Populist Coalition Government in Italy broken

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

The populist coalition government in Italy is broken.

Salvini's Lega is trying to initiate a VONC against the current Prime Minister Conte to get a snap election in October, as current opinion polls see the Lega at 36 - 38 %.

So Mr. Salvini is putting all in to become the new Prime Minister of Italy.

But this time he seems to overstrike his cards, as his former coalition partner M5S and center left PD are having talks to form a new coalition to prevent a government with Salvini and probably the neofacistic party "Fratelli de Italia" of the Duce Grand Grandson Caio Giulio Cesare Mussolini.

https://www.dw.com/en/italys-salvini...ans/a-49989563

In Policoro, South Italy protestors are "greeting" Salvini with singing "Bella Ciao", an old italian WW II partisan song.

https://video.repubblica.it/politica...015?refresh_ce

The beginning of the fall of Mr. Salvini?

[Altzek]

Between a "democratic" Lega-FdI government that would butcher our tax system, raise VAT, possibly weaken the very state's central authority to the benefit of those guys in Brussels who would bypass it to deal directly with our regions and eventually destroy what remains of our welfare state to cover the losses deriving from the tax reform and an essentially technocratic M5S-Dem one I really don't know what's worse, but then again I can only blame the opportunistic for placing us before this situation. I hope the Democratic Party follows the general secretary's lead and doesn't come up with any inciucio with the M5S, sidelining Renzi's faction, but that would force us into a solidly right wing government so I really don't know.



That's a shame, I was really looking forward to seeing this government reach the end of its mandate without too many obstacles. It was far from perfect, I mean I really disliked it, but I didn't hate it as much as the choices we have now. Meloni and the Democratic Party in particular are two elements of our national politics that I absolutely despise with every fiber of my being.

[Heathen Hammer]

Salvini was already a Prime Minister in all, but name. Gotta admit, as someone whose country's prime minister is a globalist imbecile, I'm kind of jelly of Italians. Wish we had someone like Salvini here in Canada.

[Bob69Joe]

Instead, you get Canadians in Canada. :p

[mongrel]

Instead, you get Canadians in Canada. :p

HH wanted a migrant to run Canada? Oh the humanity?

[Cyclops]

HH wanted a migrant to run Canada? Oh the humanity?

MudPit bingo if you can get him to type "he would be a Great Replacement for Trudeau".

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

M5S and PD have agreed on a new coalition with Conte as PM.

If the italian President Conte agrees, what's high probably, Salvini has toppled himself out of the power. Good move. Game over.

[Morifea]

Well, game over methinks not, but Salvini played his hand badly.
His move came to early.

[Mithradates]

Could be game over for Salvini IF the new government would succeed, but the reality is that the M5S and the PD are political enemies, and the M5S-PD government simply wont work and will collapse.
Salvini, now in opposition, cant be held responsible for the governments failures anymore. Every day in opposition will just strengthen him.

[Diocle]

This will give Matteo Salvini the 40 - 45% of the votes in the next election.

This laughable government is the definitive coronation ceremony for Matteo Salvini, the Captain!

Congrats and thanks, also by part of Matteo Salvini, to the Italian Leftists for their smart sense of strategy and tactics!

[Abdülmecid I]

Conte's new mandate has been confirmed by the presidential secretary, following his meeting with Mattarella in the Quirinial Palace. Quite an anticlimactic end for the European Donald. He apparently excels in populist rhetoric, but really fails at political scheming. He was amateurishly exposed in the Moscopoli scandal and he now lost his governmentg position in a political manoeuvre that he himself initiated, in order to increase his power. The post-war history of the Italian right reminds me of Marx' sarcastic quote about the Napoleonic dynasty in France. What began with the Machiavelian figure of Giulio Andreotti (thrice Prime-Minister and leader of ten different Ministries, several of them twice) has ended with Salvini's suicidal plotting...

Could be game over for Salvini IF the new government would succeed, but the reality is that the M5S and the PD are political enemies, and the M5S-PD government simply wont work and will collapse.

