Let's go back to the year 2001, another Annus Horribilis. In that year, the average number of children dying in Brazil each day was 300.


    So, a proposal for a food security policy for Brazil was launched in October 2001 by the then Presidential candidate Lula. Launched in 2003 with the goal to eradicate hungerand extreme poverty, and featured radical measures in regard to agriculture, and schools, as well as support to the poorest families, with special attention to children. Among the outcomes: Brazil was able to reignite its economy, and has become a point of reference in the field worldwide. Read attentively, The Fome Zero (Zero Hunger Program) : The Brazilian experience - FAO
    -----
    Food for thought.
    1) The prosecutors knew their case against Lula was not strong. Read below.
    2)There's also clear evidence that Moro committed serious ethical violations in sending private messages to prosecutors.This does indeed look like collusion. According to the Brazilian Code of Criminal Procedure it's quite clear in its 254º article:
    The judge must declare himself suspect [to judge the case], and if he does not so, he may be refused by any party:
    (...) IV – if he has advised any party
    Quoting the Intercept,
    After the guilty verdict from Moro was quickly affirmed by an appellate court, Lula’s candidacy was barred by law. With Lula out of the running, the far-right candidate Jair Bolsonaro shot up in the polls... Bolsonaro then named Moro, the judge who had presided over the case against Lula, to be his justice minister.
    Telegram messages between Sergio Moro and Deltan Dallagnol reveal that Moro repeatedly stepped far outside the permissible bounds of his position as a judge while working on Car Wash cases...
    In a now infamous moment, Dallagnol presented a typo-laden PowerPoint presentation



    .... that showed “Lula” written in a blue bubble surrounded by 14 other bubbles containing everything from “Lula’s reaction” and “expressiveness” to “illicit enrichment” and “bribeocracy.” All arrows pointed back to Lula, whom they characterized as the mastermind behind a sprawling criminal enterprise. The presentation was widely spoofed and criticized by critics as evidence of the weakness of the Car Wash prosecutors’ case.

    Two days later, Dallagnol messaged Moro and, in private, explained that they went to great lengths to characterize Lula as the “maximum leader” of the corruption scheme as a way to link the politician to the R$87 million (US$26.7 million, at the time) paid in bribes by OAS for contracts at two Petrobras refineries — a charge without material evidence, he admitted, but one that was essential so that the case could be tried under Moro’s jurisdiction in Curitiba.

    The indictment is based on a lot of indirect evidence of authorship, but it wouldn’t fit to say that in the indictment and in our communications we avoided that point,” Dallagnol wrote. “It was not understood that the long exposition on command of the scheme was necessary to impute corruption to the former president. A lot of people did not understand why we put him as the leader to gain 3,7MM in money laundering, when it was not for that, but to impute 87MM of corruption.”

    Moro responded two days later: “Definitely, the criticisms of your presentation are disproportionate. Stand firm.”

    Even Lula’s most vehement critics, including those who believe him to be corrupt, have expressed doubts about the strength of this particular conviction. Many have argued that it was chosen as the first case because it was simple enough to process quickly, in time to fulfill the real goal: to bar Lula from being re-elected.
    Last edited by Ludicus; July 02, 2019 at 11:20 AM.
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    Settra's Avatar the Imperishable
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    The social-liberal party is not a far right concept. It is Darth Vader Marry Poppins, Voldemort Spiderman or Thanos Sailor Moon. It is a gorilla with swan's feet imported from Romania and the Balkans. A pseudo-socialist party with liberal policies designed to harbor the corrupt and legitimize their actions.

    Putting it on the eco-political axes is just plain wrong.
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  14. #14
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Quote Originally Posted by Settra View Post
    It is Darth Vader Marry Poppins, Voldemort Spiderman or Thanos Sailor Moon.
    Bolsonaro, I presume. Wilderness to wildest dreams: the remarkable rise of Bolsonaro's Social Liberal Party in Brazil

    Last edited by Ludicus; July 02, 2019 at 12:45 PM.
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  15. #15

    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Situation in Brazil doesn't seem as bad as in Canada, UK, France or Germany. I mean a degree of corruption comes with the territory, to a certain degree. I would say Bolsonaro was the lesser evil in the elections.

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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    I'm not surprised. News for our far right wing residents, enemies of liberal democracies, lovers of illiberal regimes and right wing autocracies. Rejoice.
    Bolsonaro' son questions the value of democracy, In Brazil, President's Son Questions Democracy - The New York
    The transformation that Brazil wants will not happen at the speed we are aiming for in democratic ways
    ----
    Meanwhile, the fascistoid President of Brazil, Pinochet apologist, taunts UN rights chief over her father's torture by Pinochet
    "She is defending the human rights of vagabonds"
    Bachelet’s father, Alberto, an air force general, was imprisoned and tortured for opposing the 1973 military coup led by Augusto Pinochet, and died of a heart attack in prison. In 2014, two retired Chilean military officers were handed prison sentences for torturing him. Bachelet and her mother, Ángela Jeria, were also imprisoned.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    Situation in Brazil doesn't seem as bad as in Canada, UK, France or Germany.
    You are literally just saying you (personally) like the Brazilian government more than the governments of Canada, UK, France, or Germany. Gee, I wonder why that would be?
    They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more.

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    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    The Messiah Bolsonaro in all its splendor,
    An evangelical Bishop consecrates Bolsonaro with the Spirit of God, and asks the Lord to annihilate his enemies. It is not necessary to understand a single word, just watch. The Temple, a a $200m (£130m) replica of Solomon’s temple, took four years to construct.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 






    So, who is this billionaire Bishop ?
    The Bishop, the Virgin and the cocaine cartel | The Independent
    Brazil charges church leaders with embezzling ... - The Guardian
    11 days in jail in 1992, and that's it...
    Last edited by Ludicus; September 14, 2019 at 11:00 AM.
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  19. #19
    irontaino's Avatar Deadass B
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    Not surprised evangelicals worship him.
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  20. #20
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    Default Re: Brazil: Leaked Documents about Car Wash

    @Ludicus: As a proud Catholic I´m disgusted by this.

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