The differences between Italy's three major parties are rather superficial and only limited to verbalisms. Given the fact that the popularity of Lega Nord remains strong and is projected to further increase with them in the opposition, the survival instict of the coalition will encourage them to stay united. Unless a major crisis occur, such as the necessity to impose a wave of austerity measures, due to the country's overwhelming debt, the alliance will probably maintained, until the next elections. Lega Nord will presumably win them decisively, but considering Salvini's dismal performance, I doubt he will be allowed to rule the formation.

[Gongo80]

speaking as italian, this was one of the worst period of our history (and we had mussolini few time ago :-D)
I wanted salvini to face the economical law, but the strategy of pd-m5s was not bad...they "deflated" salvini that now has problems in his party

this year (but even with the previous govermnent with renzi and gentiloni) costed the life of hundred of people, dead in the see.
again, as italian, i'm so ashamed about that , in new forums i sign up as german

[Diocle]

speaking as italian, this was one of the worst period of our history (and we had mussolini few time ago :-D)
I wanted salvini to face the economical law, but the strategy of pd-m5s was not bad...they "deflated" salvini that now has problems in his party

this year (but even with the previous govermnent with renzi and gentiloni) costed the life of hundred of people, dead in the see.

Think that, as Northern Italian and Ligurian (well, living in Piedmont, now I should be Piedmontese, but .. actually I will be Genoese until death), just considering what happened in our Mediterranean waters, I'm very proud of having voted Matteo Salvini in any election of the last years.

My only concern is this: will be Salvini up to the role Italy is about to give him? Is he ready for an electoral mandate of 40/45%, or even more, that he's about to get from Italian people in the next election? I've few (but deep) doubts about the real character's strength of Matteo, but .. seen his adversaries .. his way doesn't seem so hard. Vai Capitano! Sei tutti noi!
This is Matteo after the meeting with Mattarella (the president of the republic .. ), sorry but there's not English translation, so I put the video under spoiler, if you understand Italian , good for you, .. if you don't, then please .. don't open the spoiler:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

.. in new forums i sign up as german

Bravo! At least you have not chosen to be pseudo-French! .. this is good, especially in this repellent Macronian age!"Sursum corda", .. Gongo!
Don't worry, you are in the most perfect Italian tradition, as they say our ancestors: "Franza o Spagna, basta che se magna!"

[Alastor]

Well Salvini seems to have overplayed his greedy little hand and instead of getting the elections and PM seat he seems to have wanted, he is instead out of government. On the other hand being now in opposition, he has free reign to blame and admonish his opponents for failing to fix the mess that is Italy. Strengthening him for the next elections whenever those are. Until he can win, botch Italy even further and of course backtrack on his promises, like all good politicians, and people finally wake up to what he is and vote him down next time, so the cycle can continue.

[Muizer]

This will give Matteo Salvini the 40 - 45% of the votes in the next election.

This laughable government is the definitive coronation ceremony for Matteo Salvini, the Captain!

Congrats and thanks, also by part of Matteo Salvini, to the Italian Leftists for their smart sense of strategy and tactics!

It seems a desperate move to me, but an understandable one if the choice is between 'definitely lose now' and 'very probably lose later'. IMHO the only thing for them to bank on is that politics can be unpredictable and that during the year's delay or so until the next elections something will happen to trip up Salvini.


As for your pride in Slavini's role in Mediterranean migration, I'd be curious to know why that is, so I've tried to come up with some reasons in cumulative order of impact. Perhaps you can pick one that applies to you, or provide an alternative. Not trying a cheap debate trick here, I won't call you to substantiate any of these. I just want to know what your perception is. What is 'enough' to make you feel proud.

Is it because Salvini

1) has been saying and doing things you personally feel are righteous,
2) created a political climate necessary to address migration issues in the future
3) substantially stopped migration issues in Italy getting worse than they otherwise would have been,
4) succeeded in reversing the negative impact of migration on Italian society

[Diocle]

It seems a desperate move to me, but an understandable one if the choice is between 'definitely lose now' and 'very probably lose later'. IMHO the only thing for them to bank on is that politics can be unpredictable and that during the year's delay or so until the next elections something will happen to trip up Salvini.

This is what I'd call Alesia Syndrome. They have decided to shut themselves up in the fortress of Government, as Vercingetorix did in Alesia, in the hope of getting reinforcements and help from outside the walls, but doing this, they just leave Salvini free to move and do whatever he likes in Italian territories, regions and towns, without being able to counter maneuver against him.

The hope in some kind of disenchantment or disaffection by people is really a foolish dream (possibly the last foolish dream of Italian Left), Salvini is now, more than ever, citizen among citizens, victim among victims of Italian/European bureaucrats and deep state! I've never seen (and please notice I'm not young) such a relationship between common people and a politician. Watch this video, watch the hands of the crowd on his face, watch the hugs, the kisses, the almost physical passion between Matteo Salvini and the crowd; it was two days ago, in one of the infinite towns of this country, among common citizens feeling once again betrayed by their ruling class, composed by an infinite and astonishing amount of self-replacing Badoglio:

As for your pride in Slavini's role in Mediterranean migration, I'd be curious to know why that is, so I've tried to come up with some reasons in cumulative order of impact. Perhaps you can pick one that applies to you, or provide an alternative. Not trying a cheap debate trick here, I won't call you to substantiate any of these. I just want to know what your perception is. What is 'enough' to make you feel proud.

Is it because Salvini

1) has been saying and doing things you personally feel are righteous,
2) created a political climate necessary to address migration issues in the future
3) substantially stopped migration issues in Italy getting worse than they otherwise would have been,
4) succeeded in reversing the negative impact of migration on Italian society

I'd choose point 3), but to be honest, actually I don't know if I can state that I'm proud of Salvini, what I feel it's that he has successfully tried to stop the horde of 250'000 illegal immigrants yearly coming to the shores of this country from Africa, doing this, he did exactly what people was asking for.
Italians are not against immigrants, Italians are against invasions. I'm talking of six millions immigrants in the last ten years, the 10% of Italian population! This is madness!

Do you understand? For Italian people Salvini, almost alone, is fighting against international elites' madness and its minion, the horror.

[Muizer]

I'd choose point 3), but to be honest, actually I don't know if I can state that I'm proud of Salvini, what I feel it's that he has successfully tried to stop the horde of 250'000 illegal immigrants yearly coming to the shores of this country from Africa, doing this, he did exactly what people was asking for.
Italians are not against immigrants, Italians are against invasions. I'm talking of six millions immigrants in the last ten years, the 10% of Italian population! This is madness!

Do you understand? For Italian people Salvini, almost alone, is fighting against international elites' madness and its minion, the horror.

What I do see is that anti-immigration movements all over Europe are causing its national governments to refuse to help out those countries, mainly Italy and Greece, that bear the brunt of the cross-mediterranean immigration. Salvini's ideological brethren are quite happy to have to say 'your shores, your problem, we keep our own borders closed'.

[Diocle]

What I do see is that anti-immigration movements all over Europe are causing its national governments to refuse to help out those countries, mainly Italy and Greece, that bear the brunt of the cross-mediterranean immigration. Salvini's ideological brethren are quite happy to have to say 'your shores, your problem, we keep our own borders closed'.

I think the anti-immigration movements are saying to Italy: if you want to stop them we support you, if you ask us to take care of the millions illegal (this is the key word) immigrants reaching your shores, then, .. no, we won't help you. This is almost the same thing Salvini and Meloni are saying because defending Italian shores is also the only way to prevent millions Africans to reach Europe.

Salvini, yesterday in Montecitorio square, before Parliament Palace:



The media say that he's losing support among people and that he's a defeated leader .. well, if this is a defeated leader (35% in the polls), then, after half a century, I've to say that I didn't understand anything about what politics is and means.